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CoffeeBuzz
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Joined: 15 Jun 2005
Posts: 269
Location: Canada Eh.
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 Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:23 pm Post subject: |
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| wrc1944 wrote: | CoffeeBuzz,
I've been getting these too for about 2 days. Sometimes kdebase and some other kde packages fail to compile, and sometimes not. |
Ok. But if it compiles clean it runs clean? I haven't had any compiles break that tossed out those impossible error's ... yet. Darn it all, ~x86 was doing SOOO well until this. Guess I shouldve expected it to bite me in the butt eventually.
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Gentree
Watchman
Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Posts: 5350
Location: France, Old Europe
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:31 pm Post subject: |
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| laurelin wrote: | okay, Gentree, I will do that.
I prefer the cleanest and less hacking way to get rid of my problem. So I try to get my lib-problem solved and remove avifile later.
Some minor issue: I will need to cut text from one console and paste it to other. Is there a doku on gentoo how to do that? Since you can't teach me the very basics about console-working in this thread.
Is there a man-page about that? I searched for some, but didn't find anything useful. Remember: I'm working on three or four consoles at a time (crtl-alt-f1 to f4) and not under gnome, since it is not working.
And last question: Is there a smooth and small window-manager to use for easy maintenance like fluxbox or something? KDE is much to heavy to use in such cases and sometimes I screw up something with gnome and it does not start till I fix it...  I like to work under consoles, but sometimes two windows are easier to use than two seperate consoles. |
yes I believe screen is the solution to your question although I dont use it .
I recommend xfce4 as a light WM that does not mess too much with other fuctions. It has a mixer applet but does not interfere with the system like kde does. You're obviously better off under X for copying between terminals since you can just select to copy, and middle-click to paste .
PS man bash is probably the relevant doc but it's as easy to digest as a plate of raw gooseberries.  A truely classic piece of *nix doc.
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Last edited by Gentree on Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:44 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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laurelin
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Joined: 16 May 2005
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Gentree wrote: | | You're obviously better off under X for copying between terminals since you can just select to copy, and middle-click to paste . |
I think you are right. I hate X, but it's quite good for copy and paste. |
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Gentree
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Location: France, Old Europe
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:47 pm Post subject: |
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I find running terminals under X you have the best of both worlds. The power and precision of cli plus multilple screens next to each other with fast cut and paste. I do virtually all admin tasks like that.
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eNTi
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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there's actually no further need for a symlink. only to recompile some stuff.
i recompiled neon, pango, fontconfig, libcdio, kdelibs and a few apps and i can just do everything normally, now. maybe recompiling glib and gtk woulnd't be bad either.
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Gentree
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 4:30 pm Post subject: |
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| eNTi wrote: | there's actually no further need for a symlink. only to recompile some stuff.
i recompiled neon, pango, fontconfig, libcdio, kdelibs and a few apps and i can just do everything normally, now. maybe recompiling glib and gtk woulnd't be bad either. |
are you basing that statement on something more that "it works for me " ? If so please state what info you're following.
is there any reason to recompile glib and gkt ? If so do it , if not dont .
This sort of fluff is what gets ppl into the sort of fix some have managed to do here.
Arbitarily hacking around is likely to break stuff.
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eNTi
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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i base most of this on this bug report. as it seems, that you only need to recompile any broken packages by hand against the new expat, i thought that maybe glib and gtk+ could be affected too, since i had to compile kdelibs as well. it's all but guessing and NO, i give NO WARRANTY WHATSOEVER on my findings. i just tell everyone what helped me, so it's a "works-for-me" only advice.
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Gergan Penkov
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 5:08 pm Post subject: |
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Well all this mess is to be expected if one breaks his system with making links, to satisfy broken lib deps.
Probably It should be some sort of a banner in the gentoo-forums never ever make links to libraries 
you could use some sort of
| Code: | | for f in `find -name \*.so*`; do readelf -d $f | grep "expat.so.0" && echo $f; done |
changing it here and there to find the libs which really link to expat.so.0 - but this will search only for libs (you should change the find expression to check the exes)
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wrc1944
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Joined: 15 Aug 2002
Posts: 3442
Location: Gainesville, Florida
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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CoffeeBuzz wrote | Quote: | | Ok. But if it compiles clean it runs clean? I haven't had any compiles break that tossed out those impossible error's ... yet. Darn it all, ~x86 was doing SOOO well until this. Guess I shouldve expected it to bite me in the butt eventually. |
I guess it runs clean, but only time will tell. On one box, kdeaddons won't compile, no matter what. I'm having glib related problems on all my expat 2 boxes, and sometimes an emerge --oneshot glib first will allow the failed packages to compile (not kde, but gtk related ones), but sometimes not, on the same package. -uD world has become so problematic, I'm considering downgrading expat.
My question is, if I do downgrade and mask expat 2, will I then have to rebuild all my boxes that I muddled through rebuilding with expat 2 before I realized what was going on. Or will the revdep-rebuild --library libexpat.so.0 command better solve it?
I'm questioning the wisdom of going on with expat 2, as I just don't know what else is going to happen next. I've been ~x86 since I started Gentoo 3 years ago, but never had anything even remotely approaching this mess occur. Even thpough I'm almost back to normal, I'm afraid all my boxes have become so messed up it's going to be easier just to reinstall from scratch, on everything. I've always been able to resolve everything before, but this is getting way too time consuming, as new things pop up constantly with every sync and update.
Sometimes revdep-rebuild works, sometimes not. Same thing with manually compiling the same packages.
EDIT: An afterthought: Would I be better off (since I already have these three systems built with expat 2) staying where I am, and not downgrade expat, and hope a future expat update fixes things?
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Gergan Penkov
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 9:59 pm Post subject: |
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@wrc1944 are using --as-needed? I thought that you have given it a try, but it seems that the answer is no.
Anyway I recommend above all using the --ass-needed flag - as it will make such tragedies less problematical 
You could have the best of both worlds:
edit the 2.0 ebuild in your overlay
edit to
| Code: | | inherit eutils libtool multilib |
after that change src_install to
| Code: | src_install() {
make install DESTDIR="${D}" || die
preserve_old_lib /usr/$(get_libdir)/libexpat.so.0
dodoc Changes README
dohtml doc/*
}
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after that downgrade to emerge =dev-libs/expat-1.95.8
and immediately upgrade to 2.0.0
you are set up you have 2.0.0 and 1.95.8 now rebuild relaxed all the broken packages and manually remove libexpat.so.0
hope this helps
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wrc1944
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 11:26 pm Post subject: |
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Gergan Penkov,
Yes, I was using --as-needed due to your info and advice, and it seemed to work well until I went to using gcc-4.1 and nesl247's "Evolution Mission Install Guide" for my Gentoo installations. I kept it at first, but too many packages wouldn't compile, so I had to abandon it. I did so very relunctantly, because I was sold on your thinking on the subject, and it worked so well before. It did (and still does) make perfect sense to me.
Don't know if you're familiar with these types of "Conrad" gcc-4.1 installs, but their current LDFLAG set looks like this:
LDFLAGS="-Wl,-O1 -Wl,--sort-common -Wl,-Bdirect -Wl,-hashvals -Wl,-zdynsort"
Perhaps --as-needed doesn't do well with the others shown here- I don't really know at this point. I can say that on my systems it did seem to cause many compile linking problems.
Thanks for the info here. I'll definitely look at this hard and see if I can grasp what you suggest.
I'm not sure what you mean here- I have no 2.0 ebuild for expat in the emission-guide overlay, or my portage overlay- it's in Gentoo portage. Also don't understand " manually remove libexpat.so.0." Isn't that a required lib?
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Gergan Penkov
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 11:39 pm Post subject: |
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Well this change should be made in your overlay, you should copy the 2.0.0 build and make these changes there - it uses a standard eutils function preserve_old_lib.
Essentially what will happen
1. downgrade - this will install libexpat.so.0 with some links libexpat.so and so on
2. upgrade to 2.0.0 from your overlay (with the changes) - this will install libexpat.so.1 and as a link to it libexpat.so (so the link from expat-1.x.x will be overwritten), but will keep libexpat.so.0
3. you have libexapt.so.1 and libexpat.so.0 around no breakage
4. newly emerged packages use -lexpat effectively linking to libexpat.so (which in turn is link to libexpat.so.1 - so they are hard linked to libexpat.so.1)
5. when all packages link to libexpat.so.1 - you must delete libexpat.so.0 as it is cruft and no package will be linking to it
I haven't tested it here (as I had only some 20 packages), but it should work.
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Cr0t
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Joined: 27 Apr 2002
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 11:46 pm Post subject: |
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I had probably 30 broken packages starting with gcc&glibc -> mplayer -> xfce4 .... you get the picture, but now everything is working again!
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IntergalacticWalrus
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Posts: 513
Location: Montreal QC (Canada)
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 11:47 pm Post subject: |
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Holy shit, updating to expat requires me to rebuild about a hundred packages, including almost everything in KDE. There's no way in hell I'm going to waste my time recompiling all of this because the brain-damaged cretins maintaining expat are apparently too stupid to understand how much problems an ABI breakage like this causes to everyone. They have NO EXCUSE for this ABI breakage. Downgrading now...
BTW, an event like this really shows that Portage truly needs to actually handle ABI breakage. A small "you need to run revdep-rebuild" message does NOT cut it. This is absurd. Until Portage actually does something to prevent broken system states due to ABI breakage, everything causing it should remain hard-masked. |
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wrc1944
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Location: Gainesville, Florida
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| Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 12:12 am Post subject: |
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Gergan Penkov wrote:
| Quote: | Well this change should be made in your overlay, you should copy the 2.0.0 build and make these changes there - it uses a standard eutils function preserve_old_lib.
Essentially what will happen
1. downgrade - this will install libexpat.so.0 with some links libexpat.so and so on
2. upgrade to 2.0.0 from your overlay (with the changes) - this will install libexpat.so.1 and as a link to it libexpat.so (so the link from expat-1.x.x will be overwritten), but will keep libexpat.so.0
3. you have libexapt.so.1 and libexpat.so.0 around no breakage
4. newly emerged packages use -lexpat effectively linking to libexpat.so (which in turn is link to libexpat.so.1 - so they are hard linked to libexpat.so.1)
5. when all packages link to libexpat.so.1 - you must delete libexpat.so.0 as it is cruft and no package will be linking to it
I haven't tested it here (as I had only some 20 packages), but it should work. |
Thanks much,Gergan Penkov. I'm pretty sure I understand this, and could implement it. However, I'm also concerned about how this procedure will interact/conflict with the emission-guide overlay, which is often updated by nesl247's emission-manager update script, which basically controls all the bleeding edge gcc-4.1, glibc, and all the rest of the modified /etc/portage and custom emission overlay. If I was only running a vanilla Gentoo ~x86 system on these boxes, I'd be more inclined to go ahead and try this.
Due to this consideration, I think I'll wait a few days before attempting anything else- at least at this point my systems are all functioning again. Who knows- maybe expat 2.0-r1 will be released, for yet another round if insanity!  
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StifflerStealth
Retired Dev
Joined: 03 Jul 2002
Posts: 968
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| Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 12:33 am Post subject: |
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| Gergan Penkov wrote: | | Anyway I recommend above all using the --ass-needed flag - as it will make such tragedies less problematical |
I need to try this flag out. What special features does this have over --as-needed?
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Gergan Penkov
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Joined: 17 Jul 2004
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Location: das kleinste Kuhdorf Deutschlands :)
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| Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 12:43 am Post subject: |
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it seems that it also provides --ass-delivered along
| Quote: | latexer what's our stance on the LDFLAGS --as-needed silliness?
latexer can we rudely close tickets of users using it that have problems? (:
SpanKY ??
SpanKY users are putting '--as-needed' into their LDFLAGS !?
gustavoz --as-needed? --ass-delivered!
SpanKY if a user was enough of a tool to put --as-needed into their LDFLAGS you can mark it INVALID |
FYI https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-p-2300724.html#2300724
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smorg
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| Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 11:07 am Post subject: |
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| someone at Bug 128108 pointed to bug Bug 128442 that suggests revdep-rebuild has problems with finding packages corresponding to files with double slashes in path names. So I looked at the output of revdep-rebuild's linking consistency check, found quite some file names with a double slash, looked up the corresponding packages and re-emerged them. Now my kde is running normal again |
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indianiec
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 01 Feb 2005
Posts: 97
Location: Krakow
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| Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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| IntergalacticWalrus wrote: | Holy shit, updating to expat requires me to rebuild about a hundred packages, including almost everything in KDE. There's no way in hell I'm going to waste my time recompiling all of this because the brain-damaged cretins maintaining expat are apparently too stupid to understand how much problems an ABI breakage like this causes to everyone. They have NO EXCUSE for this ABI breakage. Downgrading now...
BTW, an event like this really shows that Portage truly needs to actually handle ABI breakage. A small "you need to run revdep-rebuild" message does NOT cut it. This is absurd. Until Portage actually does something to prevent broken system states due to ABI breakage, everything causing it should remain hard-masked. |
I think you are right. The newest GWN even suggests that we should read ebuild before we use it. Every ebuild?
Yes, this is absurd.
Last edited by indianiec on Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:24 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Gergan Penkov
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Location: das kleinste Kuhdorf Deutschlands :)
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| Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Major uproar in the Forums this pas weekend: the application binary interface of the expat library changed with the upgrade to 2.0.0, and as a result a whole wave of system breakage washed over many Gentoo users who hadn't seen the small print in the ebuild telling them to revdep-rebuild everything that depended on libexpat.so.0. |
I don't see anything 'bout reading the ebuild - it is about reading the warnings and you could receive them as an email, so there is no need to look the lines scrolling.
And running revdep-rebuild on a regular basis is a must for the health of the system, there is no excuse for not doing it - if you don't want to you could be better off with ubuntu or sth alike.
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Gentree
Watchman
Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Posts: 5350
Location: France, Old Europe
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| Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | hadn't seen the small print in the ebuild telling |
well it was inaccurate, but it did say "in the ebuild ".
This is a persistant problem with portage, what's this you say about getting warnings emailed? I was not aware of that , sounds damn useful.
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Gergan Penkov
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| Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 9:22 pm Post subject: |
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You must have some sort of local delivery configured and after that, example from my make.conf:
| Quote: | # logging related variables:
# PORTAGE_ELOG_CLASSES: selects messages to be logged, possible values are:
# info, warn, error, log
# Warning: commenting this will disable elog
PORTAGE_ELOG_CLASSES="info warn error log"
# PORTAGE_ELOG_SYSTEM: selects the module(s) to process the log messages. Modules
# included in portage are (empty means logging is disabled):
# save (saves one log per package in $PORTAGE_TMPDIR/elogs)
# custom (passes all messages to $PORTAGE_LOG_COMMAND)
# syslog (sends all messages to syslog)
# mail (send all messages to the mailserver defined
# in $PORTAGE_LOG_MAILURI)
# To use elog you should enable at least one module
PORTAGE_ELOG_SYSTEM="mail"
# PORTAGE_ELOG_COMMAND: only used with the "custom" logging module. Specifies a command
# to process log messages. Two variables are expanded:
# ${PACKAGE} - expands to the cpv entry of the processed
# package (see $PVR in ebuild(5))
# ${LOGFILE} - absolute path to the logfile
# Both variables have to be quoted with single quotes
#PORTAGE_ELOG_COMMAND="/path/to/logprocessor -p '${PACKAGE}' -f '${LOGFILE}'"
# PORTAGE_ELOG_MAILURI: this variable holds all important settings for the mail
# module. In most cases listing the recipient address and
# the receiving mailserver should be sufficient, but you can
# also use advanced settings like authentication or TLS. The
# full syntax is:
# address [[user:passwd@]mailserver[:port]]
# where
# address: recipient adress
# user: username for smtp auth (defaults to none)
# passwd: password for smtp auth (defaults to none)
# mailserver: smtp server that should be used to deliver the mail (defaults to localhost)
# port: port to use on the given smtp server (defaults to 25, values > 100000 indicate that starttls should be used on (port-100000))
# Examples:
PORTAGE_ELOG_MAILURI="root" |
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Cinder6
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Joined: 05 Aug 2004
Posts: 767
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| Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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Interesting...I just found this thread due to the GWN. I had this problem too, and revdep-rebuild didn't work for me (it complained about versions not available in portage, though I could have used the -X option, I suppose).
Instead of rebuilding everything that depends on libexpat, I just made a symlink for the missing file (I believe it was libexpat.so.6, but it was a few days ago), and everything works just fine. Should I still do a revdep-rebuild, though?
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Gergan Penkov
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| Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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It will not help you, as it will not find anything broken due to the link.
P.S.
In fact in this case making the link is not that bad, because this all was pure dumb-expat's developers decision (what I conclude from the mailing list) as there presumably is no API/ABI-breakage. It was made only to conform to the libtool-ideas about versioning.
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Cinder6
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Location: California
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| Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 9:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Gergan Penkov wrote: | | It will not help you, as it will not find anything broken due to the link. |
Thanks. So, why go through the whole rebuild process if you can just make a symlink?
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