Gentoo Forums
Gentoo Forums
Gentoo Forums
Quick Search: in
http://funroll-loops.org/
View unanswered posts
View posts from last 24 hours

Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, ... 13, 14, 15  Next  
Reply to topic    Gentoo Forums Forum Index Off the Wall
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
HydroSan
l33t
l33t


Joined: 04 Mar 2004
Posts: 764
Location: The Kremlin (aka Canada)

PostPosted: Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SoLC wrote:
The only reason I use Gentoo is the vast collection of software in portage and the uniform method of installation. Now for this I could use Debian, but their politics scare me - they do provide a fine distribution however.


Yes. I remember trying out Debian, and when I asked them once on how to set up a stable IPTABLES configuration, I was immediately told to 'STFU. Go bug the Gentoo forums, you lamer.' And so I did. And I actually found that the Gentoo community (you guys) are actually nice people who try to help.

See, I don't really understand why Gentoo has gotten a bad rep. I mean, n00bs first flock to RedHat or Mandrake at first, install it graphically and then go "I run Linux I'm so cool worship me". As opposed to Gentoo which actually makes you THINK when installing it. :roll: I figure the entire Portage setup is envied by everyone else in the 'Why didn't I think of that' sense. And when someone is better than you, you try to bash them. It's the logical path to the Intarweb. As opposed to me hunting down 10+ RPM's for every piece of software I want to install, Portage grabs all the dependancies and installs them.

Now, I'm not being a 'Gentoo Ricer' when I praise Gentoo. Gentoo has given me a new outlook on the flexibility of Linux and the general ease of use it can provide. I kind of got sick of stupid RPM shit in RedHat, and while SuSE was significantly better, I still was itching to try out the new Kernel 2.6.0, XFree4.4-pre (before the license change) and Gnome 2.6-pre. And after breaking Gentoo and redoing everything again, I learned lots about how far you could push Linux. Now I'm setting up computers with Linux (Gentoo and SuSE) at my school.
_________________
I was a Gangster for Capitalism, by Major General Smedley Butler.

Server status: Currently down, being replaced with fresh install - 20% completed.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
nrl
Guru
Guru


Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 446
Location: Glasgow, UK

PostPosted: Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wdreinhart wrote:
Of course, I would feel insecure too, if my machine was still running kernel 2.2, Gnome 1.4, and XFree 3.x :D

Are you talking about Debian? I have a Debian box here that's running the latest in the 2.4 kernel series (I haven't moved to 2.6 yet but 2.6.6 is in Debian if I wanted it), GNOME 2.6.1 and XFree 4.3; all installed in under an hour and it runs just as fast as Gentoo. :roll:


Last edited by nrl on Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:47 pm; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
playfool
l33t
l33t


Joined: 01 Jun 2004
Posts: 688
Location: Århus, Denmark

PostPosted: Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nrl wrote:
wdreinhart wrote:
Of course, I would feel insecure too, if my machine was still running kernel 2.2, Gnome 1.4, and XFree 3.x :D

Are you talking about Debian? I have a Debian box here that's running the latest in the 2.4 kernel series (I haven't moved to 2.6 yet but 2.6.26 is in Debian if I wanted it), GNOME 2.6.1 and XFree 4.3, all installed in under an hour and it runs just as fast as Gentoo. :roll:


Damn Debian is on the bleeding edge :)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
nrl
Guru
Guru


Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 446
Location: Glasgow, UK

PostPosted: Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SoLC wrote:
Damn Debian is on the bleeding edge :)

:lol: damn slippy fingers

Edit: OK I cleaned up my post, let's just pretend it never happened ;)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
wdreinhart
Guru
Guru


Joined: 11 Jun 2003
Posts: 569
Location: 4QFJ12345678

PostPosted: Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HydroSan wrote:
See, I don't really understand why Gentoo has gotten a bad rep.


There's a few reasons. Some are legitimate, most aren't. Every time there's an article on Slashdot about some new open source project making a new release, someone posts a direct link to the rpm/deb packages. Some gentoo user replies to this with a note that it's in portage, and that Gentoo users can just emerge -u somepackage. That tends to annoy a lot of people, including me. OTOH, I consider it just comeuppance for all the Debian users that used to gloat about apt-get the exact same way.

Certain upstream developers don't like us because we expose bugs in their code that don't show up when they build they official blessed binary packages. (yes seanegan, I'm saying there are BUGS in YOUR CODE. It's the truth. Get over it.) So they complain, and someone's first brush with Gentoo is a rant about how we're all a bunch of coke-addicted speed demons who optimize the hell out of everything and generally make their life difficult with confusing bug reports.

Then there are the people who compile everything with "-O3 -fomit-frame-pointers -ffast-math -fguess-at-hard-math -mmmx -msse2 -fexpensive-optimizations -mcpu=Pentium4 -march=AthlonXP -finline-functions" and don't understand why things crash from time to time. I think that's a tiny minority of Gentoo users, contrary to what that site claims. Like the rice-kids who cut down the springs in their Hondas and then don't understand why they can't corner worth crap anymore, there's not much we can do for them but hope they learn...

(edit: My grammar was awful in that post. Hopefully I've fixed most of the glaring mistakes now...)


Last edited by wdreinhart on Fri Jun 04, 2004 2:46 am; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
playfool
l33t
l33t


Joined: 01 Jun 2004
Posts: 688
Location: Århus, Denmark

PostPosted: Thu Jun 03, 2004 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stuff like this also tends to piss people off.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
nejiron
Tux's lil' helper
Tux's lil' helper


Joined: 27 Apr 2004
Posts: 95
Location: U.S.A.

PostPosted: Thu Jun 03, 2004 11:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

:lol:
_________________
I am a traveler of both time and space
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
myuser
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 31 Jan 2004
Posts: 218

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am only it for the Larry the Cow fluffy dice.

If gentoo is the 'Ricers', is Debian the group that have black cars and stick their names on the front window; "Debs and Ian".
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Stormy Eyes
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 09 Apr 2003
Posts: 1064
Location: Watching God spit-shine my boots.

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 2:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd rather see Gentoo users as outlaw bikers customizing the living Christ out of their hogs, but I've been listening to Motorhead and Blue Oyster Cult again. >^..^<
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
stonent
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 07 Aug 2003
Posts: 1139
Location: Texas

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 3:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stormy Eyes wrote:
Blue Oyster Cult again. >^..^<


Go go Mozilla!
_________________
Inspiron 4100 & Sun UltraAXe
Portage on Solaris|Dell Laptop Hacks
The way you feel about organized religion is the same way I feel about organized socialism.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jay
l33t
l33t


Joined: 08 May 2002
Posts: 980

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 5:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nrl wrote:

PS. I must admit some of them are pretty damn funny though :lol:.

Some of those were meant as a joke, but the Debianist take them for real. I love stereotypes!
_________________
Do you want your posessions identified? [ynq] (n)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
nrl
Guru
Guru


Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 446
Location: Glasgow, UK

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jay wrote:
nrl wrote:

PS. I must admit some of them are pretty damn funny though :lol:.

Some of those were meant as a joke, but the Debianist take them for real. I love stereotypes!

Yea I know I can remember when some of them were said but quite a few are real too (I remember responding to a couple of them). Anyway who cares, the guy obviously has too much free time on his hands. :roll:
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
thechris
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 12 Oct 2003
Posts: 1203

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sweet! i made the list -- the one about kde taking 13 hours to compile. definately taken out of context, as i was saying that 13 hours was a long time...

not sure i see what is so funny though. i think he nailed it right on -- gentoo is an entheusiest's distro of linux. It's for the people who don't mind compiling -- so long as you can listen to music and surf the web while you compile, i fail to see the big deal.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
m0sk
n00b
n00b


Joined: 18 Apr 2003
Posts: 39
Location: Belgium

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hypnos wrote:

Binary packaging does encourage sloppy coding/design, contrast with the stochastic API unit testing which occurs naturally with all the building with different configurations


Congrats! 8) This quote made the list :P
_________________
panic ("No CPUs found. System halted.\n");
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
headache
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 26 May 2004
Posts: 226

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I couldn't care less what that scipr-kiddie thinks about Gentoo.

I'm not using gentoo because it is cool, but because I like they way the distribution is put together. I don't mind getting a few percent extra juice out of compiling it from source, but that is not the main reason for using gentoo.

I also have no problems with compiles taking time since my machine works perfectly well and I can do all the things I need to do at work and at home while it compiles.

While I write this, my system is happily recompiling itself from scratch with gcc 3.4 and the latest glibc. Granted I have the latest and greatest in CPU's, disks and memory so it's not like an old P1 :)

I think the author is probably a former Gentoo wannabe but couldn't figure out how to install it and turned anti-gentoo because of his own inabilities. Be that as it may.
_________________
"I'd rather have a President who does it to a woman than one who does it to his country" -- Shirley Maclaine
Liberal (adj.): Free from bigotry; open to progress; tolerant of others.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
plbe
l33t
l33t


Joined: 01 May 2004
Posts: 661

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can tell you right now why everyone bashes Gentoo.....jealousy....everyone likes to bash the guy on top :D
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jay
l33t
l33t


Joined: 08 May 2002
Posts: 980

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

drownd wrote:
I can tell you right now why everyone bashes Gentoo.....jealousy....everyone likes to bash the guy on top :D


You nailed the spot!
_________________
Do you want your posessions identified? [ynq] (n)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Stormy Eyes
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 09 Apr 2003
Posts: 1064
Location: Watching God spit-shine my boots.

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

headache wrote:
While I write this, my system is happily recompiling itself from scratch with gcc 3.4 and the latest glibc. Granted I have the latest and greatest in CPU's, disks and memory so it's not like an old P1 :)


Are the performance gains from using GCC 3.4 worth the risk and trouble of upgrading? I know it's not in portage yet, so there aren't any guarantees.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
headache
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 26 May 2004
Posts: 226

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stormy Eyes wrote:
headache wrote:
While I write this, my system is happily recompiling itself from scratch with gcc 3.4 and the latest glibc. Granted I have the latest and greatest in CPU's, disks and memory so it's not like an old P1 :)


Are the performance gains from using GCC 3.4 worth the risk and trouble of upgrading? I know it's not in portage yet, so there aren't any guarantees.

It is indeed in Portage!

Code:

gcc-3.4.0-r6.ebuild


I've been using 3.4 for some time on AMD64 and it gives a nice speedup on most apps.

Currently recompiling my P4 boxes with 3.4, then I'll try to do some benchmarking. Not that I care that much how fast it is or how much faster it is afterwards.

Edit:

Just wanted to show a few compile times for comparison between gcc 3.3 and 3.4:
Code:

     Mon May 24 10:33:22 2004 >>> sys-apps/coreutils-5.2.1
       merge time: 3 minutes and 26 seconds.

     Fri Jun  4 11:19:56 2004 >>> sys-apps/coreutils-5.2.1
       merge time: 2 minutes and 38 seconds.

     Wed Apr 28 15:13:11 2004 >>> sys-apps/file-4.09
       merge time: 49 seconds.

     Fri Jun  4 12:24:26 2004 >>> sys-apps/file-4.09
       merge time: 29 seconds.

     Thu Mar 18 00:41:27 2004 >>> dev-libs/openssl-0.9.7d
       merge time: 3 minutes and 43 seconds.

     Fri Jun  4 11:24:48 2004 >>> dev-libs/openssl-0.9.7d
       merge time: 2 minutes and 50 seconds.

     Fri May 14 13:09:24 2004 >>> dev-lang/python-2.3.4_rc1
       merge time: 3 minutes and 33 seconds.

     Fri Jun  4 11:29:45 2004 >>> dev-lang/python-2.3.4_rc1
       merge time: 2 minutes and 33 seconds.


Not bad at all.
_________________
"I'd rather have a President who does it to a woman than one who does it to his country" -- Shirley Maclaine
Liberal (adj.): Free from bigotry; open to progress; tolerant of others.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
faux323
n00b
n00b


Joined: 30 Sep 2002
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A link to fuxroll-poops was published on memepool today.

I checked. Placebo's unwashed 1979 Pacer Limited V8 sports a Rollins Band bumpersticker.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
d0nju4n
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 19 Apr 2004
Posts: 283
Location: Rochester, MN

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lets not forget that a lot people are drawn to gentoo because of the forums/community. This was one of the biggest factors for me. When I switched to linux, I narrowed down my choice to either Gentoo, Debian, or Slack. After seeing the Debian forums, and the way in which the community conducts itself, I ruled them out. (I actually ran slack for a little while before making my way to gentoo).

I think the debian community has much more of a "l33tist atitude" than gentoo does, with the way that they think it's beneath them to help the "new guy", even though this is one of their major gripes about gentoo users

[Edit]I hope this one makes the list somehow :twisted: [/Edit]
_________________
Linux User 355087
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Hypnos
Advocate
Advocate


Joined: 18 Jul 2002
Posts: 2887
Location: Omnipresent

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

m0sk wrote:
Hypnos wrote:

Binary packaging does encourage sloppy coding/design, contrast with the stochastic API unit testing which occurs naturally with all the building with different configurations


Congrats! 8) This quote made the list :P


*Sniff* I'd like to thank ... :wink:

I hope Sean Egan is reading.
_________________
Personal overlay | Simple backup scheme
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
YopWongSapn
l33t
l33t


Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 627

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The truely sad thing about this page is that there are people out there that actually say stuff like this.

I was somewhat offended by the implication that all gentoo users are like this, but I just had to laugh at some of them.

I think this one's my favorite...
Quote:
With othert distro's when you have problems they are problems with Redhat or with SuSE or with Lindows. But if you have problems with Gentoo you have problems with Linux.

This just in....RedHat, SuSE, and Lindows are no longer linux....Gentoo is the only form of linux out there. :lol:
_________________
Gentoo...it's like wiping your ass with silk. Or sandpaper.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
d0nju4n
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 19 Apr 2004
Posts: 283
Location: Rochester, MN

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

YopWongSapn wrote:
The truely sad thing about this page is that there are people out there that actually say stuff like this.

I was somewhat offended by the implication that all gentoo users are like this, but I just had to laugh at some of them.

I think this one's my favorite...
Quote:
With othert distro's when you have problems they are problems with Redhat or with SuSE or with Lindows. But if you have problems with Gentoo you have problems with Linux.

This just in....RedHat, SuSE, and Lindows are no longer linux....Gentoo is the only form of linux out there. :lol:


Yea, stuff like this comes from the same people that think the distribution itself is actually linux, rather than the kernel
_________________
Linux User 355087
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Bague
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 09 Feb 2004
Posts: 292

PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2004 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like how he bashes the compile times. Yeah, for me it also took 10+ hours to get KDE 3.2. But Mandrake didn't even have a package. so the only way I could have gotten it was to build from source anyway...

Funroll-Loops-Guy wrote:
e attention on the Gentoo Forums recently. Good to see people can take a joke and poke fun. If you're offended, I have a friend who uses Gentoo, and well ... let's just say it's difficult to drink beer with someone who insists on building his drink "from scratch" and with "optimized hops", not to mention, the hot waitress doesn't appreciate his need to know her on a "low-level, stripped down without the bloat" kind of way.


Not necessarily true, in my case, I only see need for optimizing my computer because computers are my hobby. Its about obsession, sure we are obsessed with having our .28 second firefox boot time advantage and all, but if you spend a lot of time on your comp and you love to tweak, then why not? If you are passionate for something, go all out.

A lot of linux people are computer obsessies, and a lot have gotten attached to Gentoo because it gives us the power and speed we want, even if its over the top. He shouldn't be dissing Gentoo, but rather pc fanatics. Why not the Linux From Scratch people? A lot of people come to linux because they want as much performance and stability as they can get out of thier system. Why not just insult all Linux users as "Ricers"?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Gentoo Forums Forum Index Off the Wall All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, ... 13, 14, 15  Next
Page 2 of 15

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum