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widremann
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Posts: 1314

PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 6:32 pm    Post subject: Ugly fonts (perhaps my last straw with Gentoo) Reply with quote

I just can't get nice fonts and I'm about to give up. I've followed the guide on the Gentoo wiki and it did nothing. The fonts are just plain ugly. I can't provide a screenshot because I don't have any of that kind of software emerged yet. I don't understand why it's so god damn difficult to get fonts to look like it's not 1993. I have anti-aliasing turned on, supposedly. But maybe the X server doesn't have it enabled, or maybe some font config file somewhere doesn't have the right setting. And maybe I don't want to spend 5 hours messing with config files, googling hopelessly and recompiling stuff in the hope that I can get something to work that should work right off the bat.

If I can get a solution, great. It would be much appreciated. If not, I'm going back to Windows. Not because I'm stupid, not because I hate Linux, not because I like Microsoft. It's because stuff works. In my mind, a basic desktop setup should just work. I guess I chose the wrong distro. I liked Gentoo at first because it was fast, portage made sense, the system setup made sense, there was great documentation and a great community all in one place. It had more software available than Fedora and despite the long compile times, I felt like it ran better than Fedora and even Windows. Things have changed, and I'm getting tired now of stuff breaking. I know I'm not alone. I really like Linux/Unix (and don't get me wrong, tinkering is something I like to do), but I hate broken software with a passion and I hate having to deal with it day in and day out now, only toh ave things get even more screwed up, and this for things that should just work. It's one thing if I'm playing with some new piece of software ors ome special project. But this is basic stuff. It should just work. End of story.
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exohuman
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Joined: 16 Mar 2005
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 6:38 pm    Post subject: I think a bit more information is needed Reply with quote

I *think* you are upset because the fonts aren't anti-aliased on your machine. You say you have anti-aliasing turned on, how did you go about doing it? What desktop are you using? What programs are you having font trouble with? Or is it all of them?
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user317
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 6:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

everything "just worked" here on my first install :). next time you are going to have some missing dll problem in MS are you going to bitch on the ms forums and tell them how you are switching to *nix because "it just works". you are obviosly doing something wrong, instead of complaining post your X11 config or your font config, what monitor are you using, do you have dpi set correctly ect... gentoo isnt for the feint of heart, if you dont want to deal with all these configuration issues to get you system just right why dont you put a knoppix disk in your cd drive and reboot :).
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widremann
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 6:53 pm    Post subject: Re: I think a bit more information is needed Reply with quote

exohuman wrote:
I *think* you are upset because the fonts aren't anti-aliased on your machine. You say you have anti-aliasing turned on, how did you go about doing it? What desktop are you using? What programs are you having font trouble with? Or is it all of them?

Fonts are anti-aliased at least some of the time. For example, on this forum, the fonts are clearly quite anti-aliased and look nice. And in the control center preview of the fonts, they are also clearly anti-aliased. I'm using KDE, by the way. Interestingly enough, during the initial setup wizard for KDE when I first ran startkde, the fonts looked nice until the last screen of the wizard after I had set my widget theme. Or maybe not. In any case, it shouldn't be like this. I had Fedora on this partition before replacing it with Gentoo and I had no problem getting anti-aliasing. I didn't even hae to do anything. BTW, that's how it should be. For basic stuff like that, it should just work and it obviously can. For some reason it isn't with this install of Gentoo.

I followed the instructions on the Gentoo wiki regarding getting fonts to look nice. Made no difference. There is no xfs package, so I can't emerge that (or at least emerge xfs doesn't work and I didn't have much luck finding out what package it comes with), assuming, of course, that that's even part of the problem.

Here's my xorg.conf for both the tower (1) and the laptop (2), both of which, I now see, have these font problems (the monitor associated with the tower is pretty lousy, so I had assumed that the ugly fonts were because of the monitor, but since I am using XDMCP to use that desktop on my laptop while stuff is still compiling, I see that the fonts really do suck).

Code:
Section "ServerLayout"
   Identifier     "X.org Configured"
   Screen      0  "Screen0" 0 0
   InputDevice    "Mouse0" "CorePointer"
   InputDevice    "Keyboard0" "CoreKeyboard"
EndSection

Section "Files"
   RgbPath      "/usr/lib/X11/rgb"
   ModulePath   "/usr/lib/modules"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/misc:unscaled"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/TTF"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/Type1"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/CID"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/100dpi:unscaled"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/75dpi:unscaled"
   FontPath     "/usr/local/fonts/ttf"
EndSection

Section "Module"
   Load  "extmod"
   Load  "dri"
   Load  "dbe"
   Load  "record"
   Load  "xtrap"
   Load  "glx"
   Load  "type1"
   Load  "freetype"
   Load  "vnc"
EndSection

<snip>

Section "Monitor"
   Identifier   "Monitor0"
   VendorName   "Monitor Vendor"
   ModelName    "Packard Bell 1512SL"
   HorizSync    30.0 - 62.0
   VertRefresh  50.0 - 120.0
   Option       "dpms"
EndSection

Section "Device"
        ### Available Driver options are:-
        ### Values: <i>: integer, <f>: float, <bool>: "True"/"False",
        ### <string>: "String", <freq>: "<f> Hz/kHz/MHz"
        ### [arg]: arg optional
        #Option     "NoAccel"               # [<bool>]
        #Option     "SWcursor"              # [<bool>]
        #Option     "UsePIO"                # [<bool>]
        #Option     "ShowCache"             # [<bool>]
        #Option     "VideoKey"              # <i>
        #Option     "NoSLI"                 # [<bool>]
        #Option     "TexturedVideo"         # [<bool>]
        #Option     "DRI" "True"                   # [<bool>]
   #DisplaySize 400 300
   Identifier  "Card0"
   Driver      "tdfx"
   VendorName  "3Dfx Interactive, Inc."
   BoardName   "Voodoo 3"
   BusID       "PCI:1:5:0"
   Option      "passwordFile"   "/root/.vnc/passwd"
EndSection

Section "Screen"
   Identifier "Screen0"
   Device     "Card0"
   Monitor    "Monitor0"
   DefaultDepth     24
   SubSection "Display"
      Viewport   0 0
      Depth     16
      Modes     "800x600" "640x480"
   EndSubSection
   SubSection "Display"
      Viewport   0 0
      Depth     24
      Modes     "800x600" "640x480"
   EndSubSection
EndSection

and for the laptop, of more importance since the LCD screen could actually look good if things were set up properly
Code:
Section "ServerLayout"
   Identifier     "X.org Configured"
   Screen      0  "Screen0" 0 0
   InputDevice    "Mouse0" "CorePointer"
   InputDevice    "Keyboard0" "CoreKeyboard"
EndSection

Section "Files"
   RgbPath      "/usr/lib/X11/rgb"
   ModulePath   "/usr/lib/modules"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/misc/:unscaled"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/TTF/"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/Type1/"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/corefonts/"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/freefont/"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/sharefonts/"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/terminus/"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/ttf-bistream-vera/"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/unifont/"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/CID/"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/100dpi/:unscaled"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/75dpi/:unscaled"
   FontPath     "/usr/share/fonts/artwiz"
EndSection

Section "Module"
   Load  "extmod"
   Load  "dri"
   Load  "dbe"
   Load  "record"
   Load  "xtrap"
   Load  "glx"
   Load  "type1"
   Load  "freetype"
EndSection

<snip>

Section "Monitor"
        Identifier   "Monitor0"
        VendorName   "Monitor Vendor"
        ModelName    "LCD Panel 1024x768"
        HorizSync    31.5 - 48.5
        VertRefresh  40.0 - 70.0
        Option      "dpms"
EndSection

Section "Device"
        ### Available Driver options are:-
        ### Values: <i>: integer, <f>: float, <bool>: "True"/"False",
        ### <string>: "String", <freq>: "<f> Hz/kHz/MHz"
        ### [arg]: arg optional
        #Option     "SWcursor"              # [<bool>]
        #Option     "PciRetry"              # [<bool>]
        #Option     "NoAccel"               # [<bool>]
        #Option     "SetMClk"               # <freq>
        #Option     "MUXThreshold"          # <i>
        #Option     "ShadowFB"              # [<bool>]
        #Option     "Rotate"                # [<str>]
        #Option     "VideoKey"              # <i>
        #Option     "NoMMIO"                # [<bool>]
        #Option     "NoPciBurst"            # [<bool>]
        #Option     "MMIOonly"              # [<bool>]
        #Option     "CyberShadow"           # [<bool>]
        #Option     "CyberStretch"          # [<bool>]
        #Option     "XvHsync"               # <i>
        #Option     "XvVsync"               # <i>
        #Option     "XvBskew"               # <i>
        #Option     "XvRskew"               # <i>
        #Option     "FpDelay"               # <i>
        #Option     "Display1400"           # [<bool>]
        #Option     "Display"               # [<str>]
        #Option     "GammaBrightness"       # [<str>]
        #Option     "TVChipset"             # [<str>]
        #Option     "TVSignal"              # <i>
   Identifier  "Card0"
   Driver      "trident"
   VendorName  "Trident Microsystems"
   BoardName   "CyberBlade/i1"
   BusID       "PCI:1:0:0"
EndSection

Section "Screen"
   Identifier "Screen0"
   Device     "Card0"
   Monitor    "Monitor0"
   DefaultDepth 24
   SubSection "Display"
      Viewport   0 0
      Depth     16
      Modes     "800x600" "640x480"
   EndSubSection
   SubSection "Display"
      Viewport   0 0
      Depth     24
      Modes     "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480"
   EndSubSection
EndSection

Here's my /etc/fonts/font.conf and local.conf for both machines as well:
Code:
<?xml version="1.0"?>
<!DOCTYPE fontconfig SYSTEM "fonts.dtd">
<!-- /etc/fonts/fonts.conf file to configure system font access -->
<fontconfig>

<!--
   DO NOT EDIT THIS FILE.
   IT WILL BE REPLACED WHEN FONTCONFIG IS UPDATED.
   LOCAL CHANGES BELONG IN 'local.conf'.

   The intent of this standard configuration file is to be adequate for
   most environments.  If you have a reasonably normal environment and
   have found problems with this configuration, they are probably
   things that others will also want fixed.  Please submit any
   problems to the fontconfig bugzilla system located at fontconfig.org

   Note that the normal 'make install' procedure for fontconfig is to
   replace any existing fonts.conf file with the new version.  Place
   any local customizations in local.conf which this file references.

   Keith Packard
-->

<!-- Font directory list configured on  -->

   <dir>/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/Type1</dir>
   
   <dir>/usr/share/fonts</dir>
   <dir>/usr/local/share/fonts</dir>
   <dir>/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/75dpi</dir>
   <dir>/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/100dpi</dir>
   <dir>~/.fonts</dir>

<!--
  Accept deprecated 'mono' alias, replacing it with 'monospace'
-->
   <match target="pattern">
      <test qual="any" name="family">
         <string>mono</string>
      </test>
      <edit name="family" mode="assign">
         <string>monospace</string>
      </edit>
   </match>

<!--
  Accept alternate 'sans serif' spelling, replacing it with 'sans-serif'
-->
   <match target="pattern">
      <test qual="any" name="family">
         <string>sans serif</string>
      </test>
      <edit name="family" mode="assign">
         <string>sans-serif</string>
      </edit>
   </match>

<!--
  Accept deprecated 'sans' alias, replacing it with 'sans-serif'
-->
   <match target="pattern">
      <test qual="any" name="family">
         <string>sans</string>
      </test>
      <edit name="family" mode="assign">
         <string>sans-serif</string>
      </edit>
   </match>

<!--
  Mark common families with their generics so we'll get
  something reasonable
-->

<!--
  Serif faces
 -->
   <alias>
      <family>Bitstream Vera Serif</family>
      <family>Times</family>
      <family>Times New Roman</family>
      <family>Nimbus Roman No9 L</family>
      <family>Luxi Serif</family>
      <family>Kochi Mincho</family>
      <family>AR PL SungtiL GB</family>
      <family>AR PL Mingti2L Big5</family>
      <family>Baekmuk Batang</family>         
      <default><family>serif</family></default>
   </alias>
<!--
  Sans-serif faces
 -->
   <alias>
      <family>Bitstream Vera Sans</family>
      <family>Helvetica</family>
      <family>Arial</family>
      <family>Verdana</family>
      <family>Nimbus Sans L</family>
      <family>Luxi Sans</family>
      <family>Kochi Gothic</family>
      <family>AR PL KaitiM GB</family>
      <family>AR PL KaitiM Big5</family>
      <family>Baekmuk Dotum</family>
      <family>SimSun</family>
      <default><family>sans-serif</family></default>
   </alias>
<!--
  Monospace faces
 -->
    <alias>
      <family>Bitstream Vera Sans Mono</family>
      <family>Courier</family>
      <family>Courier New</family>
      <family>Andale Mono</family>
      <family>Luxi Mono</family>
      <family>Nimbus Mono L</family>
      <family>NSimSun</family>
      <default><family>monospace</family></default>
   </alias>
<!--
  If the font still has no generic name, add sans-serif
 -->
   <match target="pattern">
      <test qual="all" name="family" compare="not_eq">
         <string>sans-serif</string>
      </test>
      <test qual="all" name="family" compare="not_eq">
         <string>serif</string>
      </test>
      <test qual="all" name="family" compare="not_eq">
         <string>monospace</string>
      </test>
      <edit name="family" mode="append_last">
         <string>sans-serif</string>
      </edit>
   </match>
   
<!--
  Some Asian fonts misadvertise themselves as monospaced when
  in fact they are dual-spaced (half and full).  This makes
  FreeType very confused as it forces all widths to match.
  Undo this magic by disabling the width forcing code -->
   <match target="font">
      <test name="family"><string>GulimChe</string></test>
      <edit name="globaladvance"><bool>false</bool></edit>
   </match>
   
   <match target="font">
      <test name="family"><string>DotumChe</string></test>
      <edit name="globaladvance"><bool>false</bool></edit>
   </match>

   <match target="font">
      <test name="family"><string>BatangChe</string></test>
      <edit name="globaladvance"><bool>false</bool></edit>
   </match>

   <match target="font">
      <test name="family"><string>GungsuhChe</string></test>
      <edit name="globaladvance"><bool>false</bool></edit>
   </match>

<!--
   The Bitstream Vera fonts have GASP entries suggesting that hinting be
   disabled below 8 ppem, but FreeType ignores those, preferring to use
   the data found in the instructed hints.  The initial Vera release
   didn't include the right instructions in the 'prep' table. Fix this
   by disabling hinting manually at smaller sizes (< 8ppem)
 -->
   
   <match target="font">
      <test name="family">
         <string>Bitstream Vera Sans</string>
      </test>
      <test name="pixelsize" compare="less">
         <double>7.5</double>
      </test>
      <edit name="hinting">
         <bool>false</bool>
      </edit>
   </match>
   
   <match target="font">
      <test name="family">
         <string>Bitstream Vera Serif</string>
      </test>
      <test name="pixelsize" compare="less">
         <double>7.5</double>
      </test>
      <edit name="hinting">
         <bool>false</bool>
      </edit>
   </match>
   
   <match target="font">
      <test name="family">
         <string>Bitstream Vera Sans Mono</string>
      </test>
      <test name="pixelsize" compare="less">
         <double>7.5</double>
      </test>
      <edit name="hinting">
         <bool>false</bool>
      </edit>
   </match>
   
<!--
  Load per-user customization file
-->
   <include ignore_missing="yes">~/.fonts.conf</include>

<!--
  Load local system customization file
-->
   <include ignore_missing="yes">local.conf</include>

<!--
  Alias well known font names to available TrueType fonts
-->
   <alias>
      <family>Times</family>
      <accept><family>Times New Roman</family></accept>
   </alias>
   <alias>
      <family>Helvetica</family>
      <accept><family>Verdana</family></accept>
   </alias>
   <alias>
      <family>Arial</family>
      <accept><family>Verdana</family></accept>
   </alias>
   <alias>
      <family>Courier</family>
      <accept><family>Courier New</family></accept>
   </alias>

<!--
 Check user preference to avoid bitmap fonts and replace
 bitmap face names with equivalent scalable fonts
 -->

   <match target="pattern">
           <test name="prefer_outline">
                   <bool>true</bool>
           </test>
           <test name="family">
                   <string>Helvetica</string>
           </test>
           <edit name="family" mode="prepend" binding="same">
                   <string>Arial</string>
           </edit>
   </match>

   <match target="pattern">
           <test name="prefer_outline">
                   <bool>true</bool>
           </test>
           <test name="family">
                   <string>Times</string>
           </test>
           <edit name="family" mode="prepend" binding="same">
                   <string>Times New Roman</string>
           </edit>
   </match>
<!--
  Provide required aliases for standard names
-->
   <alias>
      <family>serif</family>
      <prefer>
         <family>Bitstream Vera Serif</family>
         <family>Times New Roman</family>
         <family>Nimbus Roman No9 L</family>
         <family>Luxi Serif</family>
         <family>Times</family>
         <family>Kochi Mincho</family>
         <family>AR PL SungtiL GB</family>
         <family>AR PL Mingti2L Big5</family>
         <family>Baekmuk Batang</family>         
      </prefer>
   </alias>
   <alias>
      <family>sans-serif</family>
      <prefer>
         <family>Bitstream Vera Sans</family>
         <family>Verdana</family>
         <family>Nimbus Sans L</family>
         <family>Luxi Sans</family>
         <family>Arial</family>
         <family>Helvetica</family>
         <family>Kochi Gothic</family>
         <family>AR PL KaitiM GB</family>
         <family>AR PL KaitiM Big5</family>
         <family>Baekmuk Dotum</family>
         <family>SimSun</family>
      </prefer>
   </alias>
   <alias>
      <family>monospace</family>
      <prefer>
         <family>Bitstream Vera Sans Mono</family>
         <family>Andale Mono</family>
         <family>Courier New</family>
         <family>Luxi Mono</family>
         <family>Nimbus Mono L</family>
         <family>Kochi Gothic</family>
         <family>AR PL KaitiM GB</family>
         <family>Baekmuk Dotum</family>
      </prefer>
   </alias>

<!--
 Artificial oblique for fonts without an italic or oblique version
 -->
 
   <match target="font">
      <!-- check to see if the font is roman -->
      <test name="slant">
         <const>roman</const>
      </test>
      <!-- check to see if the pattern requested non-roman -->
      <test target="pattern" name="slant" compare="not_eq">
         <const>roman</const>
      </test>
      <!-- multiply the matrix to slant the font -->
      <edit name="matrix" mode="assign">
         <times>
            <name>matrix</name>
            <matrix><double>1</double><double>0.2</double>
               <double>0</double><double>1</double>
            </matrix>
         </times>
      </edit>
      <!-- pretend the font is oblique now -->
      <edit name="slant" mode="assign">
         <const>oblique</const>
      </edit>
   </match>

   <config>
<!--
  These are the default Unicode chars that are expected to be blank
  in fonts.  All other blank chars are assumed to be broken and
  won't appear in the resulting charsets
 -->
      <blank>
         <int>0x0020</int>   <!-- SPACE -->
         <int>0x00a0</int>   <!-- NO-BREAK SPACE -->
         <int>0x00ad</int>   <!-- SOFT HYPHEN -->
         <int>0x115f</int>   <!-- HANGUL CHOSEONG FILLER -->
         <int>0x1160</int>   <!-- HANGUL JUNGSEONG FILLER -->
         <int>0x1680</int>   <!-- OGHAM SPACE MARK -->
         <int>0x2000</int>   <!-- EN QUAD -->
         <int>0x2001</int>   <!-- EM QUAD -->
         <int>0x2002</int>   <!-- EN SPACE -->
         <int>0x2003</int>   <!-- EM SPACE -->
         <int>0x2004</int>   <!-- THREE-PER-EM SPACE -->
         <int>0x2005</int>   <!-- FOUR-PER-EM SPACE -->
         <int>0x2006</int>   <!-- SIX-PER-EM SPACE -->
         <int>0x2007</int>   <!-- FIGURE SPACE -->
         <int>0x2008</int>   <!-- PUNCTUATION SPACE -->
         <int>0x2009</int>   <!-- THIN SPACE -->
         <int>0x200a</int>   <!-- HAIR SPACE -->
         <int>0x200b</int>   <!-- ZERO WIDTH SPACE -->
         <int>0x200c</int>   <!-- ZERO WIDTH NON-JOINER -->
         <int>0x200d</int>   <!-- ZERO WIDTH JOINER -->
         <int>0x200e</int>   <!-- LEFT-TO-RIGHT MARK -->
         <int>0x200f</int>   <!-- RIGHT-TO-LEFT MARK -->
         <int>0x2028</int>   <!-- LINE SEPARATOR -->
         <int>0x2029</int>   <!-- PARAGRAPH SEPARATOR -->
         <int>0x202a</int>   <!-- LEFT-TO-RIGHT EMBEDDING -->
         <int>0x202b</int>   <!-- RIGHT-TO-LEFT EMBEDDING -->
         <int>0x202c</int>   <!-- POP DIRECTIONAL FORMATTING -->
         <int>0x202d</int>   <!-- LEFT-TO-RIGHT OVERRIDE -->
         <int>0x202e</int>   <!-- RIGHT-TO-LEFT OVERRIDE -->
         <int>0x202f</int>   <!-- NARROW NO-BREAK SPACE -->
         <int>0x205f</int>   <!-- MEDIUM MATHEMATICAL SPACE -->
         <int>0x2060</int>   <!-- WORD JOINER -->
         <int>0x2061</int>   <!-- FUNCTION APPLICATION -->
         <int>0x2062</int>   <!-- INVISIBLE TIMES -->
         <int>0x2063</int>   <!-- INVISIBLE SEPARATOR -->
         <int>0x206A</int>   <!-- INHIBIT SYMMETRIC SWAPPING -->
         <int>0x206B</int>   <!-- ACTIVATE SYMMETRIC SWAPPING -->
         <int>0x206C</int>   <!-- INHIBIT ARABIC FORM SHAPING -->
         <int>0x206D</int>   <!-- ACTIVATE ARABIC FORM SHAPING -->
         <int>0x206E</int>   <!-- NATIONAL DIGIT SHAPES -->
         <int>0x206F</int>   <!-- NOMINAL DIGIT SHAPES -->
         <int>0x3000</int>   <!-- IDEOGRAPHIC SPACE -->
         <int>0x3164</int>   <!-- HANGUL FILLER -->
         <int>0xfeff</int>   <!-- ZERO WIDTH NO-BREAK SPACE -->
         <int>0xffa0</int>   <!-- HALFWIDTH HANGUL FILLER -->
         <int>0xfff9</int>   <!-- INTERLINEAR ANNOTATION ANCHOR -->
         <int>0xfffa</int>   <!-- INTERLINEAR ANNOTATION SEPARATOR -->
         <int>0xfffb</int>   <!-- INTERLINEAR ANNOTATION TERMINATOR -->
      </blank>
<!--
  Rescan configuration every 30 seconds when FcFontSetList is called
 -->
      <rescan>
         <int>30</int>
      </rescan>
   </config>

</fontconfig>

local.conf
Code:
<?xml version="1.0"?>
<!DOCTYPE fontconfig SYSTEM "fonts.dtd">
<!-- /etc/fonts/local.conf file for local customizations -->
<fontconfig>
<!--
  Enable sub-pixel rendering
   <match target="font">
      <edit name="rgba" mode="assign"><const>rgb</const></edit>
   </match>
-->
</fontconfig>

and for the laptop:
Code:
<?xml version="1.0"?>
<!DOCTYPE fontconfig SYSTEM "fonts.dtd">
<!-- /etc/fonts/fonts.conf file to configure system font access -->
<fontconfig>

<!--
   DO NOT EDIT THIS FILE.
   IT WILL BE REPLACED WHEN FONTCONFIG IS UPDATED.
   LOCAL CHANGES BELONG IN 'local.conf'.

   The intent of this standard configuration file is to be adequate for
   most environments.  If you have a reasonably normal environment and
   have found problems with this configuration, they are probably
   things that others will also want fixed.  Please submit any
   problems to the fontconfig bugzilla system located at fontconfig.org

   Note that the normal 'make install' procedure for fontconfig is to
   replace any existing fonts.conf file with the new version.  Place
   any local customizations in local.conf which this file references.

   Keith Packard
-->

<!-- Font directory list configured on  -->

   <dir>/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/Type1</dir>
   
   <dir>/usr/share/fonts</dir>
   <dir>/usr/local/share/fonts</dir>
   <dir>/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/75dpi</dir>
   <dir>/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/100dpi</dir>
   <dir>~/.fonts</dir>

<!--
  Accept deprecated 'mono' alias, replacing it with 'monospace'
-->
   <match target="pattern">
      <test qual="any" name="family">
         <string>mono</string>
      </test>
      <edit name="family" mode="assign">
         <string>monospace</string>
      </edit>
   </match>

<!--
  Accept alternate 'sans serif' spelling, replacing it with 'sans-serif'
-->
   <match target="pattern">
      <test qual="any" name="family">
         <string>sans serif</string>
      </test>
      <edit name="family" mode="assign">
         <string>sans-serif</string>
      </edit>
   </match>

<!--
  Accept deprecated 'sans' alias, replacing it with 'sans-serif'
-->
   <match target="pattern">
      <test qual="any" name="family">
         <string>sans</string>
      </test>
      <edit name="family" mode="assign">
         <string>sans-serif</string>
      </edit>
   </match>

<!--
  Mark common families with their generics so we'll get
  something reasonable
-->

<!--
  Serif faces
 -->
   <alias>
      <family>Bitstream Vera Serif</family>
      <family>Times</family>
      <family>Times New Roman</family>
      <family>Nimbus Roman No9 L</family>
      <family>Luxi Serif</family>
      <family>Kochi Mincho</family>
      <family>AR PL SungtiL GB</family>
      <family>AR PL Mingti2L Big5</family>
      <family>Baekmuk Batang</family>         
      <default><family>serif</family></default>
   </alias>
<!--
  Sans-serif faces
 -->
   <alias>
      <family>Bitstream Vera Sans</family>
      <family>Helvetica</family>
      <family>Arial</family>
      <family>Verdana</family>
      <family>Nimbus Sans L</family>
      <family>Luxi Sans</family>
      <family>Kochi Gothic</family>
      <family>AR PL KaitiM GB</family>
      <family>AR PL KaitiM Big5</family>
      <family>Baekmuk Dotum</family>
      <family>SimSun</family>
      <default><family>sans-serif</family></default>
   </alias>
<!--
  Monospace faces
 -->
    <alias>
      <family>Bitstream Vera Sans Mono</family>
      <family>Courier</family>
      <family>Courier New</family>
      <family>Andale Mono</family>
      <family>Luxi Mono</family>
      <family>Nimbus Mono L</family>
      <family>NSimSun</family>
      <default><family>monospace</family></default>
   </alias>
<!--
  If the font still has no generic name, add sans-serif
 -->
   <match target="pattern">
      <test qual="all" name="family" compare="not_eq">
         <string>sans-serif</string>
      </test>
      <test qual="all" name="family" compare="not_eq">
         <string>serif</string>
      </test>
      <test qual="all" name="family" compare="not_eq">
         <string>monospace</string>
      </test>
      <edit name="family" mode="append_last">
         <string>sans-serif</string>
      </edit>
   </match>
   
<!--
  Some Asian fonts misadvertise themselves as monospaced when
  in fact they are dual-spaced (half and full).  This makes
  FreeType very confused as it forces all widths to match.
  Undo this magic by disabling the width forcing code -->
   <match target="font">
      <test name="family"><string>GulimChe</string></test>
      <edit name="globaladvance"><bool>false</bool></edit>
   </match>
   
   <match target="font">
      <test name="family"><string>DotumChe</string></test>
      <edit name="globaladvance"><bool>false</bool></edit>
   </match>

   <match target="font">
      <test name="family"><string>BatangChe</string></test>
      <edit name="globaladvance"><bool>false</bool></edit>
   </match>

   <match target="font">
      <test name="family"><string>GungsuhChe</string></test>
      <edit name="globaladvance"><bool>false</bool></edit>
   </match>

<!--
   The Bitstream Vera fonts have GASP entries suggesting that hinting be
   disabled below 8 ppem, but FreeType ignores those, preferring to use
   the data found in the instructed hints.  The initial Vera release
   didn't include the right instructions in the 'prep' table. Fix this
   by disabling hinting manually at smaller sizes (< 8ppem)
 -->
   
   <match target="font">
      <test name="family">
         <string>Bitstream Vera Sans</string>
      </test>
      <test name="pixelsize" compare="less">
         <double>7.5</double>
      </test>
      <edit name="hinting">
         <bool>false</bool>
      </edit>
   </match>
   
   <match target="font">
      <test name="family">
         <string>Bitstream Vera Serif</string>
      </test>
      <test name="pixelsize" compare="less">
         <double>7.5</double>
      </test>
      <edit name="hinting">
         <bool>false</bool>
      </edit>
   </match>
   
   <match target="font">
      <test name="family">
         <string>Bitstream Vera Sans Mono</string>
      </test>
      <test name="pixelsize" compare="less">
         <double>7.5</double>
      </test>
      <edit name="hinting">
         <bool>false</bool>
      </edit>
   </match>
   
<!--
  Load per-user customization file
-->
   <include ignore_missing="yes">~/.fonts.conf</include>

<!--
  Load local system customization file
-->
   <include ignore_missing="yes">local.conf</include>

<!--
  Alias well known font names to available TrueType fonts
-->
   <alias>
      <family>Times</family>
      <accept><family>Times New Roman</family></accept>
   </alias>
   <alias>
      <family>Helvetica</family>
      <accept><family>Verdana</family></accept>
   </alias>
   <alias>
      <family>Arial</family>
      <accept><family>Verdana</family></accept>
   </alias>
   <alias>
      <family>Courier</family>
      <accept><family>Courier New</family></accept>
   </alias>

<!--
 Check user preference to avoid bitmap fonts and replace
 bitmap face names with equivalent scalable fonts
 -->

   <match target="pattern">
           <test name="prefer_outline">
                   <bool>true</bool>
           </test>
           <test name="family">
                   <string>Helvetica</string>
           </test>
           <edit name="family" mode="prepend" binding="same">
                   <string>Arial</string>
           </edit>
   </match>

   <match target="pattern">
           <test name="prefer_outline">
                   <bool>true</bool>
           </test>
           <test name="family">
                   <string>Times</string>
           </test>
           <edit name="family" mode="prepend" binding="same">
                   <string>Times New Roman</string>
           </edit>
   </match>
<!--
  Provide required aliases for standard names
-->
   <alias>
      <family>serif</family>
      <prefer>
         <family>Bitstream Vera Serif</family>
         <family>Times New Roman</family>
         <family>Nimbus Roman No9 L</family>
         <family>Luxi Serif</family>
         <family>Times</family>
         <family>Kochi Mincho</family>
         <family>AR PL SungtiL GB</family>
         <family>AR PL Mingti2L Big5</family>
         <family>Baekmuk Batang</family>         
      </prefer>
   </alias>
   <alias>
      <family>sans-serif</family>
      <prefer>
         <family>Bitstream Vera Sans</family>
         <family>Verdana</family>
         <family>Nimbus Sans L</family>
         <family>Luxi Sans</family>
         <family>Arial</family>
         <family>Helvetica</family>
         <family>Kochi Gothic</family>
         <family>AR PL KaitiM GB</family>
         <family>AR PL KaitiM Big5</family>
         <family>Baekmuk Dotum</family>
         <family>SimSun</family>
      </prefer>
   </alias>
   <alias>
      <family>monospace</family>
      <prefer>
         <family>Bitstream Vera Sans Mono</family>
         <family>Andale Mono</family>
         <family>Courier New</family>
         <family>Luxi Mono</family>
         <family>Nimbus Mono L</family>
         <family>Kochi Gothic</family>
         <family>AR PL KaitiM GB</family>
         <family>Baekmuk Dotum</family>
      </prefer>
   </alias>

<!--
 Artificial oblique for fonts without an italic or oblique version
 -->
 
   <match target="font">
      <!-- check to see if the font is roman -->
      <test name="slant">
         <const>roman</const>
      </test>
      <!-- check to see if the pattern requested non-roman -->
      <test target="pattern" name="slant" compare="not_eq">
         <const>roman</const>
      </test>
      <!-- multiply the matrix to slant the font -->
      <edit name="matrix" mode="assign">
         <times>
            <name>matrix</name>
            <matrix><double>1</double><double>0.2</double>
               <double>0</double><double>1</double>
            </matrix>
         </times>
      </edit>
      <!-- pretend the font is oblique now -->
      <edit name="slant" mode="assign">
         <const>oblique</const>
      </edit>
   </match>

   <config>
<!--
  These are the default Unicode chars that are expected to be blank
  in fonts.  All other blank chars are assumed to be broken and
  won't appear in the resulting charsets
 -->
      <blank>
         <int>0x0020</int>   <!-- SPACE -->
         <int>0x00a0</int>   <!-- NO-BREAK SPACE -->
         <int>0x00ad</int>   <!-- SOFT HYPHEN -->
         <int>0x115f</int>   <!-- HANGUL CHOSEONG FILLER -->
         <int>0x1160</int>   <!-- HANGUL JUNGSEONG FILLER -->
         <int>0x1680</int>   <!-- OGHAM SPACE MARK -->
         <int>0x2000</int>   <!-- EN QUAD -->
         <int>0x2001</int>   <!-- EM QUAD -->
         <int>0x2002</int>   <!-- EN SPACE -->
         <int>0x2003</int>   <!-- EM SPACE -->
         <int>0x2004</int>   <!-- THREE-PER-EM SPACE -->
         <int>0x2005</int>   <!-- FOUR-PER-EM SPACE -->
         <int>0x2006</int>   <!-- SIX-PER-EM SPACE -->
         <int>0x2007</int>   <!-- FIGURE SPACE -->
         <int>0x2008</int>   <!-- PUNCTUATION SPACE -->
         <int>0x2009</int>   <!-- THIN SPACE -->
         <int>0x200a</int>   <!-- HAIR SPACE -->
         <int>0x200b</int>   <!-- ZERO WIDTH SPACE -->
         <int>0x200c</int>   <!-- ZERO WIDTH NON-JOINER -->
         <int>0x200d</int>   <!-- ZERO WIDTH JOINER -->
         <int>0x200e</int>   <!-- LEFT-TO-RIGHT MARK -->
         <int>0x200f</int>   <!-- RIGHT-TO-LEFT MARK -->
         <int>0x2028</int>   <!-- LINE SEPARATOR -->
         <int>0x2029</int>   <!-- PARAGRAPH SEPARATOR -->
         <int>0x202a</int>   <!-- LEFT-TO-RIGHT EMBEDDING -->
         <int>0x202b</int>   <!-- RIGHT-TO-LEFT EMBEDDING -->
         <int>0x202c</int>   <!-- POP DIRECTIONAL FORMATTING -->
         <int>0x202d</int>   <!-- LEFT-TO-RIGHT OVERRIDE -->
         <int>0x202e</int>   <!-- RIGHT-TO-LEFT OVERRIDE -->
         <int>0x202f</int>   <!-- NARROW NO-BREAK SPACE -->
         <int>0x205f</int>   <!-- MEDIUM MATHEMATICAL SPACE -->
         <int>0x2060</int>   <!-- WORD JOINER -->
         <int>0x2061</int>   <!-- FUNCTION APPLICATION -->
         <int>0x2062</int>   <!-- INVISIBLE TIMES -->
         <int>0x2063</int>   <!-- INVISIBLE SEPARATOR -->
         <int>0x206A</int>   <!-- INHIBIT SYMMETRIC SWAPPING -->
         <int>0x206B</int>   <!-- ACTIVATE SYMMETRIC SWAPPING -->
         <int>0x206C</int>   <!-- INHIBIT ARABIC FORM SHAPING -->
         <int>0x206D</int>   <!-- ACTIVATE ARABIC FORM SHAPING -->
         <int>0x206E</int>   <!-- NATIONAL DIGIT SHAPES -->
         <int>0x206F</int>   <!-- NOMINAL DIGIT SHAPES -->
         <int>0x3000</int>   <!-- IDEOGRAPHIC SPACE -->
         <int>0x3164</int>   <!-- HANGUL FILLER -->
         <int>0xfeff</int>   <!-- ZERO WIDTH NO-BREAK SPACE -->
         <int>0xffa0</int>   <!-- HALFWIDTH HANGUL FILLER -->
         <int>0xfff9</int>   <!-- INTERLINEAR ANNOTATION ANCHOR -->
         <int>0xfffa</int>   <!-- INTERLINEAR ANNOTATION SEPARATOR -->
         <int>0xfffb</int>   <!-- INTERLINEAR ANNOTATION TERMINATOR -->
      </blank>
<!--
  Rescan configuration every 30 seconds when FcFontSetList is called
 -->
      <rescan>
         <int>30</int>
      </rescan>
   </config>

</fontconfig>

local.conf:
Code:
<?xml version="1.0"?>
<!DOCTYPE fontconfig SYSTEM "fonts.dtd">
<!-- /etc/fonts/local.conf file for local customizations -->
<fontconfig>
   <match target="font">
      <edit name="rgba" mode="assign"><const>rgb</const></edit>
   </match>
</fontconfig>


Hopefully, those are all the relevant files, but probably not.
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widremann
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Veteran


Joined: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 1314

PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

user317 wrote:
everything "just worked" here on my first install :). next time you are going to have some missing dll problem in MS are you going to bitch on the ms forums and tell them how you are switching to *nix because "it just works". you are obviosly doing something wrong, instead of complaining post your X11 config or your font config, what monitor are you using, do you have dpi set correctly ect... gentoo isnt for the feint of heart, if you dont want to deal with all these configuration issues to get you system just right why dont you put a knoppix disk in your cd drive and reboot :).

It's not so much that I want to get my system just right it's that I want the basic stuff to work. I don't see why it shouldn't. You guys can dance around the issue all you want ("it's about choice, power, flexibility, blah blah blah"), but the fact is, some stuff really needs to just work. Having flexibility and configuration options is a very good thing. That's one of the things I like about Linux. Having to fight with configuration files, broken packages and software, having to google just to get something as basic as X to work, without doing anything fancy, just getting it to do what it is supposed to do is NOT a good thing. If I want to extend things to make them work like I want to, fine. That's not what we are talking about here.
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gwolf
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Guru


Joined: 05 May 2005
Posts: 374
Location: Estonia

PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try turning antialiasing off and see what happens, I have it turned off, because antialiased fonts look fuzzy.
If you are used to MSWin fonts, emerge corefonts and change the resolution to 96 dpi...
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widremann
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Joined: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 1314

PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gwolf wrote:
Try turning antialiasing off and see what happens, I have it turned off, because antialiased fonts look fuzzy.
If you are used to MSWin fonts, emerge corefonts and change the resolution to 96 dpi...

That just makes it worse. It also proves that anti-aliasing is on.
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G.N.A.
Tux's lil' helper
Tux's lil' helper


Joined: 15 Mar 2004
Posts: 81

PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

widremann wrote:
user317 wrote:
everything "just worked" here on my first install :). next time you are going to have some missing dll problem in MS are you going to bitch on the ms forums and tell them how you are switching to *nix because "it just works". you are obviosly doing something wrong, instead of complaining post your X11 config or your font config, what monitor are you using, do you have dpi set correctly ect... gentoo isnt for the feint of heart, if you dont want to deal with all these configuration issues to get you system just right why dont you put a knoppix disk in your cd drive and reboot :).

It's not so much that I want to get my system just right it's that I want the basic stuff to work. I don't see why it shouldn't. You guys can dance around the issue all you want ("it's about choice, power, flexibility, blah blah blah"), but the fact is, some stuff really needs to just work. Having flexibility and configuration options is a very good thing. That's one of the things I like about Linux. Having to fight with configuration files, broken packages and software, having to google just to get something as basic as X to work, without doing anything fancy, just getting it to do what it is supposed to do is NOT a good thing. If I want to extend things to make them work like I want to, fine. That's not what we are talking about here.


Believe it or not but Windows spent a LOT of money on their interface, and fonts in general. I agree with you that Linux fonts are not as polished as some of the windows are. I do also find that linux menus "just come up" rather than the strange pausing I can get in windows. Now I can't prove this pausing is due to their font design.. but I wouldn't doubt it.

"Just work" is also a relative term in windows. I would rather configure something to work rather than have my OS decide for me.. and then get bent over later because my security model is shot... but hey.. look at my fonts!

Good luck on this,
GNA
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

widremann wrote:
There is no xfs package, so I can't emerge that (or at least emerge xfs doesn't work and I didn't have much luck finding out what package it comes with), assuming, of course, that that's even part of the problem

Me too. Set up XFS with setting the fontserver use flag in /etc/make.conf. Then you need to sit down and have a couple of drinks when compiling for a long time doing an
Code:
emerge --update --deep --newuse world
Give it a last try ;)
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you have kde then you should have ksnapshot which will allow you to take screenshots. Maybe it'd help to post one so we can see what the fonts actually look like.
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 8:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Epyon wrote:
If you have kde then you should have ksnapshot which will allow you to take screenshots. Maybe it'd help to post one so we can see what the fonts actually look like.
Once again, I don't have ANY tools to take screenshots. Believe me, if I did, I would.
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try this two tiny steps. It will take you only a few minutes.
Code:
emerge corefonts

Then edit /usr/kde/3.3/share/config/kdm/Xservers (your version may be different, i'm using KDE 3.3)
There should be lines like these
Code:
:0 local@tty1 /usr/bin/X -nolisten tcp -dpi 96
#:1 local@tty2 reserve /usr/bin/X -nolisten tcp :1
#:2 local@tty3 reserve /usr/bin/X -nolisten tcp :2
#:3 local@tty4 reserve /usr/bin/X -nolisten tcp :3
#:4 local@tty5 reserve /usr/bin/X -nolisten tcp :4

Notice -dpi 96 option. In your config will be missing, so add it. This should make your fonts look better. Run X (or restart). Don't scare when you see your KDE now (fonts are huge). Go to Control Center (KControl) and change your font sizes there by about 3 or 4. As you've emerged corefonts, you should now see that some of Windows fonts appeared in list. Make your time and choose your font. Maybe you might try to use sub-pixel hinting. It's set at same place as fonts and anti-aliasing.
At KControl you're also able to add your own fonts (yes, TTF are also supported) at section above by Font Installer. Use it as a user to add fonts only for yourself or switch to Superuser mode to add fonts system-wide.
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 8:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DRSON wrote:
Try this two tiny steps. It will take you only a few minutes.
Code:
emerge corefonts

Then edit /usr/kde/3.3/share/config/kdm/Xservers (your version may be different, i'm using KDE 3.3)
There should be lines like these
Code:
:0 local@tty1 /usr/bin/X -nolisten tcp -dpi 96
#:1 local@tty2 reserve /usr/bin/X -nolisten tcp :1
#:2 local@tty3 reserve /usr/bin/X -nolisten tcp :2
#:3 local@tty4 reserve /usr/bin/X -nolisten tcp :3
#:4 local@tty5 reserve /usr/bin/X -nolisten tcp :4

Notice -dpi 96 option. In your config will be missing, so add it. This should make your fonts look better. Run X (or restart). Don't scare when you see your KDE now (fonts are huge). Go to Control Center (KControl) and change your font sizes there by about 3 or 4. As you've emerged corefonts, you should now see that some of Windows fonts appeared in list. Make your time and choose your font. Maybe you might try to use sub-pixel hinting. It's set at same place as fonts and anti-aliasing.
At KControl you're also able to add your own fonts (yes, TTF are also supported) at section above by Font Installer. Use it as a user to add fonts only for yourself or switch to Superuser mode to add fonts system-wide.

I tried all that except -dpi 96 (I was using -dpi 100). I don't think it actually made a difference, although the fonts may look every so slightly better. After a little bit more tweaking with the exact fonts and sizes, I think it is just over the threshold of tolerable. It still doesn't look as nice as it did in Fedora. The Konsole font back then was just beautiful...

Interestingly, I have XFS installed on the tower, but not on the laptop. I don't recall ever explicitly emerging it (especially since there emerge xfs doesn't work), but it's there nonetheless. I doubt it makes a difference though.
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

widremann wrote:
Interestingly, I have XFS installed on the tower, but not on the laptop. I don't recall ever explicitly emerging it (especially since there emerge xfs doesn't work), but it's there nonetheless. I doubt it makes a difference though.

Its a useflag as I have posted!
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 8:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Ugly fonts (perhaps my last straw with Gentoo) Reply with quote

widremann wrote:

If I can get a solution, great. It would be much appreciated. If not, I'm going back to Windows. Not because I'm stupid, not because I hate Linux, not because I like Microsoft. It's because stuff works. In my mind, a basic desktop setup should just work. I guess I chose the wrong distro. I liked Gentoo at first because it was fast, portage made sense, the system setup made sense, there was great documentation and a great community all in one place. It had more software available than Fedora and despite the long compile times, I felt like it ran better than Fedora and even Windows. Things have changed, and I'm getting tired now of stuff breaking. I know I'm not alone. I really like Linux/Unix (and don't get me wrong, tinkering is something I like to do), but I hate broken software with a passion and I hate having to deal with it day in and day out now, only toh ave things get even more screwed up, and this for things that should just work. It's one thing if I'm playing with some new piece of software ors ome special project. But this is basic stuff. It should just work. End of story.


This is very unconstructive and naive.

The printscreen button should take a screenshot in any windowed environment or emerge whatever software you feel you need to to get a screenshot then let us help you fix your fonts.
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

widremann wrote:

I tried all that except -dpi 96 (I was using -dpi 100). I don't think it actually made a difference, although the fonts may look every so slightly better. After a little bit more tweaking with the exact fonts and sizes, I think it is just over the threshold of tolerable. It still doesn't look as nice as it did in Fedora. The Konsole font back then was just beautiful...


As we can't see how ugly your KDE is and what should be changed, i will give you my config at 1024x768 at my laptop. Give it a shot.
Fixed width : Fixed [Misc] 8
Toolbar : Arial 7
Everything else is Arial 8
Use antialiased fonts [checked]
In advanced button next to it:
Exlude rande 8-15
Use sub-pixel hinting RGB - medium

I tried to translate titles of settings, as I have KDE in Czech, so it may differ from English naming.
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PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2005 11:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Ugly fonts (perhaps my last straw with Gentoo) Reply with quote

jonnevers wrote:
widremann wrote:

If I can get a solution, great. It would be much appreciated. If not, I'm going back to Windows. Not because I'm stupid, not because I hate Linux, not because I like Microsoft. It's because stuff works. In my mind, a basic desktop setup should just work. I guess I chose the wrong distro. I liked Gentoo at first because it was fast, portage made sense, the system setup made sense, there was great documentation and a great community all in one place. It had more software available than Fedora and despite the long compile times, I felt like it ran better than Fedora and even Windows. Things have changed, and I'm getting tired now of stuff breaking. I know I'm not alone. I really like Linux/Unix (and don't get me wrong, tinkering is something I like to do), but I hate broken software with a passion and I hate having to deal with it day in and day out now, only toh ave things get even more screwed up, and this for things that should just work. It's one thing if I'm playing with some new piece of software ors ome special project. But this is basic stuff. It should just work. End of story.


This is very unconstructive and naive.

The printscreen button should take a screenshot in any windowed environment or emerge whatever software you feel you need to to get a screenshot then let us help you fix your fonts.

No, it's very constructive and reasonable. Issues like this shouldn't happen. I have to fault X11, not Gentoo here, although it's more difficult to take care of in Gentoo than it is in other distros. But many others have ranted and raved about the problems with X11, so I need not repeat them again.

As far as printscreen, again, I have NO graphics programs...none. Even if the printscreen button worked on my laptop in Linux, which it doesn't, I still wouldn't be able to make a picture for you guys. But that will change when I emerge kdegraphics or ImageMagick, I don't know which one I'll do first. And rest assured, as soon as that is done emerging (I have distcc setup, which has helped compile times somewhat), I will post a picture to show the fonts.
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2005 12:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alright, after tweaking fonts, sizes, resolutions, anti-aliasing settings, sub-pixel rendering and all that, I think I finally got fonts to look nice-ish again. The Konsole font still needs some work, but elsewhere, it's much better. Still entirely too much work, IMHO.
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2005 4:06 am    Post subject: Hmm xorg ? Reply with quote

recompile xorg-x11 with USE flags: bitmap-fonts truetype-fonts type1-fonts . It *should* work fine out of the box.
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2005 5:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Code:
emerge ttf-bitstream-vera


Open up the KDE Control Center and change all your fonts over to bitstream-vera-sans (except the fixed font which should be set to bitstream-vera-sans-mono). I had have mine set to 10, but that might be too small for you. If you are running an LCD, you are going to want to set the DPI to 72 (yes it makes a difference and so does 100 from 96). You cant specify that in KDE so you are going to have to set it in X before you login. Do so by the following:


Code:
#nano /usr/bin/startx


Change line:

Quote:
defaultserverargs="-nolisten tcp -br"


to

Quote:
defaultserverargs="-dpi 72 -nolisten tcp -br"


If you have a clunky CRT, you are most likely fine with 96 but can tweak the DPI in the file above if you want to fine tune. It makes a huge difference. If you had nice fonts in Fedora, then you can have them here, just gotta get all the right settings.
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2005 5:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

widremann wrote:
Interestingly, I have XFS installed on the tower, but not on the laptop. I don't recall ever explicitly emerging it (especially since there emerge xfs doesn't work), but it's there nonetheless. I doubt it makes a difference though.


XFS gets installed with X. All it does it manage your fonts and is completely unecessary. All I keep hearing is you doubt this would make a difference or you doubt that would make a difference, but correct me if I am wrong. You are here because you dont know what to do, so instead of just not doing something thinking it wont make a difference...TRY IT!!! Then draw conclusions.
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2005 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Below is a screenshot of some poorly rendered text in Konqueror (from Slashdot). Notice how the letters are all messed up. That's generally the problem I'm having elsewhere. The letters are sometimes too thin or misproportioned. It's subtle, but noticeable. I'll try recompiling xorg-x11 with those flags as soon as I'm done compiling KDE (which, as you all know, will take some time).

http://www.cs.unc.edu/~feiner/snapshot1.png
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2005 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's annoying indeed.

I don't know much about fonts, but doesn't it look like font hinting isn't working properly? Actually, I don't know almost anything about fonts, so I'm probably way off.
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2005 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

widremann wrote:
Below is a screenshot of some poorly rendered text in Konqueror (from Slashdot). Notice how the letters are all messed up. That's generally the problem I'm having elsewhere. The letters are sometimes too thin or misproportioned. It's subtle, but noticeable. I'll try recompiling xorg-x11 with those flags as soon as I'm done compiling KDE (which, as you all know, will take some time).

http://www.cs.unc.edu/~feiner/snapshot1.png


Dont waste your time recompiling xorg. Its not going to help you and those bitmap fonts wont fix your problem since you are using truetype fonts anyway (personally I dont have those fonts installed). Recompiling KDE or xorg is going to be fruitless.
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2005 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fonts requires a lot of homework to get right. In the old days, xfs was more important
than it is today because it separated into two separate processes the X display manager
functionality from the font rendering functionality. Nowadays, _most_ applications render
themselves by calling directly into freetype via Xft/Xft2. If you type the command:
Code:
ldd `which <program>`

more often than not you will see libfreetype in the list -- telling you "this is a program that
renders itself." That said, xfs still does have uses that go beyond merely font rendering.
I think today, it's best viewed as merely a font _delivery_ mechanism. I wouldn't focus on
xfs. In fact, I would not use it to debug your font problems. Use the X server /etc/X11/xorg.conf
FontPath directives, in the traditional way (for now) to reduce the complexity of your setup.
Be aware that the order that FontPaths are presented matters as the first matching font will be
used if there are several matches.

You then need to understand these concepts/programs: Xft2 and fontconfig -- the "modern"
way fonts are configured. Files include: /etc/fonts/fonts.conf (don't edit that) and
/etc/fonts/local.conf (edit as root for system-wide font configs) and ~/.fonts.conf in your
home directory for personal font configuration.

You need to understand about the freetype library. It offers (depending on how you compile
it, i.e. with bindist or not) the TrueType Byte Code Interpreter or its own "autohinter." You typically
must decide which route you want to go (TT bci or FT autohinting) on your box. Also note that
later versions of freetype can produce different results. Most people I believe still defer to the
TT bci with freetype, although its autohinter is a work in progress and is improving,

Then you have to go about configuring your fonts. Most people follow the helpful HOWTO and wiki
as it has an abundance of ideas, esp. for Mozilla Firefox. Usually you want to anti-alias a range of
font sizes, e.g. between 8 and 14, but it's your choice. There are also hinting settings: full, medium,
slight and none you can blend in to the anti-aliasing. Note that "hinting" and "autohinting" are not the
same thing.

If you have and LCD you should be aware of sub-pixel rendering and what you have to do to try that out.

You can indeed spend a great deal of time learn how to and configuring fonts. It's time well spent.
You'll find yourself looking at the way certain fonts render and tweaking them or substituting them
entirely for something better.

Someone really ought to write a helper application that presents fonts the way an opthalmologist has you
read the eye chart as he changes your lenses (i.e. "is this better" or "is that better") with the output
of such an application a fully configured .fonts.conf -- what a useful appl. that would be. Until such
an appl. is written, we have to configure fonts ourselves.

doc
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