emerge doom3 - illegal?

Message

jspr · Post by **jspr** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 8:58 am

http://zerowing.idsoftware.com/linux/do ... 26a21bbbea

Does that mean the doom3 ebuild is illegal?

z3ro · Post by **z3ro** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 9:19 am

Gentoo is not repackaging it though, the ebuild is a wrapper for the installer.

mrchaotica · Post by **mrchaotica** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 9:27 am

IANAL, but it sounds like bullshit to me. I would think that just repackaging the installer into an ebuild would be modification for the purpose of interoperability which is (or should be, at least) Fair Use.

Don't go around taunting id based on my opinion, though!

Archangel1 · Post by **Archangel1** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 10:19 am

One would hope so... id have been pretty resonable in the past. The ebuild is very specific about making the user agree to the license.
Interestingly it doesn't ask for a CD key - the ebuild obviously won't, but the binary's not bothered anywhere either.

And it does say you can't redistribute the games in a "modified form". Well it's not modified, it's the same file from their ftp server, down to the md5 digest.

PZoned · Post by **PZoned** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 12:03 pm

I think that they are mainly refering to the Loki installers etc... im accually very surprised that ID did not make a loki installer seeing that games like Quake3 are distributed in a loki installer.... but maybe ID has beef with Ebuilds too. e.g. Someone made a ventrillo installer for linux that included a bunch of modifyed wine configs and a few files.... even though he did not change anything from the accual program, the makers of ventrilo insisted that he took down the installer as he was re-distributing the program...

blueworm · Post by **blueworm** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 12:13 pm

IIRC gentoo had to take down all the IDsoftware ebuilds a little over a year ago due to some sort of misunderstanding. As they are back again I imagine that somesort of agreement has been achieved with IDsoftware regarding the EULA.

deathdruid · Post by **deathdruid** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 2:37 pm

Archangel1 wrote: Interestingly it doesn't ask for a CD key - the ebuild obviously won't, but the binary's not bothered anywhere either.

I was asked for my CD key when I tried playing the multiplayer part of the game.

ConVicTioN · Post by **ConVicTioN** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 5:06 pm

I installed Full game install from ids installer. All I need was the .pak files. Single player nix did not ask for cdkey at all. Multi does I did not use a ebuild . It was straight from ids ftp. Why put out a demo if this is the case.

PZoned · Post by **PZoned** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 6:13 pm

because you still need the .pak files.....

floam · Post by **floam** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 8:18 pm

ID has asked Gentoo many times not to make ebuilds for their games. This was the same problem with RTCW and ET, yet the Gentoo team continues. It may not be illegal, but it's pretty rude.

NME · Post by **NME** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 10:17 pm

i see little difference between sh ./doom3-demo.sh and emerge doom3-demo

i will see the EULA anyway.... only thing i can imagine is that it puts some strain on their ftp servers oslt

Skrot · Post by **Skrot** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 12:21 am

PZoned wrote:I think that they are mainly refering to the Loki installers etc... im accually very surprised that ID did not make a loki installer seeing that games like Quake3 are distributed in a loki installer

I believe that TTimo said that it actually is a loki installer program. Im just guessing its not using the regular GUI...

John5788 · Post by **John5788** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 5:08 am

ConVicTioN wrote:I installed Full game install from ids installer. All I need was the .pak files. Single player nix did not ask for cdkey at all. Multi does I did not use a ebuild . It was straight from ids ftp. Why put out a demo if this is the case.

u can copy all the files off the cds onto a windows os and run the game. ull still be able to play single w/out a cdkey but if u try multi, itll ask for the key

mrchaotica · Post by **mrchaotica** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 10:47 am

floam wrote:ID has asked Gentoo many times not to make ebuilds for their games. This was the same problem with RTCW and ET, yet the Gentoo team continues. It may not be illegal, but it's pretty rude.

I think it's more rude of them to presume to tell us to install their software manually as if they're special or something. I want "emerge -u world" to update everything -- I don't have time to babysit individual pieces of software!

Besides, short of copyright infringement they have no right to tell me how to use software that's rightfully mine, EULA be damned!

[Sorry for the forceful response, but you struck a nerve.]

ConVicTioN · Post by **ConVicTioN** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 3:10 pm

Single player in windows you need to have the cd in the cdrom0 to play. Nix you dont.

ConVicTioN · Post by **ConVicTioN** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 3:39 pm

One of the reasons I did not switch from debian to gentoo untill now is because how they mod installs. I love gentoo its the best distro. The whole cedega thing left me with a bad taste in my mouth. It just started to show install EULAs for none GNU apps. As far as the ebuild I would not use it until ID gives the aok. I would like to think that gentoo would not let any ebuild into portage until its oked buy the software maker. GNU software dont matter but Licence apps do cedega/doom. We know better tho dont we

. I may have been the only linux user to actually buy loki games

.

Desti² · Post by **Desti²** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 4:00 pm

ConVicTioN wrote:Single player in windows you need to have the cd in the cdrom0 to play. Nix you dont.

90% of the Windows users have no_cd crackz.

ConVicTioN · Post by **ConVicTioN** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 4:02 pm

Yea and 40% of them dl Doom3 off of bittorrent does that make it legal? Lets not forget doom was one of the first opensource apps. ID has always made a native client for the nix community. One app i have to manage out side of portage until id gives the a ok is not much to ask. I would like to think that the author of the ebuild got the ok. It really dont matter since its just a wrapper not a modded installer.

floam · Post by **floam** » Sun Oct 10, 2004 7:48 pm

mrchaotica wrote:Besides, short of copyright infringement they have no right to tell me how to use software that's rightfully mine, EULA be damned!

[Sorry for the forceful response, but you struck a nerve.]

Well, yes they do. The software isn't yours, it's theirs. You buy a license to use it.

If you use emerge to install Doom 3, you obviously can't expect to get support from them, same thing with UT2004 and the things that are broke by using emerge for it.

deathdruid · Post by **deathdruid** » Wed Oct 13, 2004 6:04 pm

floam wrote: If you use emerge to install Doom 3, you obviously can't expect to get support from them, same thing with UT2004 and the things that are broke by using emerge for it.

Fair enough. But there is a whole world of difference between id telling me that emerge installs are not supported and that they are illegal.

Thalion · Post by **Thalion** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:06 am

floam wrote:ID has asked Gentoo many times not to make ebuilds for their games. This was the same problem with RTCW and ET, yet the Gentoo team continues. It may not be illegal, but it's pretty rude.

This is very interesting. Are there any links to relevant discussions on the Net somewhere?

Thalion · Post by **Thalion** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:09 am

[quote="ConVicTioN" As far as the ebuild I would not use it until ID gives the aok.[/quote]

You do realise you have some rights as a customer which no EULA can take away? Do you seriously think that if Carmack says it's illegal to install game by any means other than using their installer - including, for example, simply extracting and copying the files from the CD - it suddenly becomes illegal? And what is ebuild if not just a script which does exactly that?

grover · Post by **grover** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:45 am

Thalion wrote:
floam wrote:ID has asked Gentoo many times not to make ebuilds for their games. This was the same problem with RTCW and ET, yet the Gentoo team continues. It may not be illegal, but it's pretty rude.
This is very interesting. Are there any links to relevant discussions on the Net somewhere?

http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28707

Basically an ID developer made a post on a messageboard saying that Gentoo was breaking the EULA by not making the user agree to the licence before installing. This was changed and everyone was happy. No idea what floam is going on about. That was the only complaint ID software made and they made it on some random message board not to Gentoo.

floam · Post by **floam** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 5:54 am

Everyone is happy? I'd try asking the guy (Timothee Besset) who ported it and gets all the complaints when stuff doesn't work and see what he thinks.

Similar things have happened with the Gentoo team and Cedega.

deathdruid · Post by **deathdruid** » Mon Oct 18, 2004 4:21 am

Again, support and legality are two different issues. I do not expect id to support my doom 3 install done using the ebuild, unless I can reproduce the same issues with the non-ebuild install. The Cedega situation was different; Transgaming felt it was too easy for non-subscribers to get winex-cvs. That was not a support issue at all.

OTOH, I think Gentoo is being seriously hurt by users filing upstream bugs/asking for support from upstream developers, before first making sure it is not a gentoo-specific bug. We have seen this with gaim and mplayer (well mplayer devs have issues with every distro), among others.