KDE 4 in gentoo portage?

Message

furanku · Post by **furanku** » Thu Jan 10, 2008 6:23 pm

i92guboj wrote:Maybe I just lack the poetic skills or my English is not good enough to paint this or that shade on the picture of the words.

Or, more probable, it's my English (or the lack of it) that caused the misinterptetion, sorry! Well, we still have different views wether KDE4.0 should go into testing (maybe masked), but as I'm no dev I still agree on the old basic principle: He who codes, decides.

djdunn · Post by **djdunn** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 4:45 am

personally i think it a bad idea to even attempt to put it in portage, it would take a massive amount of work to even attempt to even keep up with trying to keep the ebuilds up to date.

Urban Cowboy · Post by **Urban Cowboy** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 4:55 am

djdunn wrote:personally i think it a bad idea to even attempt to put it in portage, it would take a massive amount of work to even attempt to even keep up with trying to keep the ebuilds up to date.

How is the different from older versions of KDE or upcoming releases of other desktop environments?

energyman76b · Post by **energyman76b** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 9:50 am

djdunn wrote:personally i think it a bad idea to even attempt to put it in portage, it would take a massive amount of work to even attempt to even keep up with trying to keep the ebuilds up to date.

and that is different from gnome in which way?

oh - and if we talk about broken stuff in testing - how about a X version with broken keyboard support (no caps lock/num lock/scroll lock) lights?

What about masking?

Well, it doesn't really matter. I have installed kde without ebuilds in the past (oh, the merry slackware days) and I certainly can do it again if I want to

Bowyakka · Post by **Bowyakka** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 11:28 am

djdunn wrote:personally i think it a bad idea to even attempt to put it in portage, it would take a massive amount of work to even attempt to even keep up with trying to keep the ebuilds up to date.

Huh ?
Whats wrong with the ~x86 (and friends) mask ?

Ray ishido · Post by **Ray ishido** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 11:33 am

hi all!

+1 with energyman76b. New versions of gnome appears very soon in portage. Of course they are masked, and it take several month until the reach the unstable branch (which is a good thing). Even E17 which sources are on an svn and moves very fast, are (were?) masked.It may be a good idea to do the same thing with kde4.
Now whatever the devs decides, I am sure it will be a wise decision and I will be very gratful for their hard work.

DrAgOnTuX · Post by **DrAgOnTuX** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 11:56 am

Ray ishido wrote:hi all!

+1 with energyman76b. New versions of gnome appears very soon in portage. Of course they are masked, and it take several month until the reach the unstable branch (which is a good thing). Even E17 which sources are on an svn and moves very fast, are (were?) masked.It may be a good idea to do the same thing with kde4.
Now whatever the devs decides, I am sure it will be a wise decision and I will be very gratful for their hard work.

/fullack

cogent · Post by **cogent** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 11:58 am

-I am not a dev- but it seems that the devs have already decided. From what I assume, KDE4 will appear in portage starting with 4.1 . If anyone wants to use it earlier they will have to use the overlay (or at least that will be the least painful solution).

I'm noticing this thread slowly turning into a flamewar. Let me try to sum it up:
Pro- Put it in portage! It's coming out soon.
Anti- No, it's incomplete and broken and too big of a hassle.
Pro- That's what the testing branch is for.
Anti- No the testing branch is for testing, KDE4.0 is without a doubt broken and incomplete.
Pro- Yes but other software is broken like X, and they're still in portage.

Anti KDE4.0 in portage, it's your move.

WilliamHeuts · Post by **WilliamHeuts** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 12:27 pm

My 2 cents:

We're not talking about some piece of obscure software here but the next generation of a widely used DE that people get excited about and want to try for themselves. Overlay's are very nice for software that isn't officially out yet or for very specialized pieces of software that hardly anybody uses.

KDE 4 is an official release so it should be in portage. Hard mask it if you will but put it in.

Cephalon · Post by **Cephalon** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 12:31 pm

+1
Hard mask it!!!

schachti · Post by **schachti** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 12:42 pm

If they put it in the official tree, the (gentoo) KDE maintainers have to maintain it. If it's in an inofficial overlay, anyone can maintain it, not only the official developers - that might be the reason why they do not put it into portage now (just to prevent some trouble with a currently incomplete software).

V-Li · Post by **V-Li** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 12:43 pm

To stop the confusion: http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev/msg_150106.xml:

KDE 4.0.0 will be released on January, 11th 2008, and if things keep
going like they do now we might be able to put all the stuff into
~arch on the release day.

Later corrected from "~arch" to "package.mask".

Let_Me_Be · Post by **Let_Me_Be** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 12:45 pm

schachti wrote:If they put it in the official tree, the (gentoo) KDE maintainers have to maintain it. If it's in an inofficial overlay, anyone can maintain it, not only the official developers - that might be the reason why they do not put it into portage now (just to prevent some trouble with a currently incomplete software).

But it is not incomplete! Only some of the aplications don't use the "COOL STUFF".

tnt · Post by **tnt** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 1:54 pm

V-Li wrote:To stop the confusion: http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev/msg_150106.xml:

KDE 4.0.0 will be released on January, 11th 2008, and if things keep
going like they do now we might be able to put all the stuff into
~arch on the release day.
Later corrected from "~arch" to "package.mask".

and that is the right thing to do!

~arch or package.mask give people a chance to try it and eventualy help stabilizing it.

"gentoo is all about choices", AFAIK, so putting it into the portage and keeping it away from stable tree is the best devs can do.

Bowyakka · Post by **Bowyakka** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 2:48 pm

schachti wrote:If they put it in the official tree, the (gentoo) KDE maintainers have to maintain it. If it's in an inofficial overlay, anyone can maintain it, not only the official developers - that might be the reason why they do not put it into portage now (just to prevent some trouble with a currently incomplete software).

I would be a little suprised if the overlay is not being maintained / managed by the very same people that maintain kde in the tree proper

madcat87 · Post by **madcat87** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 3:19 pm

So finally it will be in portage right ? Or should I use the overlay?

V-Li · Post by **V-Li** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 5:32 pm

madcat87 wrote:So finally it will be in portage right ? Or should I use the overlay?

You can use the overlay, but it will make it into Portage in the next couple of weeks (in worst case).

StifflerStealth · Post by **StifflerStealth** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 5:36 pm

Bowyakka wrote:I would be a little suprised if the overlay is not being maintained / managed by the very same people that maintain kde in the tree proper

The KDE4 overlay in "Unsupported" forums _is_ maintained by a few of the Gentoo KDE Devs. Look at who made the first post of the new part of it. That overlay is a test for everything KDE4. Things go into the overlay long before portage to make sure portage doesn't break. Gentoo Devs really don't like it when something in portage breaks it.

Almost all the herd teams have their own overlay, you just need to find them. Also, the KDE4 overlay is mentioned officially on the Gentoo KDE site: http://kde.gentoo.org/ which is where everyone should go for their Gentoo/KDE info.

By the way, since when did this thread turn from asking when KDE4 will be in portage to a romp about why not to have it in portage? The Gentoo KDE Devs know all about KDE4 and it's quirks, since they made the overlay, I am pretty sure they are running it, so they will put KDE4 in portage when they feel it's ready and will put it in under whatever mask they feel it needs to be under. I have been talking directly with the KDE Devs on IRC and I have bugs that they can't reproduce and so it's a small percentage of machines that will have the same troubles that I have, but I have been helping with backtraces and all that, so hopefully the bug gets solved. So, KDE4 may work fine for some, but may not for others.

Good day.

HappySmileMan · Post by **HappySmileMan** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 6:10 pm

Just wanted to point out that on the official KDE4.0 release announcement it states:

Gentoo Linux provides KDE 4.0 builds on http://kde.gentoo.org.

I'm assuming that someone saw that KDE4 was in an overlay and posted that 4.0 was in there, which isn't true, I thought of contacting them, but then figured maybe I was looking in the wrong place, so just to confirm, neither the portage tree or the overlay have 4.0, and probably won't for a while?

Aitikin · Post by **Aitikin** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 6:22 pm

HappySmileMan wrote:Just wanted to point out that on the official KDE4.0 release announcement it states:
Gentoo Linux provides KDE 4.0 builds on http://kde.gentoo.org.
I'm assuming that someone saw that KDE4 was in an overlay and posted that 4.0 was in there, which isn't true, I thought of contacting them, but then figured maybe I was looking in the wrong place, so just to confirm, neither the portage tree or the overlay have 4.0, and probably won't for a while?

Not at my box right now so I can't check, but if it's not up, it probably won't be very long for it to be up on the kde overlay. As for the tree proper, well that'll probably be a while.

GivePeaceAChance · Post by **GivePeaceAChance** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 9:15 pm

Noob question here:

On the kde site for getting kde4.0, it references the gentoo KDE project here: http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/desktop/kde/

There is also a page about installing KDE4 on the website (howsever this one looks like it's geared towards the developer): http://techbase.kde.org/Getting_Started/Build/KDE4

Finally there's the KDE4 gentoo wiki: http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_KDE4

So I'm just a user who wants to have a nice new, fully functional KDE4 install on his machine. Which guide should I go with? I know there's a KDE4 thread in "Unsupported Software" which I will also use if that's the suggested way.

Also, i currently have KDE3.5.x installed on my machine. For simplicity, since this is a gentoo install that jas nothing but kdebase-startkde on it, should I do a fresh install of KDE and follow one of those guides to get JUST KDE4 onto my machine?

TNorthover · Post by **TNorthover** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 9:35 pm

GivePeaceAChance wrote:So I'm just a user who wants to have a nice new, fully functional KDE4 install on his machine. Which guide should I go with? I know there's a KDE4 thread in "Unsupported Software" which I will also use if that's the suggested way.

I don't think there are any 4.0.0 ebuilds available yet, either in ~arch or the overlay. I suspect they'll appear first in the overlay, but could be wrong on that.

I'd suggest keeping an eye out in this forum for a support thread (it'll likely appear when the packages hit ~arch) and the Unsupported thread (that'll be the place to look if they're still only in an overlay, people will almost certainly speak up when they do appear). None of the links you mention look specific enough at the moment -- threads will be where to get the information you need at first.

GivePeaceAChance · Post by **GivePeaceAChance** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 9:41 pm

Any idea how long that'll be?

TNorthover · Post by **TNorthover** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 9:44 pm

GivePeaceAChance wrote:Any idea how long that'll be?

Afraid not. There was apparently a post from the 9th in the dev-list which sounded hopeful for same-day packaging (see V-Li's post further up this thread), but I'm basically as clueless as everyone bar the maintainers.

alienjon · Post by **alienjon** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 10:17 pm

IIRC KDE4.0 (not KDE4) won't make it into portage. KDE4.1 is another matter..

(This is from this thread but I'm sorry I don't remember who wrote it) This got me wondering, what is the official progress page for KDE. Not what they plan on doing (release schedule or what have you) but what is currently being worked on and what else needs to be worked on and completed for a specific version release? Basically, I'd like to see the progress as it comes from the developers.