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ChromoX
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 12:02 am    Post subject: Automount Question. Reply with quote

I want something better than automount. I have heard about ivman. But overall what is better supermount/submount/ivman. I want to be as simple as possible to insert a cd and ipod etc...
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Zepp
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 2:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Automount Question. Reply with quote

ChromoX wrote:
I want something better than automount. I have heard about ivman. But overall what is better supermount/submount/ivman. I want to be as simple as possible to insert a cd and ipod etc...


ivman has awlays worked for me, if you are using gnome their is gnome-volume-manager aswell. Not sure what kde uses these days.
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javeree_work
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As always in linux: what is better depends on what you want. I believe the main difference between automount/supermount/submount (*mount in the rest of this note) and ivman/gnome-volume-manager is the following:

*mount keeps an eye on file accesses the kernel does and when it sees that an attempt is done to access a directory where a a device could be mounted (known by looking at /etc/autofs or /etc/fstab), the relevant mount command is issued. After a certain delay after files have been closed, the device is unmounted again.

ivman and gnome-volume manager keep an eye on hotplug events (reported by dbus/hal), and mount/unmount based upon that. I've also seen some scripts called from udev directly to do the mounting unmounting

some pros and cons i see:

*mount
+ works on console
+ at least submount can also automount network (nfs)
+/- auto-unmounting keeps your filesystem safe (but frequent syncing on usb-sticks can harm them if used frequently)
? haven't tried automounting smbfs yet
- works on device entries, so each device must be specified in udev, I have not yet found a good rule to define 'any usb stick on usb port x', so I have to create a rule for each specific stick
- cannot create desktop entries
* submount is a successor of supermount, so I'd think that is 'better'. It is easier to configure than autofs. Personally, I use submount

udev scripting
+ works on console
+ can create desktop entries
- I have not yet found a good rule to define 'any usb stick on usb port x', so I have to create a rule for each specific stick
- can only work for pluggable/ejectable devices, not for networks
- unmounting needs sudo, or only happens after removal of the stick
? There may be more limits in what the scripts can do than what is allowed in ivman
- requires some scripting skills

ivman
+ ? I think it works from console ?
+ can create desktop entries
+ works with hal, so it's easy to specify do this for 'any usb stick'
+ Easy to configure
- more dependencies tan udev scripting
- safely unmounting is a bit clumsy: either needs sudo umount or only one user can do it, or only happens after removal of the stick
- can only work for pluggable/ejectable devices, not for networks

gnome-volume manager
- only under X
- gnome dependencies
+ if you use gnome only, better use the gnome tools
? I have no further experience
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Zepp
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

javeree_work wrote:
ivman
+ ? I think it works from console ?
+ can create desktop entries
+ works with hal, so it's easy to specify do this for 'any usb stick'
+ Easy to configure
- more dependencies tan udev scripting
- safely unmounting is a bit clumsy: either needs sudo umount or only one user can do it, or only happens after removal of the stick
- can only work for pluggable/ejectable devices, not for networks


There is a work around to let normal user's unmount mounted usb storage devices, but it involves telling it to mount all usb storage devices with the users option I believe. Also the dependencies on ivman are pretty minimal, mostly you just need hal. pmount, and few small libs. Oh and yes it works in the console as it can be ran as a service on boot using the init scripts.
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afabco
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

for pmount/ivman according to the docs you have run two instances; one as root at boot, and the other as the user that is going to be logged in that will be using the device *and no other users may be running ivman instances*. Practically, this will be the user (singular) logged into the console (singular).

Practically, I haven't found the current incarnation of ivman/pmount very useful or usable, and have abandoned it. The other 'automounting' solutions I have looked at also have one showstopper or another.

When I get some time, I'm going to re-ebuild ivman-5.0. (that's the version that uses the 'users' option). That one seemed to be the most practical and usable. In the meantime I usually just su to root to do any mounting or umounting (with the 'users' option). That works well enough for me except for dvd-rams. Other users sharing boxen are just sol unless they are on MS terminal servers.

And don't even try to mount-on-boot a usb drive in any sort of reliable repeatable fashion. I've got a drive with mysql databases on I tried to do that with (seemed like a good idea at the time....) and I end up doing it by hand after every boot.

nope. usb drives on linux still have a long way to go. Best I can do to help it along is plink away at it when I can :?
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Last edited by afabco on Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:36 am; edited 1 time in total
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afabco
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Holy crap...when did I get gradjumated to 'guru'??? That's scary.
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jsf_x35a
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 10:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know much about the automounters but I would advise going with ivman since it seems to be the easiest to set up (Actually, gnome-volume-manager is probably easier to set up but I don't use gnome so the dependancy chain for gnome-volume-manager is pretty long for me). It took me less than 15 mins to emerge and configure ivman using this guide.
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afabco
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2006 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you do choose to use the current version of ivman, note the following (from the above mentioned howto)

Code:
For versions of ivman later than 0.5.x, another instance of ivman must be run by the user in addition to the one run by root.


Also:

Quote:
By default, removable drives will be mounted with read/write access for you, and no access for anyone else.


and
Quote:

Do NOT run more than one instance of per-user Ivman, even under different user accounts - this will cause race conditions.


Good luck! Let the list know how you fare.
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synss
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not an ivman-fan (and we are *not* many around here) so I just go the udev+autofs, it is not difficult either.

EDIT: that is the only way I could get my mp3 partition on a second hardrive (laptop user) using lvm2 to automount/unmount easily.
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Last edited by synss on Tue Nov 21, 2006 2:11 am; edited 1 time in total
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batistuta
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

if you use KDE, the combination hal/dbus/pmount is as simple as it can get: you put a CD, ipod, usb stick, whatever, you it mounts it and you get the icon on your screen. What I really like about pmount that I don't like about ivman, is that the later one creates entries in your fstab (or used to at least). I don't like anyone automatically messing up with my fstab. :roll:
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afabco
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But...a lot of folks -don't- use kde. Or gnome. A lot of us Old Guys <tm> are perfectly happy using console. Call me a console curmudgeon, but it's easier to just 'cd' instead of having to shuffle windows and boxes and screens around to find some icon somewhere.

Lightweight window managers, icewm or fluxbox or the like are perfectly fine for stuff like firefox, anjuta, qcad or whatever that use X. (although twm is a mite -too-minimal :D )

The 'solutions' for automounting (and other things, incidentally) being advanced seem to just assume that everyone is falling victim to creeping massive-itis; it's just assumed that you'll have one (or both. Or more) of these bloated overweight packages, instead of the 'tool for the job' thinking.

But that's another 'Old Guy' rant for another day.
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batistuta
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

afabco, no one here meant to suggest anyone to use kde, gnome, Aero, or Aqua. No one tried to start another discussion about which WM to use. I pointed out one solution if using KDE. The original post didn't have any requirement in WM, except that it had to be as simple as possible. That's why some people pointed out the gnome variant, I pointed the kde variant. That's it. I'm really happy that console works for you! As you've said, the 'tool for the job' :D
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afabco
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

s'ok. didn't mean to come out so shrill. And -definitely- don't want to start another 'best WM' threadwar :D .

Time for another beer?
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