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upgrading hardware from x86->AMD64, reinstall?
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longtallugly
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 12:09 am    Post subject: upgrading hardware from x86->AMD64, reinstall? Reply with quote

not sure what the best method to use here is... i jumped on the amd64 bandwagon (and what a fun wagon it looks like!) so now i need to know how best to migrate my current harddrive(**edit** using the "old" harddrive in the new system***/edit***) with gentoo on athlon x86 to the amd64 system. will it work to just rebuild a really generic kernel (or boot from a livecd & chroot) to get booted (or chrooted) to the harddrive in the new system, and then change USE flage, re-emerge everything, rebuild kernel? i suppose a fresh install would be best, but i'd really like to save the time/effort if i can. something i can just start and leave alone would be good, which is why i like the re-emerging everything idea. i have searched a bit for a good way to proceed, but haven't found anything reguarding this specific question, but if you know of anything links are appreciated! thanks,

jay

particulars:
socket 939
sata drive
nforce4 mobo
pcie geforce 6600gt vidcard


Last edited by longtallugly on Fri Apr 22, 2005 4:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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shade266
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 12:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are options avaiable which you can utilize. Depending on which LiveCd you use (I recommend 2005.0). This will do for an initial offering: -bit environment
http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/base/amd64/technotes/index.xml

One important detail you should be aware of is the fact that some of the apps and programs you run on the x86 arch may need to be recompiled in order to work on a native 64-bit environment. I as well have recently crossed into the 64-bit world which has been very rewarding. Search around in the forums for the Gentoo Upgrade Guide which may also be located by way of the link(s) provided on the gentoo.org home page.

BTW, Iowa, as in Davenport, Des Moines, etc.?
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longtallugly
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 4:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok, i had skimmed through the technotes before, but read them again... they have good information, but not quite what i'm looking for. mostly i'm curious what procedure to get a hard drive that has x86 gentoo on it to switch to amd64 gentoo. i was planning to recompile everything after making the switch, but will i be able to boot if i just build an amd64 kernel? then after i'm booted i can just reemerge everything (emerge -De system/world?). I have moved an installation from one machine to another, just never to different architectures, so i want to make sure i don't b0rk things up too badly. thanks for the comments though.

jay

oh, and it's ames, ia, just north of des moines.
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perry
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 6:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I made the upgrade from an nForce2 Athlon XP to nForce4 AMD64 system last week. nVidia AGP card to nVidia PCI Express card. System booted up on the XP kernel and X11 worked just fine. eth0 used forcedeth on both systems, nVidia onboard sound on both. Everything worked pretty much perfectly for me. I was kinda surprised actually ;)

Used the same PATA drive on both, so I don't know what kind of issues you would run in to with SATA. For getting up and going as quickly as you can, you may want to have an x86 Live CD sitting around so you can chroot in to your install and make a new kernel w/ the proper drivers.

But I did go ahead and flatten / (/home is on a different partition) and do a fresh AMD64 install using an Ubuntu AMD64 Live CD. I do not know if you can simply emerge -ep world and be good to go, but I kinda doubt it. I kept a tar'd copy of /etc from the old install so I could quickly get some of my customized files put back in place without having to figure what I had done previously to make things work.
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shade266
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How about mounting the hard drive with x86 and cp the directories/files over to the AMD64 hard drive and recompile.
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longtallugly
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@shade266: sorry, i should have clarified that i want to use the *same* hard drive as i am using now in the new one...

@perry: thanks for the example, i am going from a via chip to nforce, but other than building a new kernel with support for nforce/forcedeth/nvidia sata in it, i assume it should work very similarily! at least i hope so :D
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babo
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As I understand it shouldn't be a problem. My theory is:
You change your make.conf compile a 64 bit kernel, reboot, and do the rest if everything is ok, and if it is not ok you reboot with amd64 livecd, chroot and recompile most important apps and than i think it should work. If not, than again livecd and chroot.
But as I said, a theory :)
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hvengel
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

babo wrote:
As I understand it shouldn't be a problem. My theory is:
You change your make.conf compile a 64 bit kernel, reboot, and do the rest if everything is ok, and if it is not ok you reboot with amd64 livecd, chroot and recompile most important apps and than i think it should work. If not, than again livecd and chroot.
But as I said, a theory :)


If all you want is to migrate your x86 installation to the new hardware then a reconfiguration and compile on the kernel should be about all you need.

If you want to migrate to a amd64 system (ie. eveything is 64 bit code other than the emualtions stuff) then you will need to do alot more work. I don't think that simply changing the make.conf and compiling the kernel will do the job. In fact I know it will not. I think that you will need to boot from an amd64 live CD and basically rebuild everything to get to a 64 bit system. If I were doing this I would use the 2005.0 profile. It is a lot of work but gcc runs really fast on these amd64 systems so it is not too bad. If you apporached it systemacticaly it should only take 4 or 5 hours to rebuild your system depending on what you have installed.
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longtallugly
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hvengel wrote:
.... I don't think that simply changing the make.conf and compiling the kernel will do the job.....

but what if i did that, and then recompiled _everything_? i am planning on recompiling everything either way, so does it make a difference if i boot from hard disk or livecd? i would think if it is in a chroot environment from the livecd it would be basically the same as booting right from the hard drive. at any rate, i am not going to start it until finals are more or less over (another week and a bit), but if i were to do it right now i would follow this process:
    1. build general amd64 compatible kernel & modules needed to boot the new hardware
    2. change make.conf to reflect new hardware (CHOST the same, but change CFLAGES to appropriate for amd64)
    3. boot to new kernel & load modules for network & etc.
    4. rebuild _everything_ needed for the system, beginning with gcc (emerge -e system && emerge -e world?)
    5. tweak kernel and build again, reboot to system

does anyone see any problems with going about it that way? i haven't looked up appropriate values for everything since i'm not going to be starting just yet, so if it seems a little vague at places that is why. i might tweak how i plan to go about it and make changes here accordingly, and after i start i'll update with what worked, what didn't as well, but like i said, that won't be for a little bit yet.
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hvengel
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You need to rebuild at least enough stuff to reboot and to have a working tool chain. So that means gcc, glibc and I don't know what else. So I think you need to rebuild gcc BEFORE you boot with the new kernel image. It might be easier to just do this while you are chrooted since it will not take that long as gcc runs really fast on these amd64 machines. But you are right that you only need some parts of your system converted to 64 bit to boot from that image and then rebuild the rest. You could probably figure out what exactly needs to be done by looking at the installation guide and then building everything that is built in the guide up to the point where you boot the new system.
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longtallugly
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PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2005 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

just wanted to post an update... i am now running on my new hardware, with a kernel compiled for amd64. all i did to get to this stage is rebuild kernel with the proper things in it for the new hardware, built gcc with k8 for cflags, moved the harddrive, and booted it. now that i am here however, i can't compile things (gcc failes complaining about my CFLAGS="k8" line combining with i686) and i also realized that there is a x86_64 CHOSTS value, and i'm going to have to reinstall to take advantage of that (it is running i686 now). so, i guess now i'm just going to boot to a livecd, delete everything other than /home and /root, (/etc is backed up already) and start over from the bootstrap. it's running well as it is though, plays doom3-demo really well, but i guess i wanna do this right, so.... i'm gonna start over.
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longtallugly
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PostPosted: Sat May 14, 2005 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

alright... well... i think it probably was best to reinstall even though it's a little extra work. i'm not really sure what i have done right/wrong, but for the most part i can do most of what i did before, and a little new stuff too!

works similar to before:
    xorg-x11 with opengl accelleration
    fvwm & fvwm-crystal
    firefox (compiled 64-bit, not using flash)
    grub (using grub-static, i had read but forgot to use it, kinda stumped me for a bit)
    booting from sata drive - a little confusing with grub, since when booted
    grub reports it as (hd1, but when booting it reads it as (hd0
    alsa (emu10k1 for my sound blaster audigy, but i8x0 works for the onboard nforce4 audio)
    onboard lan (using "reverse compiled nforce driver" - forcedeth)
    doom3-demo and ut2004-demo run really really well :P


somewhat works:
    xine - crashes fairly frequently
    xmms - if using mad plugin, won't play oggs; if using alsa for the output plugin, it crashes if
    another sound source starts while it's playing
    wine - seems to work for some stuff that worked before... halflife installed, but wouldn't run because it said it needed
    32k colors... not sure what to do about that.


new stuff:
    my audigy livedrive works! now i can use the remote with lirc to control xmms/mplayer
    my mouse (logitech mx700) can use all 10 buttons now, using evdev for the driver. it's also more responsive with this driver


haven't really messed with:
    keyboard buttons - logitech mx duo with volume knob and misc. buttons to configure
    CPU frequency scaling (Cool'n'Quiet)


i'll try to update this list when i know more
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