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Splink
Apprentice
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 295
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 Posted: Sun May 08, 2005 1:13 am Post subject: a 2nd gentoo forum |
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I know it makes no sense but ... there are a hell of a lot of people on here daily. I tye a post .. and about 5 have been posted even before mine has finished!.. This community is getting BIG, which is good, and needs spreading a little bit - i fear the forums will not be able to hold, or we will not be able to keep up.
has anyone else noticed this ? |
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bladdo
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Location: NJ
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2005 1:38 am Post subject: |
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Naw I think one forum is fine
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Halcy0n
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Joined: 17 Sep 2003
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Location: Freehold, NJ
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2005 1:43 am Post subject: |
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The forum admins and infra monkeys seem to be handling the situation fine. I haven't had any problems using the forum. Splitting it is just going to make it harder to find anything and break the community up. If there is a software limitation with phpBB, then we need to fix that, not split the forums.
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amne
Bodhisattva
Joined: 17 Nov 2002
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Location: Graz / EU
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2005 9:09 am Post subject: |
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I agree with what Halcy0n said. Splitting would also just increace redundancy by 98% as no one would just stick to one forum, neither to search, nor to post.
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Splink
Apprentice
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2005 11:49 am Post subject: |
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yer suppose. It is handled very well, just need to remember, when using the forum at busy times, make sure my alcohol blood level is low  |
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pjp
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Joined: 16 Apr 2002
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| Posted: Sun May 08, 2005 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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Hardware doesn't seem to be an issue.
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MaxDamage
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Joined: 03 Jan 2004
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Location: Oviedo, Spain
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| Posted: Tue May 10, 2005 9:10 am Post subject: |
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If the great Howtos/tips that appear in these forums continue being archived into Gentoo Wiki, lot of help request posts will become unnecesary.
That Wiki has been one of the best ideas I've seen lately. What about a link in gentoo.org main page?
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pjp
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| Posted: Wed May 11, 2005 4:31 am Post subject: |
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| MaxDamage wrote: | | What about a link in gentoo.org main page? |
Its not an official site.
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Gherald
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| Posted: Wed May 11, 2005 4:34 am Post subject: |
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| I think an official wiki would be more useful than a second forum. |
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Given M. Sur
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Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Posts: 648
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| Posted: Wed May 11, 2005 4:43 am Post subject: |
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| Gherald wrote: | | I think an official wiki would be more useful than a second forum. |
I agree. I think an official wiki would be a tremendous addition to the already excellent docs and forums.
The unofficial wiki is cool, but I think an official one linked to from gentoo.org would get a lot more traffic.
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jdgill0
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Joined: 25 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Wed May 11, 2005 5:37 am Post subject: |
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I have seen lots of people refer to http://gentoo-wiki.com in the forums. The wiki is very nice IMHO. What does it take to make it an official site? Also, would making it an official site or starting an official wiki necessarily the best idea -- i.e. pros/cons? I also like http://www.gentoo-portage.com/ . Although we have online access to portage packages, i.e. http://packages.gentoo.org/ , I like how portage stuff is presented at gentoo-portage.com. Although, the "theme" of gentoo.org is being changed -- right? -- will the change improve access to information at http://packages.gentoo.org/ ?
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charlieg
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Joined: 30 Jul 2002
Posts: 2149
Location: Manchester UK
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| Posted: Wed May 11, 2005 2:25 pm Post subject: Re: a 2nd gentoo forum |
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| Splink wrote: | | I know it makes no sense but ... there are a hell of a lot of people on here daily. I tye a post .. and about 5 have been posted even before mine has finished!.. This community is getting BIG, which is good, and needs spreading a little bit - i fear the forums will not be able to hold, or we will not be able to keep up. |
That's what the different forum categories are for. If one category is too busy, then maybe it needs breaking down. So you could say there was (for example) enough traffic to split 'Desktop Environments' into 3 categories; KDE, Gnome, and Other DEs/WMs.
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Gherald
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| Posted: Wed May 11, 2005 2:27 pm Post subject: |
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Or how about (for example) splitting OTW into technical and non-technical discussion.
Then hopefully the technical branch could be re-added to the default quicksearch, unanswered, and last searches. |
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pjp
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Joined: 16 Apr 2002
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| Posted: Wed May 11, 2005 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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| jdgill0 wrote: | | I have seen lots of people refer to http://gentoo-wiki.com in the forums. The wiki is very nice IMHO. What does it take to make it an official site? Also, would making it an official site or starting an official wiki necessarily the best idea -- i.e. pros/cons? |
Wiki aren't popular among Gentoo documentists (though this may have changed as more people have come aboard). One particular piece of evidence is that official docs don't use Wiki. A long time ago, there was discussion about creating an in-house documentation method to replace DT&T, but it lacked people with time (or those with time didn't have the ability *raises hand*).
Can't please everybody. I can't stand wiki, so its no surprise I'm not fond of how gentoo-portage presents stuff.
| jdgill0 wrote: | | Although, the "theme" of gentoo.org is being changed -- right? -- will the change improve access to information at http://packages.gentoo.org/ ? |
I would imagine themeing would only have a small impact, but thats just a guess (I have no "inside" info). You might be interested in marduk's recent blog entry.
| Gherald wrote: | Or how about (for example) splitting OTW into technical and non-technical discussion.
Then hopefully the technical branch could be re-added to the default quicksearch, unanswered, and last searches. |
OTW is for anything not Gentoo related. We had a general linux forum, and it was merged with OTW because the primary purpose of these forums is to support Gentoo.
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jdgill0
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Joined: 25 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Wed May 11, 2005 7:24 pm Post subject: |
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pjp,
Thank you for the detailed response.
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Gherald
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| Posted: Wed May 11, 2005 10:14 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, thanks!
| pjp wrote: | | jdgill0 wrote: | | I have seen lots of people refer to http://gentoo-wiki.com in the forums. The wiki is very nice IMHO. What does it take to make it an official site? Also, would making it an official site or starting an official wiki necessarily the best idea -- i.e. pros/cons? |
Wiki aren't popular among Gentoo documentists (though this may have changed as more people have come aboard). One particular piece of evidence is that official docs don't use Wiki. A long time ago, there was discussion about creating an in-house documentation method to replace DT&T, but it lacked people with time (or those with time didn't have the ability *raises hand*). |
What do you suppose it would it take to re-open the discussion? Do the documentists really even need to participate? They'd be more than welcome to, of course, but I would think this is more a matter of convincing site admins to emerge mediawiki and start a pilot project... and I'm sure you'd have no trouble finding competent wiki admins/watchers to get rid of spam and other abuses ( /me points to himself : )
| pjp wrote: | | OTW is for anything not Gentoo related. We had a general linux forum, and it was merged with OTW because the primary purpose of these forums is to support Gentoo. |
I see ... but the main reason I'd like to see it split again (though not necessarily into linux, non-linux but preferably technical, non-technical) are the changes to the search functions. They were appropriate given the number of folks that complained about seeing truly off the wall posts in their search results, but I doubt there'd be any such complaints about general linux and other serious technical discussions.
Also I just don't see why a thread about e.g. UNIX in general belongs next to stuff like "cokehabit is a wanker" |
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pjp
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Joined: 16 Apr 2002
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| Posted: Thu May 12, 2005 5:22 am Post subject: |
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| Gherald wrote: | | What do you suppose it would it take to re-open the discussion? |
Depends on what you're after. One method would be to approach the appropriate documentation people about it if you want a more traditional Gentoo document, or if you just want some Wiki thing.
If you want a custom environment, the discussion is dormant, not really closed. Again, needing people with time and skills.
| Gherald wrote: | | Do the documentists really even need to participate? They'd be more than welcome to, of course, but I would think this is more a matter of convincing site admins to emerge mediawiki and start a pilot project... and I'm sure you'd have no trouble finding competent wiki admins/watchers to get rid of spam and other abuses ( /me points to himself : ) |
Theoretically a Wiki site could be created similarly how the forums are separate from the main site. On a long term basis, I see a non-wiki solution being implemented. Then there's the personality issue... if gentoo-wiki were made official (or some other wiki that doesn't exist yet), would the people running it be willing to "hand it over" in an official sense, even if they were kept to help with it. Would they have problems if its content was then later de-wikified and moved to another system, etc.
| Gherald wrote: | | Also I just don't see why a thread about e.g. UNIX in general belongs next to stuff like "cokehabit is a wanker" |
Get more general unix threads to outnumber wanker threads. This would be something more realistic when subforums are finally released with the new version of phpbb, but I wouldn't count on it. There comes a point where it goes too far. If a general technical forum is OK, why not create distro specific forums, or an electronics forum, or a <whatever> forum. The line has to be drawn somewhere, and "Gentoo" seems to be the best line since the reorganization.
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Given M. Sur
l33t
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Thu May 12, 2005 4:24 pm Post subject: |
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| pjp wrote: | | Then there's the personality issue... if gentoo-wiki were made official (or some other wiki that doesn't exist yet), would the people running it be willing to "hand it over" in an official sense, even if they were kept to help with it. Would they have problems if its content was then later de-wikified and moved to another system, etc. |
Well, they wouldn't really have a choice | gentoo-wiki.com wrote: | | All text is under the terms of the GNU Free Documentation License unless otherwise stated within the document. |
Although, I would imagine it would be re-wikified by another unofficial wiki pretty quickly. Personally, I think wikis are a great supplement to traditional docs. Wikis can stay current much better than the traditional docs. Also, wikis give more freedom to create articles that the doc maintainers may not want to include in the traditional docs... and gentoo is, after all, about choice. Of course, traditional docs have the advantage of having semi-guaranteed accuracy, and being non-spammable.
But maybe an official wiki isn't needed. Perhaps there could be some links to unofficial gentoo resources on gentoo.org with the traditional "not affiliated" disclaimer. I would like more people to know about and use the wiki since it can be a valuable resource. Howtos work much much better in wiki form than forum form. I hate reading the howtos in the forums because then you have to read the 200 follow-up posts to fully understand the concept.
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Gherald
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Joined: 23 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Fri May 13, 2005 12:23 am Post subject: |
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I emailed the gentoo-wiki webmaster (thrasher) about this...
| Quote: | I wouldn't mind helping; and most of my suggestions would be post-install.
Only thing I would say now would be to make the wiki we already have official... move it to official servers and such.
I think it would be hard for gentoo.org to create one and NOT move over the available content from my server.
But if you need some help i'm definitely willing to help out. |
So, I do not see any problems on that front. We all know what the GFDL entails...
It should just be a matter of convincing gentoo.org to give this a try. Do we need a GLEP like planet.gentoo.org's, or is there a less formal process seeing as this won't involve developers beyond whomever volounteers to help? |
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khiloa
Guru
Joined: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 333
Location: Florence, SC
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| Posted: Fri May 13, 2005 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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| One does fine for me. I think we should trash OTW though. Or limit the number of posts a user can post in there or something. |
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Given M. Sur
l33t
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Posts: 648
Location: No such file or directory
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| Posted: Fri May 13, 2005 8:29 pm Post subject: |
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| khiloa wrote: | | One does fine for me. I think we should trash OTW though. |
Sounds fine to me. I don't even touch OTW anymore now that it doesn't show up in the "New Posts" search, as that's the link I use to come to these forums.
<spam>
And there's always The RealOTW for those who want their OTW fix.
</spam>
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electrofreak
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Joined: 30 Jun 2004
Posts: 713
Location: Ohio, USA
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| Posted: Mon May 16, 2005 2:10 am Post subject: |
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| I have not noticed the forum server(s?) becoming slow at all. Also, I don't usually have too much trouble making a post before "5 other people" do. Having 2 seperate forums is a terrible idea. I have never heard of such an idea before. |
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