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What is the new "proper" way to mount stuff in KDE
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Saundersx
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 1:06 am    Post subject: What is the new "proper" way to mount stuff in KDE Reply with quote

I just installed Gentoo/KDE on a laptop not too long ago and today was the first time I plugged in a usbstick and sure enough, read only.

Can someone just tell me the proper way it's done now. I have to admit, this is a pet peeve for me with linux. Between udev, udisks, pmount, usergroups, consolekit, polkit, device notifier, bash scripts, sudo, etc I am just tired of looking and don't want to setup something that will for one reason or another become obsolete tomorrow or conflict which who knows what...
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eccerr0r
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 2:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What filesystem is the USB memory?

I've found my Gnome systems tend to just "work" if built all at the same time with fresh/empty USE flags with MSDOS/VFAT disks. It's the machines that I emerge piecemeal that have tons of trouble. Unfortunately the debug tree when I finally was able to get a working Gnome install may or may not help KDE users, but it ended up being an old Consolekit config file... It's unfortunate that KDE and Gnome make the procedure really convoluted but it's needed to because of the security of Un*x systems... all to get around the security...
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Helmering
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2012 11:40 am    Post subject: Re: What is the new "proper" way to mount stuff in Reply with quote

Saundersx wrote:
I just installed Gentoo/KDE on a laptop not too long ago and today was the first time I plugged in a usbstick and sure enough, read only.


Check /var/log/messages.
Filesystem of USB-Stick clean?

Ralf

/edit: stick will be mounted "read only" if filesystem isn't clean. Better check dmesg after fitting the stick


Last edited by Helmering on Fri Aug 03, 2012 8:09 pm; edited 2 times in total
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The Doctor
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2012 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You do need to be in the right groups and have no entries in your fstab related to your flash drive. You also need consolkit and udisks (I think). I don't know exactly since I nuked both of those at the same time. I think that you need to be in the usb group, although cdrom might also be a good group for your user to be in.
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Saundersx
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 04, 2012 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its one partition with reiserfs on it, and it's clean (according to dmesg).

Code:
aaa@bbb ~ $ groups
tty lp wheel uucp audio cdrom video cdrw usb users plugdev locate wireshark aaa


But to clarify, I'm not looking for some random method that will "work", I want the new official "omfg that is how we do it this week" method.
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eccerr0r
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2012 7:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

By the sounds of it, Gentoo might not be the appropriate distribution for you. It's an unfortunate fact of the flexibility of how to install it - there are many more ways to break it, and it will require serious debug to figure out what broke... Again the whole stack that allows a user to magically get read/write access when inserting a disk is unheard of in traditional UN*X environments where the default is things locked down -- a lot of steps need to work to allow this to happen. One thing broke and you lose permissions...

The "one thing that fixes everything" only applies if there's many people or everyone having the same problem. A lot of the times for Gentoo it's not true which makes things difficult.

Unfortunately I've not seen how other KDE distributions work, only Gnome - Ubuntu automount works very similarly to Gentoo/Gnome (when installed properly) and has disks mounted read/write. Anyone know how it works for Kubuntu, etc.? What other distributions has KDE default?
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Saundersx
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2012 5:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bitchplease, I've been using Gentoo for a long time and my question was very, very simple. If you don't know the answer then the typical "well here's my lofty, condescending opinion how linux works in general, but in the end I have no real advice" just makes these forums painful to read.
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eccerr0r
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2012 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does the mount work if you're using a FAT filesystem hotplugged? Since reiserfs has its own permission system on it, Linux may be honoring its permissions rather than a FAT filesystem which does not - and there is code to remap all to the current usre.

Saundersx wrote:
I want the new official "omfg that is how we do it this week" method.

If this is what you expect, you will be waiting for a long time.

You'll have to research the problem yourself if you don't want to try the things suggested. Go re-emerge your --empty world and check all the config default files as a start point if even FAT does not work. Make sure your /etc/make.profile is pointing to the correct KDE profile and not some generic desktop profile. If you don't want to re-emerge world, and not willing to try different things then go live with your problems forever, I'm merely saying that there are a LOT of things that can go wrong with any particular install and just instantly knowing what the problem is with your install is is just ludicrous.

Saundersx wrote:
Bitchplease, I've been using Gentoo for a long time and my question was very, very simple. If you don't know the answer then the typical "well here's my lofty, condescending opinion how linux works in general, but in the end I have no real advice" just makes these forums painful to read.


I'm done. No point helping someone with attitude like this. If you don't understand why people make incorrect suggestions and you MUST require the right solution each time you need help, go run some OS that has paid technical support.
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Saundersx
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2012 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

eccerr0r wrote:
By the sounds of it, Gentoo might not be the appropriate distribution for you. It's an unfortunate fact of the flexibility of how to install it - there are many more ways to break it, and it will require serious debug to figure out what broke... Again the whole stack that allows a user to magically get read/write access when inserting a disk is unheard of in traditional UN*X environments where the default is things locked down -- a lot of steps need to work to allow this to happen. One thing broke and you lose permissions...

The "one thing that fixes everything" only applies if there's many people or everyone having the same problem. A lot of the times for Gentoo it's not true which makes things difficult.

Unfortunately I've not seen how other KDE distributions work, only Gnome - Ubuntu automount works very similarly to Gentoo/Gnome (when installed properly) and has disks mounted read/write. Anyone know how it works for Kubuntu, etc.? What other distributions has KDE default?


Please, point me to the line where you actually tried to "help"? The one specific thing it might be or one thing to try?

This is just a little rant injected with a little dig at me. Perhaps my reply did have some attitude attached but I stand by what I said.

On a side note, from the reading I have done udisks seems to be the new shiny toy in town at least in regards to KDE. I'm going to get things working using this.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 12:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I fully agree with the OP! 3 cheers! I also have had problems with people "helping" by beating about the bush and NOT answering a simple question but giving a thousand wrong suggestions then taking affront............

BTW I also would like to know what the answer is.............. I see an icon on the bar at the bottom, I can't see what operates it. The one that mounts and unmounts various storage devices because I am tired of having to enter a password for an eSata device but a usb doesn't need one.
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The Doctor
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

psheldon wrote:
I fully agree with the OP! 3 cheers! I also have had problems with people "helping" by beating about the bush and NOT answering a simple question but giving a thousand wrong suggestions then taking affront............

BTW I also would like to know what the answer is.............. I see an icon on the bar at the bottom, I can't see what operates it. The one that mounts and unmounts various storage devices because I am tired of having to enter a password for an eSata device but a usb doesn't need one.


The answer here is that it is NOT a simple question. It only looks like one.

1) This should "just work". If it does not then something is broken. The OP just has the wrong filesystem permissions on his USB stick. That probably explains it. When he created the file system he let some group view but only his user modify. Now he has a new user number and the filesystem will not allow writes.

2) As for your disk, add it to fstab with the "users" option to give everyone in the users group access. You can be more specific if you feel it is necessary. As for the correct answer, it was given in the third post. The first two responses were looking for the reason why it was not working for the OP. This was reviled by his fourth post when he stated that he was using reiserfs on the flash drive which has permissions associated with it.

If you don't like support forums where people help out in their spare time and are not necessarily experts yet then you should consider going to a distro that has paid technical support.
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Saundersx
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The issue ended up being udisks. Following another thread I tried changing it in KDEs System Settings > Actions Policy > udisks stuff. But for me, and I don't know why, it will not save any changes I make. So in the end I ended up manually editing the files themselves and all is good now.

penguin swordmaster wrote:
If you don't like support forums where people help out in their spare time and are not necessarily experts yet then you should consider going to a distro that has paid technical support.


Obviously you quoting the whole "consider going to a distro that has paid technical support" is just you trolling, and you will be ignored as such. Goddamn people, stop acting so precious.
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eccerr0r
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2012 1:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please post exactly what you do for other people who look for the same problem.

Based on your post count I can see that you haven't participated on the forums much. Try answering other peoples' questions once in a while too, and you'll notice how hard it is. If you end up finding this is easy, great, a lot of people could use your expertise.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2012 6:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saunderx Thanks I also noticed that "saving" thingy not working so well.
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sobhan
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2012 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i tink you can emerge ntfs-3g and mount your flash whit it (
Code:
ntfs-g /dev/sd** /**
) do tou see it whit

Code:
fdisk -l
?
you shold enable fuse in you kernel
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Saundersx
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

edit these files as root

/usr/share/polkit-1/actions/org.freedesktop.udisks*.policy

changes "no" to "yes" for stuff labelled "mount xxx". That's the jist of it.
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 1:40 am    Post subject: Attitudes Reply with quote

Can I just say that, while I can understand the point of view of the OP, eccerr0r is also right in saying that Gentoo, and Linux in general, is not an easily configurable operating system. It is not built on IJD technology, and auto-configurations are results of hard work by many people.

Basically, yes, ideally USB Plug-n-Play should work for most Desktop Environments out of the box, and should be as painless and effortless as possible - it is a major appeal to non-technical users as well as ease-of-access for the rest; however if it is not working, that means that something is broken, and because of the layered nature of Linux, and the configurability of Gentoo, that something could be anything.

You said before that between so many different utilities and services, you are 'tired of looking' and want something that will just work. With this in mind, I agree with eccerr0r - maybe you should investigate a less high-maintenance distribution such as Sabayon, Fedora or Ubuntu. They are still true Linux distributions, and they still have all the same basics, but they're designed to be able to work out of the box to be able to appeal to standard users and potentially compete, on a functional level, with the ease-of-configuration of other OS's.

Otherwise, stop complaining that you've chosen a highly-configurable, and thus potentially easily-breakable, distribution, stop critisizing people for suggesting that, if you're tired of researching, you should get something that requires less of it, and either fix your problem yourself or appreciate those who take your concerns onboard and try to suggest something that might give you, not just an immediate solution, but a longer-term resolution to your problem with hard work.

Now, with that out of the way, the easiest combination I found was to use NTFS-3G and FUSE.

Good luck, whatever your choice.
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jesnow
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 4:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OP is absolutely correct. Even sysadmins with copious linux knowledge should be able to use gentoo for production and user systems. Having a situation sneak into stable where some trivial but important thing suddenly becomes difficult and worse, difficult to troubleshoot because of cryptic/lacking error messages, well that makes gentoo less useful to everyone doesn't it. Is it any wonder gentoo has slipped so far down on distrowatch?

Please keep the "gentoo is hard (you idiot)" comments to yourself. We know that. Same thing with "works for me (you idiot)" and "could be a bunch of things (you idiot), but I won't tell you what".

The solution to the main problem in my case was the lack of a consolkit session associated with my kde session. This made the consolkit default, to not allow people to mount usb drives, impossible to change, because without a consolkit session the system settings -> actions policy module gives the helpful error message "not authorized" when you try to change anything.

To solve this, I had to edit ~/.xinirc to read

Quote:

exec ck-launch-session startkde


The workaround above, to edit the file by hand as root also works, but you then the system settings module still doesn't work.

I assume that you need to do something similar in the setup for kdm, but I don't use it so I'm not sure what.
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jesnow
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2014 8:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very helpful guide to these ConsoleKit, PolicyKit, and udev helpers here:

https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-858965-start-350.html

Jon.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found this wiki page informative with regard to polkit and updating the 'no' to 'yes' instructions.

:)
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