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Bob P
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sith_Happens wrote:
I can't speak for Bob, but I too would recommend ReiserFS (3.6 not 4) as a fast and stable filesystem. However, if you want to use another filesystem, go ahead (again not speaking for Bob P). You shouldn't run into any problems, and you won't have to deviate from the guide enough to obviate at least my support if you run into any problems. :)

:x EVERYONE SHALL USE REISER FS 3.6 AND THEY SHALL LIKE IT! :x

just kidding. :lol: it doesn't matter which fs you choose to use, as long as you know what you are doing. just don't try reducing the size of the /boot partition if you user reiser, as you could get into trouble if you fail to take into account the size of the journal files. :idea:
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kimchi_sg
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2005 11:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Morning all...

I've just watched this thread grow by 1 page in the course of my sleep!

A warning to all n00bs who are reading this thread:

If you do not understand what exactly each of the steps in stage 1-on-3 do, stick with the Standard Gentoo Installation Handbook. DO NOT EVER LET US CATCH YOU TRYING TO BOOTSTRAP WITH THE STAGE 1-ON-3 TUTORIAL AND / OR SETTINGS.
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Sith_Happens
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kimchi_sg wrote:
If you do not understand what exactly each of the steps in stage 1-on-3 do, stick with the Standard Gentoo Installation Handbook. DO NOT EVER LET US CATCH YOU TRYING TO BOOTSTRAP WITH THE STAGE 1-ON-3 TUTORIAL AND / OR SETTINGS.
Well they can try, just don't ask me for help. :wink:
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kimchi_sg
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sith_Happens wrote:
kimchi_sg wrote:
If you do not understand what exactly each of the steps in stage 1-on-3 do, stick with the Standard Gentoo Installation Handbook. DO NOT EVER LET US CATCH YOU TRYING TO BOOTSTRAP WITH THE STAGE 1-ON-3 TUTORIAL AND / OR SETTINGS.
Well they can try, just don't ask me for help. :wink:

Please don't weaken the force of my warning.

2 n00bs breaking themselves on "stage 1-on-3" in 1 night is cause enough for concern.
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grx
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 12:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just a little defense for the n00bs--

My main concern with this install is getting gcc 3.4.3, because I'm using a centrino laptop, and I'd like to have the pentium-m optimization. Doesn't mean I'm going to follow this particular guide and then complain bitterly if it breaks. Just trying to learn more, and this thread is related to what I'm trying to do. :)
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kimchi_sg
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 12:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

grx wrote:
My main concern with this install is getting gcc 3.4.3, because I'm using a centrino laptop, and I'd like to have the pentium-m optimization.

The optimisation in gcc for the pentium-m is minuscule, compared to optimising for pentium 3 using gcc 3.3.5. My opinion is that it is far too risky just for this change.

Remember that gcc 3.3.5 was cutting edge not too long ago. In other words, do not look down on gcc 3.3.x. :)

Far more optimisation can be obtained by configuring system correctly in other areas. For example, choosing kernel options wisely, and using as few USE flags as necessary.
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Bob P
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 12:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

grx wrote:
My main concern with this install is getting gcc 3.4.3, because I'm using a centrino laptop, and I'd like to have the pentium-m optimization. Doesn't mean I'm going to follow this particular guide and then complain bitterly if it breaks. Just trying to learn more, and this thread is related to what I'm trying to do. :)

this pentium-m issue with gcc 3.3.4 is widely documented. everyone with a pentium-m should search and read the many, many threads that will come up. in fact, duplicate posts went up on this topic today because a n00b didn't bother to search. in reading them, it seems evident that the person who is making the most noise has absolutely no clue what he is doing.
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grx
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 12:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
it seems evident that the person who is making the most noise has absolutely no clue what he is doing.


That's possible--but not everyone new to this distro is clueless. I've been doing my research and reading those threads too, as well as ones about using 3.3.x with pentium-m. I'm just researching and comparing this method to the installation manual, which seems nearly the same if you use a stage-3 install, but with some specific cflag/USE variable changes. I certainly wouldn't think of trying to bootstrap using this as a guide since it's not intended for that at all. But I do want to learn more about what I'm doing before I sit down and let the machine crank out my os. Long story short (and hopefully ended :wink: ) I'm glad for this thread so I can learn more about what I'm going to be doing to my computer.
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Bob P
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 1:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

well, this guide is pretty clear. use pentium for the first compile, and then when you have gcc 343 on your computer, edit your make.conf settings and recompile your toolkit in the final form. its a chipshot for you to put pentium-m in at that stage of the game. have fun!
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 6:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have used the 2004.3 guide so many times that I can practically do it in my sleep just because my post count is not touching the moon does not mean that I am clueless and dont know what I'm doing I have just never needed help, I thought the idea of this topic is to get the rough draft 100% fullproof for the new release of 2005.0, I am not moaning I am just telling you that glibc breaks, trying to get gcc 3.4.3 compiler onto my machine just because it doesn't break on your machines does not mean it doesn't break on someone elses.

Anyway I just to let you know I am trying again for the 4th time from scratch, changing my CFLAGS etc until I pinpoint the problem
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sn0wrider
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 10:37 am    Post subject: Copy-paste Reply with quote

Hi!

Excellent piece of work Bob!

Just one thing though..when I compile gcc I get a couple of errors...problem is that I can't seem to find out how I'm supposed to copy-aspte the error messages in the terminal!

Could someone enlighten me in this small matter? :-)

///Sn0wie
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sn0wrider
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 10:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kimchi_sg wrote:
Morning all...

If you do not understand what exactly each of the steps in stage 1-on-3 do, stick with the Standard Gentoo Installation Handbook. DO NOT EVER LET US CATCH YOU TRYING TO BOOTSTRAP WITH THE STAGE 1-ON-3 TUTORIAL AND / OR SETTINGS.


Oh and one more thing:

My problem is that I do not understand each step in Bobs guide.. BUT it seems to me, however, that the old manual doesn't work...when I've followed it step by step and then tries to emerge gentoo-sources I get a message sayin: "portage can not find any ebuilds to satisfy your request"
And nothing happens..... exactly the same thing happened when I tried (out of curiosity) to emerge development-sources as well.

Then I tried the Bobs 2005.0 "manual" and got errors when compiling gcc ...(and the error messages for that I will have to get back to you about).

So me as a n00b is quite stuck here...what are my greates chances of success? Must I DL the entire LibveCD and make a networkless install? And then put my computer up for a few days of catching everything up? (upgrading)

Or is there other possibilities? I mean for me it seems "madness" to do a networkless install when I have a 10mbit connection to get everything up to date immediatteky...
:-)

///Sn0wie
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Gentoonie
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bob P wrote:
now how's this for an idea -- instead of forcing every user that wants to install GCC 3.4.3 to rebuild the entire toolkit, why don't we just make an unauthorized live CD and stageballs that feature an ~x86 toolkit?

it would save an awful lot of time to do the heavy lifting once, and burn the results to an alternative Live CD. who's in?


This is a real excellent idea. Building toolkits and especially this F**ing glibc takes ages even on my Pentium 4 2.8 GHz.

An already prepared live CD would save so many time to the users :)
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 11:44 am    Post subject: Re: Copy-paste Reply with quote

sn0wrider wrote:
Just one thing though..when I compile gcc I get a couple of errors...problem is that I can't seem to find out how I'm supposed to copy-aspte the error messages in the terminal!

Could someone enlighten me in this small matter? :-)


No problem. If you are in a chrooted enviroment, hopefully you ran screen. If so just detatch it, and then open it in a terminal under X. If not then just type:
Code:
gpm -m /dev/mouse -t ExplorerPS/2

-m is where you mouse is, and -t is the protocol; both of which are in the X config file (well X.org at least).

I did a bit of reasearch and found that enabling sandbox mode can sometimes cause errors when compiling glibc, so I disabled it (removing sandbox and usersandbox from /etc/make.conf FEATURES="...") and I didn't get the above error any more. :D Unfortunately I got another one, but sort of removed the screen instead of detaching it - so I will post the results later. :wink:
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 11:55 am    Post subject: Re: Copy-paste Reply with quote

LucaSpiller wrote:
sn0wrider wrote:
Just one thing though..when I compile gcc I get a couple of errors...problem is that I can't seem to find out how I'm supposed to copy-aspte the error messages in the terminal!

Could someone enlighten me in this small matter? :-)


No problem. If you are in a chrooted enviroment, hopefully you ran screen. If so just detatch it, and then open it in a terminal under X. If not then just type:
Code:
gpm -m /dev/mouse -t ExplorerPS/2

-m is where you mouse is, and -t is the protocol; both of which are in the X config file (well X.org at least).

I did a bit of reasearch and found that enabling sandbox mode can sometimes cause errors when compiling glibc, so I disabled it (removing sandbox and usersandbox from /etc/make.conf FEATURES="...") and I didn't get the above error any more. :D Unfortunately I got another one, but sort of removed the screen instead of detaching it - so I will post the results later. :wink:


Problem is that I have not come so far as to emerging xorg yet ... I'm trying to do a stage 3 install using genkernel (as of now..I tried maunally configuring the .conf file at first..it turned out to be some things I couldn't get right though) ...and following Bobs guide I must recompile gcc to get it working... and thats where I get my errors.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 1:56 pm    Post subject: maketest Reply with quote

glibc fails maketest everytime for me, and I'm using your default settings, when i remove maketest, it works.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:01 pm    Post subject: Re: maketest Reply with quote

To anyone who adds to / changes settings when following this tutorial:

You are free to add to or amend the settings we have listed in the tutorial proper. However, do keep in mind that by doing this, we are also free not to help you.
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Last edited by kimchi_sg on Tue Mar 29, 2005 3:31 pm; edited 3 times in total
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is maketest even a valid feature? I don't see it listed under features in man make.conf. Are you sure maketest shouldn't be test?
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sith_Happens wrote:
Is maketest even a valid feature? I don't see it listed under features in man make.conf.

It is mentioned in /etc/make.conf.example though. I have the feeling that the devs made a mega blooper by putting it in.

Code:

# FEATURES are settings that affect the functionality of portage. Most of
#     these settings are for developer use, but some are available to non-
#     developers as well.
#
...
#  'maketest'    causes ebuilds to perform testing phases if they are capable
#                of it. Some packages support this automaticaly via makefiles.


Oh well, they did mention that
make.conf.example wrote:
Most of these settings are for developer use, but some are available to non-developers as well.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I think maketest probably became test at some point and the make.conf.example was never updated. Either that or it is a seperate option that was never included in the manpage. Look at the entry in the manpage and you'll see what I mean:
Code:
test   Run package-specific tests during each merge to help make sure the pack-
                     age  compiled  properly.   See  test  in  ebuild(1)  and  src_test()  in
                     ebuild(5).
From man ebuild:
Code:
 test   Run package specific test cases to verify that everything was built properly.
No make test though.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sith_Happens wrote:
Yeah, I think maketest probably became test at some point and the make.conf.example was never updated. Either that or it is a seperate option that was never included in the manpage. Look at the entry in the manpage and you'll see what I mean:
Code:
test   Run package-specific tests during each merge to help make sure the pack-
                     age  compiled  properly.   See  test  in  ebuild(1)  and  src_test()  in
                     ebuild(5).

Correct.

But either way it is spelt, it is not safe to include during install. Now the n00bs will know.

One of the emerge -e system packages has a maketest function that will forkbomb the system out of memory, last I checked. And the problem is with the original source, not the ebuild. I learnt this the hard way. I'm not about to say again what that package is. ;) Also, the test feature seems to have been disabled in that packge's ebuild, last I looked at it.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kimchi_sg wrote:
But either way it is spelt, it is not safe to include during install. Now the n00bs will know.
Agreed. It's disabled by default for a reason. Better tell that to Bob P. :wink: I'm beginning to think you and I wink entirely to much kimchi. :wink: :wink:
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sith_Happens wrote:
kimchi_sg wrote:
But either way it is spelt, it is not safe to include during install. Now the n00bs will know.
Agreed. It's disabled by default for a reason. Better tell that to Bob P. :wink:

No need. He will come marching out with keyboard smoking, and type some angry message in bold big blue block letters. Something like what I typed 6 posts ago. ;)

Bob, let's just say that I'm trying to save you some typing time.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kimchi_sg wrote:
Sith_Happens wrote:
kimchi_sg wrote:
But either way it is spelt, it is not safe to include during install. Now the n00bs will know.
Agreed. It's disabled by default for a reason. Better tell that to Bob P. :wink:

No need. He will come marching out with keyboard smoking, and type some angry message in bold big blue block letters. Something like what I typed 6 posts ago. ;)

Bob, let's just say that I'm trying to save you some typing time.
Thats so true. :lol: No offense Bob, we respect your opinions and enjoy your manifestos. :wink: (darn theres another wink, I think that it's starting to become implied by everything I say)
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Last edited by Sith_Happens on Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:46 pm; edited 1 time in total
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kimchi_sg
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sith_Happens wrote:
kimchi_sg wrote:
Sith_Happens wrote:
kimchi_sg wrote:
But either way it is spelt, it is not safe to include during install. Now the n00bs will know.
Agreed. It's disabled by default for a reason. Better tell that to Bob P. :wink:

No need. He will come marching out with keyboard smoking, and type some angry message in bold big blue block letters. Something like what I typed 6 posts ago. ;)

Bob, let's just say that I'm trying to save you some typing time.
Thats so true. :lol:

I'm also trying to save my monitor and the wall next to me from being punched. :P
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