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pjp
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 06, 2013 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
this one is clearly not. obama didn't start the rebellion.
It clearly is. We have no reason to be involved. None. Unless you count Obama cornering himself behind the "red line." There is no proof.

As for the other, Hussein was violating restrictions. Was that used for convenience? Probably, but it is far less fabricated than Obama & Syria.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 06, 2013 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
energyman76b wrote:
delicious.

Your anger so delicious.


Compared to your reaction about the blatant lies Bush told everybody just to start a war in Iraq.

so, so delicious.

Don't be a fool. The real "delicious" irony is that it is now being done AGAIN by the very people who complained about it the first time.


I disagree. the iraq war was entirely manufactured, and that was clear from day one. this one is clearly not. obama didn't start the rebellion.

Unless you think the entire world simultaneously had a mass hallucination of Saddam Hussein invading and annexing Kuwait, firing Scud missiles at Israeli cities, and then, after having been put back into his box by the Coalition, telling them and the UN to fuck off and die while egregiously violating his cease fire agreement in four different ways, then the Iraq war was not "manufactured". Don't kneejerk yet, keep reading.

The Clinton Administration changed the U.S. National Security Strategy with respect to Iraq to one of Regime Change, because it had become obvious that he was a continuing threat to our energy supply, to our allies in the region, and strategically, represented a threat of a unified Arab military alliance against the West. The Bush Administration capitalized on the opportunity to carry it out. That's not "manufactured". What was manufactured was the "clear and present danger" of WMDs.

Now, in this case, the Obama Administration has apparently learned from that mistake, but learned the wrong thing. Instead of being honest about its real reasons for wanting to intervene in Syria, it has learned that its lies need to be more convincing. So, it has made sure the WMD evidence was as compelling as possible, including an actual use of chemical weapons (by whom we don't know, but they say don't pay attention to that). What they failed to judge properly was that Obama has very little credibility because he's been lying non-stop for the past six years, and has been caught telling some big whoppers recently. Also, they assumed the public is more stupid than they are, and would not find it questionable that Assad, who had just gained the upper hand in the conflict, would employ chemical weapons just as UN chemical weapons monitors happen to show up on the scene (which is absurd).

Besides, you shouldn't refer to this as "war". Maybe you didn't get the memo, but Secretary John Kerry says this is not a "war". :P
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 06, 2013 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
energyman76b wrote:
delicious.

Your anger so delicious.


Compared to your reaction about the blatant lies Bush told everybody just to start a war in Iraq.

so, so delicious.

Don't be a fool. The real "delicious" irony is that it is now being done AGAIN by the very people who complained about it the first time.


I disagree. the iraq war was entirely manufactured, and that was clear from day one. this one is clearly not. obama didn't start the rebellion.

Unless you think the entire world simultaneously had a mass hallucination of Saddam Hussein invading and annexing Kuwait, firing Scud missiles at Israeli cities, and then, after having been put back into his box by the Coalition, telling them and the UN to fuck off and die while egregiously violating his cease fire agreement in four different ways, then the Iraq war was not "manufactured". Don't kneejerk yet, keep reading.


kuwait happened in GW2, not under bush. besides, the french and the germans didn't want war. neither did the british people. nor did the canadians.
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
energyman76b wrote:
delicious.

Your anger so delicious.


Compared to your reaction about the blatant lies Bush told everybody just to start a war in Iraq.

so, so delicious.

Don't be a fool. The real "delicious" irony is that it is now being done AGAIN by the very people who complained about it the first time.


I disagree. the iraq war was entirely manufactured, and that was clear from day one. this one is clearly not. obama didn't start the rebellion.

Unless you think the entire world simultaneously had a mass hallucination of Saddam Hussein invading and annexing Kuwait, firing Scud missiles at Israeli cities, and then, after having been put back into his box by the Coalition, telling them and the UN to fuck off and die while egregiously violating his cease fire agreement in four different ways, then the Iraq war was not "manufactured". Don't kneejerk yet, keep reading.


kuwait happened in GW2, not under bush. besides, the french and the germans didn't want war. neither did the british people. nor did the canadians.

Irrelevant. It was one conflict, spread over three Presidents. The reason Clinton decided to take him out of power was because he wasn't abiding by the terms of the cease fire we generously granted him. We went back and finished the job. It's also irrelevant that certain countries didn't want war -- they all saw what happened -- the point was that you cannot deny the facts: he invaded and annexed Kuwait, threatened Saudi Arabia, fired Scuds at Israeli cities, was decisively defeated, signed an agreement not to do certain things, did them, and effectively told everybody complaining about it to suck his dick. He was a threat to our energy supply, and was pursuing a strategy of Pan-Arabic military unification against the West. None of that is "manufactured". The exaggerated intelligence that he was reconstituting his WMD capabilities was "manufactured", but beneath that there were real reasons why the U.S. decided Hussein had to be taken out of power.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The arabian overlords demand that the USA destroy Assad to an al'qaedo supporting regime can be installed.

And since they are willing to pay for it, the USA will attack:
http://qpress.de/2013/09/06/ein-us-soldatenleben-kostet-288-986-78410-dollar-araber-kaufen-die-weltpolizei-fuer-syrien-attacke/
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I still find it funny that an Ex KGB tyrant was able to ... postpone an attack from a Nobel Peace Prize laureate
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
I still find it funny that an Ex KGB tyrant was able to ... postpone an attack from a Nobel Peace Prize laureate


Putin is the one who really deserves that Nobel Peace Prize

Quote:
In one of the most deft diplomatic maneuvers of all time, Russia’s President Putin has saved the world from near-certain disaster. He did so without the egoistical but incompetent American president, or his earnest but clueless Secretary of State, even realizing they had been offered a way out of the mess they’d created.

The eventful day started out Monday morning with the Obama administration making a full court press for an American attack on Syria: lobbying members of Congress, scheduling an historic series of presidential interviews with top news anchors, and sending Secretary Kerry to London to persuade our reluctant allies to scramble their jets, too.

Then Secretary Kerry made an off-hand comment that the only way an American attack would be called off is if the Syrians turn over all their chemical weapons to an international body. Then he added, “but that isn’t going to happen.”

The words were hardly out of his mouth when Russian Foreign Minister Lavrov essentially said, "we can live with that," and the Syrian Foreign Minister chimed in with "we can, too."
Meanwhile, the State Department dismissed it, saying Kerry didn’t really mean what he said, it was just a "rhetorical" answer to a hypothetical question.

It was as if Team Obama couldn’t take "yes" for an answer.

So, in stepped former Secretary Clinton, looking like the only adult in the room, to say that the Kerry Proposal made sense.

Well, that got Team Obama’s attention!

The president, never one to let a crisis go to waste, told journalists that the proposal was something he and Putin had discussed at the G-20 Summit last week.

By Tuesday night’s speech President Obama will surely be taking full credit, saying the Syrians and Russians caved only because Obama drew the "red line" a year ago, and threatened military action against Syria.

So in 24 hours an off-hand phrase was picked up by Putin, became a Kerry Proposal and ultimately the Obama Peace plan, proving once again the Washington dictum that "success has many fathers."

The fact is Obama seemed headed for an attack on Syria that no one wanted and few thought would succeed. Most thought it would only end in disaster, either with the U.S. drawn into an attack/retaliation cycle of escalation that could go on for years and spread into a regional war, or result in the overthrow of President Assad by an Al Qaeda affiliated rebels.

While the Russians may have toyed with the idea of letting American get bogged down in yet another losing Middle East war, they didn’t want to risk a war that might pull them in, or lose control of the Assad government to radical Sunni jihadists.

So Putin stepped in and threw Obama a lifeline.

For a few hours it seemed Obama might not grab at it. But he has, and will no doubt claim full credit for it being his idea all along.

The Washington press corps will no doubt believe him, as usual, and lavish their usual praise.

But the world knows that Vladimir Putin is the one who really deserves that Nobel Peace Prize.

It turns out that leading from behind left a big opening up front. Putin stepped right in. And Obama still hasn't figured it out.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
our energy supply

Dude, it's the oil in another country.
How would you feel if some bully along the street saw your fridge as his "food and beer supply"? You've got scyents, invent more effective solar panels. Or pay for it with something else then post-it notes that say "100 dollars".
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-8Iw9TT1bJ5U/UjDmsVeLVNI/AAAAAAAADeE/2B85gwzezf0/w353-h584-no/13+-+1
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 1:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
I still find it funny that an Ex KGB tyrant was able to ... postpone an attack from a Nobel Peace Prize laureate

Doesn't make the Nobel committee look very good. :lol:

The Obama Administration is completely incompetent in terms of foreign policy, strategically, militarily, and diplomatically.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 1:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Prenj wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
our energy supply

Dude, it's the oil in another country.
How would you feel if some bully along the street saw your fridge as his "food and beer supply"? You've got scyents, invent more effective solar panels. Or pay for it with something else then post-it notes that say "100 dollars".

I'm not endorsing the policy; I'm just explaining the reality. We should have weaned ourselves off oil decades ago after the big Oil Embargo in the 1970s. It's a simple reality that one of the reasons men band together is to exert influence (including the threat of physical force) over the resources necessary for their well-being. If we were real assholes, we'd have seized the major oil producers and claimed them as possessions by now, like everybody else has done when they had the capability.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 2:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
The Obama Administration is completely incompetent.


ftfy ;)
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 2:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
We should have weaned ourselves off oil decades ago after the big Oil Embargo in the 1970s.


http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/02/06/bush-energy/

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/4240220/ns/us_news-environment/t/lights-biggest-fuel-cell-project-date/#.UjEjlj9e_Yo

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2009/05/obama-cuts-hydrogen-research-funds/
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 2:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
The Obama Administration is completely incompetent.


ftfy ;)
still more competent than the previous. Maybe the general trend is up
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 2:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cokehabit wrote:
Muso wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
The Obama Administration is completely incompetent.


ftfy ;)
still more competent than the previous. Maybe the general trend is up


You'd have to be living in an alternate reality to think that.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 2:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gitmo...still operating
Renditions.... continue
Afghanistan.... US troop increase doubled, seventy-three percent KIA under Obama's watch
Pakistani civilians killed.... hundreds
Bill Of Rights.... TSA toilet paper
Unemployment.... down one half of one percent since Obama took office
Jobs.... four out of every five private sector jobs created in the last five years are part time
Employment.... less people working since the Carter administration
Sea levels.... not decreasing
US citizens.... killed without due process of law, including a sixteen year old
Federal Government.... the most dysfunctional in my lifetime, and that includes Watergate

Cokey, not even you can defend that. He-Who-Cannot-Be-Named has doubled down on every wrong thing Bush did. This Affirmative Action President is becoming the laughing stock of the world. When are you folks gonna ask for that Peace Prize? :lol:
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know if you Americans have noticed, but the world actually wants you to fail. And the Nobel Peace Prize is not really a governmental thing, it's prize paid out by a QUANGO of scientist peers. In Norway, one of the effluent neighbours of Sweden where fishing and clubbing small mammals is the norm..
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 4:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sikpuppy wrote:
I don't know if you Americans have noticed, but the world actually wants you to fail.


If that were true, they'd stop begging for our help. The UN would stop asking for us to pay 25% of its total operating costs, and the military shield (which is protecting even you) wouldn't be asked for by governments.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
sikpuppy wrote:
I don't know if you Americans have noticed, but the world actually wants you to fail.


If that were true, they'd stop begging for our help. The UN would stop asking for us to pay 25% of its total operating costs, and the military shield (which is protecting even you) wouldn't be asked for by governments.
Oh not too much, just a bit. Just enough to take the smug expression off your leader's face.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sikpuppy wrote:
I don't know if you Americans have noticed, but the world actually wants you to fail. And the Nobel Peace Prize is not really a governmental thing, it's prize paid out by a QUANGO of scientist peers. In Norway, one of the effluent neighbours of Sweden where fishing and clubbing small mammals is the norm..

Well I draw a line between american people I met, and US empire and whoever took over and infiltrated it. Merchant Barons. I wanna see them fail. Clint Eastwood for president, not some big-eared cocksucker on AIPAC's/Goldman Sachs tit.
But I guess it has become obvious that as long as the corruptive element is there, it doesn't matter what US says, which movie it makes about supposed redemption, and who they elect for president.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sikpuppy wrote:
Muso wrote:
sikpuppy wrote:
I don't know if you Americans have noticed, but the world actually wants you to fail.


If that were true, they'd stop begging for our help. The UN would stop asking for us to pay 25% of its total operating costs, and the military shield (which is protecting even you) wouldn't be asked for by governments.
Oh not too much, just a bit. Just enough to take the smug expression off your leader's face.


A bit is needed, that's for sure.
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Butts McCokey
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 6:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Old School wrote:
Gitmo...still operating
Renditions.... continue
Afghanistan.... US troop increase doubled, seventy-three percent KIA under Obama's watch
Pakistani civilians killed.... hundreds
Bill Of Rights.... TSA toilet paper
Unemployment.... down one half of one percent since Obama took office
Jobs.... four out of every five private sector jobs created in the last five years are part time
Employment.... less people working since the Carter administration
Sea levels.... not decreasing
US citizens.... killed without due process of law, including a sixteen year old
Federal Government.... the most dysfunctional in my lifetime, and that includes Watergate

Cokey, not even you can defend that. He-Who-Cannot-Be-Named has doubled down on every wrong thing Bush did. This Affirmative Action President is becoming the laughing stock of the world. When are you folks gonna ask for that Peace Prize? :lol:
Well the first 4 were GWB's fault. Unemployment and jobs were GWB's fault because of the economy that he left Obama. The rest you can complain about.
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