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Astolfo n00b
Joined: 27 Sep 2020 Posts: 12
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 9:35 am Post subject: unable to startx |
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I have MSI bravo 15 with both integrated and discrete gpu. (I use amdgpu)
Without any xorg configuration I get error Cannot run in framebuffer mode. Please specify busIDs for all framebuffer devices
Code: | [ 101.033]
X.Org X Server 1.20.8
X Protocol Version 11, Revision 0
[ 101.034] Build Operating System: Linux 5.4.64 x86_64 Gentoo
[ 101.034] Current Operating System: Linux alt 5.4.64 #1 SMP Thu Sep 10 06:57:37 -00 2020 x86_64
[ 101.034] Kernel command line: BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-5.4.64 root=UUID=00f7b30a-e080-430c-a94d-fe902efac208 ro
[ 101.034] Build Date: 26 September 2020 09:28:26PM
[ 101.035]
[ 101.035] Current version of pixman: 0.40.0
[ 101.036] Before reporting problems, check http://wiki.x.org
to make sure that you have the latest version.
[ 101.036] Markers: (--) probed, (**) from config file, (==) default setting,
(++) from command line, (!!) notice, (II) informational,
(WW) warning, (EE) error, (NI) not implemented, (??) unknown.
[ 101.038] (==) Log file: "/home/andrey/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log", Time: Sun Sep 27 12:16:19 2020
[ 101.039] (==) Using config directory: "/etc/X11/xorg.conf.d"
[ 101.039] (==) Using system config directory "/usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d"
[ 101.040] (==) No Layout section. Using the first Screen section.
[ 101.040] (==) No screen section available. Using defaults.
[ 101.040] (**) |-->Screen "Default Screen Section" (0)
[ 101.040] (**) | |-->Monitor "<default monitor>"
[ 101.040] (==) No monitor specified for screen "Default Screen Section".
Using a default monitor configuration.
[ 101.040] (==) Automatically adding devices
[ 101.040] (==) Automatically enabling devices
[ 101.040] (==) Automatically adding GPU devices
[ 101.040] (==) Max clients allowed: 256, resource mask: 0x1fffff
[ 101.040] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/misc/" does not exist.
[ 101.040] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 101.040] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/TTF/" does not exist.
[ 101.040] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 101.040] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/OTF/" does not exist.
[ 101.040] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 101.040] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/Type1/" does not exist.
[ 101.040] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 101.040] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/100dpi/" does not exist.
[ 101.040] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 101.040] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/75dpi/" does not exist.
[ 101.040] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 101.040] (==) FontPath set to:
[ 101.040] (==) ModulePath set to "/usr/lib64/xorg/modules"
[ 101.040] (II) The server relies on udev to provide the list of input devices.
If no devices become available, reconfigure udev or disable AutoAddDevices.
[ 101.040] (II) Loader magic: 0x558b39fe4ce0
[ 101.040] (II) Module ABI versions:
[ 101.040] X.Org ANSI C Emulation: 0.4
[ 101.040] X.Org Video Driver: 24.1
[ 101.040] X.Org XInput driver : 24.1
[ 101.040] X.Org Server Extension : 10.0
[ 101.041] (++) using VT number 1
[ 101.044] (II) systemd-logind: took control of session /org/freedesktop/login1/session/_31
[ 101.044] (II) xfree86: Adding drm device (/dev/dri/card0)
[ 101.589] (II) systemd-logind: got fd for /dev/dri/card0 226:0 fd 10 paused 0
[ 101.593] (--) PCI: (3@0:0:0) 1002:7340:1462:12b5 rev 193, Mem @ 0xd0000000/268435456, 0xe0000000/2097152, 0xfe500000/524288, BIOS @ 0x????????/131072
[ 101.593] (--) PCI:*(7@0:0:0) 1002:1636:1462:12b5 rev 198, Mem @ 0xb0000000/268435456, 0xc0000000/2097152, 0xfe400000/524288, I/O @ 0x0000e000/256
[ 101.593] (II) LoadModule: "glx"
[ 101.597] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/extensions/libglx.so
[ 101.602] (II) Module glx: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
[ 101.602] compiled for 1.20.8, module version = 1.0.0
[ 101.602] ABI class: X.Org Server Extension, version 10.0
[ 101.602] (II) Applying OutputClass "AMDgpu" to /dev/dri/card0
[ 101.602] loading driver: amdgpu
[ 101.602] (==) Matched amdgpu as autoconfigured driver 0
[ 101.602] (==) Matched ati as autoconfigured driver 1
[ 101.602] (==) Matched modesetting as autoconfigured driver 2
[ 101.602] (==) Matched fbdev as autoconfigured driver 3
[ 101.602] (==) Matched vesa as autoconfigured driver 4
[ 101.602] (==) Assigned the driver to the xf86ConfigLayout
[ 101.602] (II) LoadModule: "amdgpu"
[ 101.602] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/drivers/amdgpu_drv.so
[ 101.605] (II) Module amdgpu: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
[ 101.605] compiled for 1.20.8, module version = 19.1.0
[ 101.605] Module class: X.Org Video Driver
[ 101.605] ABI class: X.Org Video Driver, version 24.1
[ 101.605] (II) LoadModule: "ati"
[ 101.606] (WW) Warning, couldn't open module ati
[ 101.606] (EE) Failed to load module "ati" (module does not exist, 0)
[ 101.606] (II) LoadModule: "modesetting"
[ 101.606] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/drivers/modesetting_drv.so
[ 101.606] (II) Module modesetting: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
[ 101.606] compiled for 1.20.8, module version = 1.20.8
[ 101.606] Module class: X.Org Video Driver
[ 101.606] ABI class: X.Org Video Driver, version 24.1
[ 101.606] (II) LoadModule: "fbdev"
[ 101.607] (WW) Warning, couldn't open module fbdev
[ 101.607] (EE) Failed to load module "fbdev" (module does not exist, 0)
[ 101.607] (II) LoadModule: "vesa"
[ 101.607] (WW) Warning, couldn't open module vesa
[ 101.607] (EE) Failed to load module "vesa" (module does not exist, 0)
[ 101.607] (II) AMDGPU: Driver for AMD Radeon:
All GPUs supported by the amdgpu kernel driver
[ 101.607] (II) modesetting: Driver for Modesetting Kernel Drivers: kms
[ 101.607] (II) AMDGPU(0): [KMS] drm report modesetting isn't supported.
[ 101.607] (WW) Falling back to old probe method for modesetting
[ 101.608] (II) modeset(2): using default device
[ 101.609] (WW) VGA arbiter: cannot open kernel arbiter, no multi-card support
[ 101.609] (EE) Screen 0 deleted because of no matching config section.
[ 101.609] (II) UnloadModule: "amdgpu"
[ 101.609] (EE) Screen 0 deleted because of no matching config section.
[ 101.609] (II) UnloadModule: "modesetting"
[ 101.609] (EE)
Fatal server error:
[ 101.609] (EE) Cannot run in framebuffer mode. Please specify busIDs for all framebuffer devices
[ 101.609] (EE)
[ 101.609] (EE)
Please consult the The X.Org Foundation support
at http://wiki.x.org
for help.
[ 101.609] (EE) Please also check the log file at "/home/andrey/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log" for additional information.
[ 101.609] (EE)
[ 101.613] (EE) Server terminated with error (1). Closing log file.
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If I add this to xorg configuration
Code: |
Section "Device"
Identifier "AMD"
Driver "amdgpu"
EndSection
|
I get error no screens found(EE)
Code: |
[ 16.580]
X.Org X Server 1.20.8
X Protocol Version 11, Revision 0
[ 16.580] Build Operating System: Linux 5.4.64 x86_64 Gentoo
[ 16.580] Current Operating System: Linux alt 5.4.64 #1 SMP Thu Sep 10 06:57:37 -00 2020 x86_64
[ 16.580] Kernel command line: BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-5.4.64 root=UUID=00f7b30a-e080-430c-a94d-fe902efac208 ro
[ 16.580] Build Date: 26 September 2020 09:28:26PM
[ 16.580]
[ 16.580] Current version of pixman: 0.40.0
[ 16.580] Before reporting problems, check http://wiki.x.org
to make sure that you have the latest version.
[ 16.580] Markers: (--) probed, (**) from config file, (==) default setting,
(++) from command line, (!!) notice, (II) informational,
(WW) warning, (EE) error, (NI) not implemented, (??) unknown.
[ 16.581] (==) Log file: "/home/andrey/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log", Time: Sun Sep 27 12:18:36 2020
[ 16.582] (==) Using config directory: "/etc/X11/xorg.conf.d"
[ 16.582] (==) Using system config directory "/usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d"
[ 16.583] (==) No Layout section. Using the first Screen section.
[ 16.583] (==) No screen section available. Using defaults.
[ 16.583] (**) |-->Screen "Default Screen Section" (0)
[ 16.583] (**) | |-->Monitor "<default monitor>"
[ 16.583] (==) No device specified for screen "Default Screen Section".
Using the first device section listed.
[ 16.583] (**) | |-->Device "AMD"
[ 16.583] (==) No monitor specified for screen "Default Screen Section".
Using a default monitor configuration.
[ 16.583] (==) Automatically adding devices
[ 16.583] (==) Automatically enabling devices
[ 16.583] (==) Automatically adding GPU devices
[ 16.583] (==) Max clients allowed: 256, resource mask: 0x1fffff
[ 16.583] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/misc/" does not exist.
[ 16.583] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 16.583] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/TTF/" does not exist.
[ 16.583] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 16.583] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/OTF/" does not exist.
[ 16.583] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 16.583] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/Type1/" does not exist.
[ 16.583] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 16.583] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/100dpi/" does not exist.
[ 16.583] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 16.583] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/75dpi/" does not exist.
[ 16.583] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 16.583] (==) FontPath set to:
[ 16.583] (==) ModulePath set to "/usr/lib64/xorg/modules"
[ 16.583] (II) The server relies on udev to provide the list of input devices.
If no devices become available, reconfigure udev or disable AutoAddDevices.
[ 16.583] (II) Loader magic: 0x560f9d540ce0
[ 16.583] (II) Module ABI versions:
[ 16.583] X.Org ANSI C Emulation: 0.4
[ 16.583] X.Org Video Driver: 24.1
[ 16.583] X.Org XInput driver : 24.1
[ 16.583] X.Org Server Extension : 10.0
[ 16.585] (++) using VT number 1
[ 16.587] (II) systemd-logind: took control of session /org/freedesktop/login1/session/_31
[ 16.587] (II) xfree86: Adding drm device (/dev/dri/card0)
[ 17.133] (II) systemd-logind: got fd for /dev/dri/card0 226:0 fd 10 paused 0
[ 17.136] (--) PCI: (3@0:0:0) 1002:7340:1462:12b5 rev 193, Mem @ 0xd0000000/268435456, 0xe0000000/2097152, 0xfe500000/524288, BIOS @ 0x????????/131072
[ 17.136] (--) PCI:*(7@0:0:0) 1002:1636:1462:12b5 rev 198, Mem @ 0xb0000000/268435456, 0xc0000000/2097152, 0xfe400000/524288, I/O @ 0x0000e000/256
[ 17.136] (II) LoadModule: "glx"
[ 17.139] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/extensions/libglx.so
[ 17.145] (II) Module glx: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
[ 17.145] compiled for 1.20.8, module version = 1.0.0
[ 17.145] ABI class: X.Org Server Extension, version 10.0
[ 17.145] (II) LoadModule: "amdgpu"
[ 17.145] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/drivers/amdgpu_drv.so
[ 17.149] (II) Module amdgpu: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
[ 17.149] compiled for 1.20.8, module version = 19.1.0
[ 17.149] Module class: X.Org Video Driver
[ 17.149] ABI class: X.Org Video Driver, version 24.1
[ 17.149] (II) AMDGPU: Driver for AMD Radeon:
All GPUs supported by the amdgpu kernel driver
[ 17.149] (II) AMDGPU(0): [KMS] drm report modesetting isn't supported.
[ 17.150] (WW) VGA arbiter: cannot open kernel arbiter, no multi-card support
[ 17.150] (EE) Screen 0 deleted because of no matching config section.
[ 17.150] (II) UnloadModule: "amdgpu"
[ 17.150] (EE) Device(s) detected, but none match those in the config file.
[ 17.150] (EE)
Fatal server error:
[ 17.150] (EE) no screens found(EE)
[ 17.150] (EE)
Please consult the The X.Org Foundation support
at http://wiki.x.org
for help.
[ 17.150] (EE) Please also check the log file at "/home/andrey/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log" for additional information.
[ 17.150] (EE)
[ 17.154] (EE) Server terminated with error (1). Closing log file. |
Any help will be appreciated and thanks in advance,
Astolfo. |
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54237 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 10:23 am Post subject: |
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Astolfo,
Welcome to Gentoo.
Your problem is Code: | [ 101.607] (II) AMDGPU(0): [KMS] drm report modesetting isn't supported. |
That means that DRM is (Direct Render Manager) is missing from your kernel.
All the drivers in your list of possible drivers
Code: | [ 101.602] (==) Matched amdgpu as autoconfigured driver 0
[ 101.602] (==) Matched ati as autoconfigured driver 1
[ 101.602] (==) Matched modesetting as autoconfigured driver 2
[ 101.602] (==) Matched fbdev as autoconfigured driver 3
[ 101.602] (==) Matched vesa as autoconfigured driver 4 | except vesa need it. _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail. |
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Astolfo n00b
Joined: 27 Sep 2020 Posts: 12
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 10:41 am Post subject: |
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Thank you NeddySeagoon.
I have sys-kernel/linux-firmware installed and I use binary kernel gentoo-kernel-bin.
Should I compile my kernel (to enable drm)? |
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54237 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 12:15 pm Post subject: |
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Astolfo,
What does Quote: | zgrep DRM /proc/config.gz | tell?
You need at least Code: | CONFIG_DRM=y
# CONFIG_DRM_DP_AUX_CHARDEV is not set
# CONFIG_DRM_DEBUG_MM is not set
# CONFIG_DRM_DEBUG_SELFTEST is not set
CONFIG_DRM_KMS_HELPER=y
CONFIG_DRM_KMS_FB_HELPER=y
...
| some of those are set by others, so they are not all kernel configuration options.
That's the bits that provide DRM.
You also need CONFIG_DRM_AMDGPU=y or CONFIG_DRM_AMDGPU=m
Code: | # CONFIG_DRM_AMDGPU_SI is not set
# CONFIG_DRM_AMDGPU_CIK is not set | if you have one of those GPUs
Code: | [ 101.593] (--) PCI: (3@0:0:0) 1002:7340 |
You have a Navi 14 [Radeon RX 5500 / 5500M] GPU, so
Code: | # CONFIG_DRM_AMDGPU_SI is not set
# CONFIG_DRM_AMDGPU_CIK is not set | (set off) is a good idea but not required.
Check your kernel and rebuild it if required. xorg cannot work with the amdgpu driver without DRM. _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail. |
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Astolfo n00b
Joined: 27 Sep 2020 Posts: 12
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 12:32 pm Post subject: |
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NeddySeagoon,
https://pastebin.com/M1f87BBb - my config
I have:
Code: | CONFIG_DRM=m
CONFIG_DRM_KMS_HELPER=m
CONFIG_DRM_KMS_FB_HELPER=y
CONFIG_DRM_AMDGPU=m
CONFIG_DRM_AMDGPU_SI=y
CONFIG_DRM_AMDGPU_CIK=y |
So I guess my kernel is fine? |
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54237 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 12:53 pm Post subject: |
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Astolfo,
That tells me that you are not running the kernel that belongs to that configuration.
That config fragment contradicts missing the missing DRM support supported by xorg.
What does tell?
The date/time is the build date and time of the running kernel. DOes that look right to you or did you make a newer one?
Is you normal user in the video group?
The groups command will show that. DRM requires direct access to the hardware, and being a member of the video group provides that.
What do you have in /dev/dri/ ?
I get
Code: | $ ls /dev/dri/ -l
total 0
crw-rw---- 1 root video 226, 0 Feb 16 2014 card0
crw-rw---- 1 root video 226, 64 Feb 16 2014 controlD64 |
Empty is the wrong answer, That would be a kernel problem.
Notice that access to the /dev entries are restricted to root and video group members. _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail. |
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Astolfo n00b
Joined: 27 Sep 2020 Posts: 12
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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NeddySeagoon, thank you for your investigation.
uname -a:
Code: | Linux alt 5.4.64 #1 SMP Thu Sep 10 06:57:37 -00 2020 x86_64 AMD Ryzen 7 4800H with Radeon Graphics AuthenticAMD GNU/Linux |
Quote: | The date/time is the build date and time of the running kernel. DOes that look right to you or did you make a newer one?
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I am using sys-kernel/gentoo-kernel-bin, so the kernel has been built by gentoo's team.
ls:
Code: | drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 80 Sep 27 16:12 by-path
crw-rw----+ 1 root video 226, 0 Sep 27 16:12 card0
crw-rw-rw- 1 root video 226, 128 Sep 27 16:12 renderD128
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My groups: wheel audio video usb input users plugdev |
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Astolfo n00b
Joined: 27 Sep 2020 Posts: 12
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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I tried to use kernel built from source using genkernel, it didn't help. |
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Astolfo n00b
Joined: 27 Sep 2020 Posts: 12
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 4:18 pm Post subject: |
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If I replace my xorg config with
Code: | Section "Device"
Identifier "modesetting"
Driver "modesetting"
EndSection |
I get Cannot run in framebuffer mode. Please specify busIDs for all framebuffer devices
Code: | [ 11.994]
X.Org X Server 1.20.8
X Protocol Version 11, Revision 0
[ 11.995] Build Operating System: Linux 5.4.64 x86_64 Gentoo
[ 11.995] Current Operating System: Linux alt 5.4.66-gentoo-x86_64 #1 SMP Sun Sep 27 18:29:52 MSK 2020 x86_64
[ 11.995] Kernel command line: BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-5.4.66-gentoo-x86_64 root=UUID=00f7b30a-e080-430c-a94d-fe902efac208 ro
[ 11.995] Build Date: 26 September 2020 09:28:26PM
[ 11.995]
[ 11.995] Current version of pixman: 0.40.0
[ 11.995] Before reporting problems, check http://wiki.x.org
to make sure that you have the latest version.
[ 11.995] Markers: (--) probed, (**) from config file, (==) default setting,
(++) from command line, (!!) notice, (II) informational,
(WW) warning, (EE) error, (NI) not implemented, (??) unknown.
[ 11.995] (==) Log file: "/home/andrey/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log", Time: Sun Sep 27 19:13:14 2020
[ 11.997] (==) Using config directory: "/etc/X11/xorg.conf.d"
[ 11.997] (==) Using system config directory "/usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d"
[ 11.997] (==) No Layout section. Using the first Screen section.
[ 11.997] (==) No screen section available. Using defaults.
[ 11.997] (**) |-->Screen "Default Screen Section" (0)
[ 11.997] (**) | |-->Monitor "<default monitor>"
[ 11.998] (==) No device specified for screen "Default Screen Section".
Using the first device section listed.
[ 11.998] (**) | |-->Device "modesetting"
[ 11.998] (==) No monitor specified for screen "Default Screen Section".
Using a default monitor configuration.
[ 11.998] (==) Automatically adding devices
[ 11.998] (==) Automatically enabling devices
[ 11.998] (==) Automatically adding GPU devices
[ 11.998] (==) Max clients allowed: 256, resource mask: 0x1fffff
[ 11.998] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/misc/" does not exist.
[ 11.998] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 11.998] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/TTF/" does not exist.
[ 11.998] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 11.998] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/OTF/" does not exist.
[ 11.998] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 11.998] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/Type1/" does not exist.
[ 11.998] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 11.998] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/100dpi/" does not exist.
[ 11.998] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 11.998] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/75dpi/" does not exist.
[ 11.998] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 11.998] (==) FontPath set to:
[ 11.998] (==) ModulePath set to "/usr/lib64/xorg/modules"
[ 11.998] (II) The server relies on udev to provide the list of input devices.
If no devices become available, reconfigure udev or disable AutoAddDevices.
[ 11.998] (II) Loader magic: 0x55d0e21c4ce0
[ 11.998] (II) Module ABI versions:
[ 11.998] X.Org ANSI C Emulation: 0.4
[ 11.998] X.Org Video Driver: 24.1
[ 11.998] X.Org XInput driver : 24.1
[ 11.998] X.Org Server Extension : 10.0
[ 11.999] (++) using VT number 1
[ 12.001] (II) systemd-logind: took control of session /org/freedesktop/login1/session/_31
[ 12.002] (II) xfree86: Adding drm device (/dev/dri/card0)
[ 12.004] (II) systemd-logind: got fd for /dev/dri/card0 226:0 fd 10 paused 0
[ 12.009] (--) PCI: (3@0:0:0) 1002:7340:1462:12b5 rev 193, Mem @ 0xd0000000/268435456, 0xe0000000/2097152, 0xfe500000/524288, BIOS @ 0x????????/131072
[ 12.009] (--) PCI:*(7@0:0:0) 1002:1636:1462:12b5 rev 198, Mem @ 0xb0000000/268435456, 0xc0000000/2097152, 0xfe400000/524288, I/O @ 0x0000e000/256
[ 12.009] (II) LoadModule: "glx"
[ 12.010] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/extensions/libglx.so
[ 12.015] (II) Module glx: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
[ 12.015] compiled for 1.20.8, module version = 1.0.0
[ 12.015] ABI class: X.Org Server Extension, version 10.0
[ 12.015] (II) LoadModule: "modesetting"
[ 12.015] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/drivers/modesetting_drv.so
[ 12.015] (II) Module modesetting: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
[ 12.015] compiled for 1.20.8, module version = 1.20.8
[ 12.015] Module class: X.Org Video Driver
[ 12.015] ABI class: X.Org Video Driver, version 24.1
[ 12.015] (II) modesetting: Driver for Modesetting Kernel Drivers: kms
[ 12.018] (WW) Falling back to old probe method for modesetting
[ 12.019] (II) modeset(1): using default device
[ 12.019] (II) modeset(G0): using drv /dev/dri/card0
[ 12.019] (WW) VGA arbiter: cannot open kernel arbiter, no multi-card support
[ 12.019] (EE) Screen 0 deleted because of no matching config section.
[ 12.019] (II) UnloadModule: "modesetting"
[ 12.019] (EE)
Fatal server error:
[ 12.019] (EE) Cannot run in framebuffer mode. Please specify busIDs for all framebuffer devices
[ 12.019] (EE)
[ 12.019] (EE)
Please consult the The X.Org Foundation support
at http://wiki.x.org
for help.
[ 12.019] (EE) Please also check the log file at "/home/andrey/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log" for additional information.
[ 12.019] (EE)
[ 12.021] (EE) Server terminated with error (1). Closing log file.
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54237 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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Astolfo,
Code: | [ 12.002] (II) xfree86: Adding drm device (/dev/dri/card0) |
That's new and was missing before.
xorg should start on its own with no xorg.config
You will get a USA keymap and a right handed mouse but the defaults work.
Please test with no xorg.config file.
Ah ... You have two AMD graphics cards, a Navi 14 [Radeon Pro 5500M] a Renoir.
Both need the amdgpu driver.
You should have both cards in /dev/dri but there is only one.
Remove one card until Xorg works.
You will need an xorg.conf to make a two card setup work and the Device sections (there will be two) will need PCI bus entries so that Xorg can tell which is which.
Gentoo works best when you add to what already works. That keeps the problem space small. _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail. |
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Astolfo n00b
Joined: 27 Sep 2020 Posts: 12
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 8:29 pm Post subject: |
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I guess we are almost there!!! Thank you!
I booted into parrot os and saw 2 cards (/dev/dri)
lshw -C display:
Code: | *-display
description: Display controller
product: Navi 14 [Radeon RX 5500/5500M / Pro 5500M]
vendor: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI]
physical id: 0
bus info: pci@0000:03:00.0
version: c1
width: 64 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: pm pciexpress msi bus_master cap_list rom
configuration: driver=amdgpu latency=0
resources: irq:90 memory:d0000000-dfffffff memory:e0000000-e01fffff memory:fe500000-fe57ffff memory:fe580000-fe59ffff
*-display UNCLAIMED
description: VGA compatible controller
product: Renoir
vendor: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI]
physical id: 0
bus info: pci@0000:07:00.0
version: c6
width: 64 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: pm pciexpress msi msix vga_controller bus_master cap_list
configuration: latency=0
resources: memory:b0000000-bfffffff memory:c0000000-c01fffff ioport:e000(size=256) memory:fe400000-fe47ffff |
And lspci:
Code: | 00:00.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir Root Complex
00:00.2 IOMMU: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir IOMMU
00:01.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir PCIe Dummy Host Bridge
00:01.1 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir PCIe GPP Bridge
00:02.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir PCIe Dummy Host Bridge
00:02.1 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir PCIe GPP Bridge
00:02.2 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir PCIe GPP Bridge
00:02.4 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir PCIe GPP Bridge
00:08.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir PCIe Dummy Host Bridge
00:08.1 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir Internal PCIe GPP Bridge to Bus
00:08.2 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir Internal PCIe GPP Bridge to Bus
00:14.0 SMBus: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] FCH SMBus Controller (rev 51)
00:14.3 ISA bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] FCH LPC Bridge (rev 51)
00:18.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir Device 24: Function 0
00:18.1 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir Device 24: Function 1
00:18.2 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir Device 24: Function 2
00:18.3 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir Device 24: Function 3
00:18.4 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir Device 24: Function 4
00:18.5 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir Device 24: Function 5
00:18.6 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir Device 24: Function 6
00:18.7 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir Device 24: Function 7
01:00.0 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Navi 10 XL Upstream Port of PCI Express Switch (rev c1)
02:00.0 PCI bridge: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Navi 10 XL Downstream Port of PCI Express Switch
03:00.0 Display controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Navi 14 [Radeon RX 5500/5500M / Pro 5500M] (rev c1)
03:00.1 Audio device: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Navi 10 HDMI Audio
04:00.0 Network controller: Intel Corporation Wi-Fi 6 AX200 (rev 1a)
05:00.0 Ethernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet Controller (rev 15)
06:00.0 Non-Volatile memory controller: Lite-On Technology Corporation Device 9100 (rev 03)
07:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Renoir (rev c6)
07:00.2 Encryption controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Family 17h (Models 10h-1fh) Platform Security Processor
07:00.3 USB controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir USB 3.1
07:00.4 USB controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Renoir USB 3.1
07:00.5 Multimedia controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Raven/Raven2/FireFlight/Renoir Audio Processor (rev 01)
07:00.6 Audio device: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Family 17h (Models 10h-1fh) HD Audio Controller
08:00.0 SATA controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] FCH SATA Controller [AHCI mode] (rev 81)
08:00.1 SATA controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] FCH SATA Controller [AHCI mode] (rev 81)
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But I cant figure out how to attach amdgpu to this card (which is UNCLAIMED)... I believe it will solve the problem! |
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54237 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 9:30 pm Post subject: |
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Astolfo,
You are going to need to write an xorg.conf file.
will make your eyes glaze over but its all there.
You will need a Code: | Section "ServerLayout" | to put it all together.
Multipleare required, one for each physical screen.
Two will be required.
xorgs automatics work for one screen and and one graphics card.
That's why I wanted to know that that worked before we added an xorg.conf to add the rest in.
Be sure your Identifiers in your xorg.conf sections are all unique. That's how xorg puts all the pieces together.
Code: | Section "Device"
Identifier "navi"
Driver "amdgpu"
BusID "pci:0@03:00:0"
EndSection | is the bare minimum for the Navi GPU
The Renoir GPU will be similar
Code: | Section "Device"
Identifier "renoir"
Driver "amdgpu"
BusID "pci:0@07:00:0"
EndSection |
You need the other sections I listed too. The Gentoo Wik covers multiple monitors an one GPU.
Start with one GPU, and make it work multi monitor. Then do the same with the other GPU.
At the end, put the working pieces together. _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
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Astolfo n00b
Joined: 27 Sep 2020 Posts: 12
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Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2020 10:59 pm Post subject: |
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I have only one monitor, so I used this link https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Xorg/Guide and tried:
Code: | Section "Device"
Identifier "renoir"
Driver "amdgpu"
BusID "pci:0@07:00:0"
Option "Monitor-VGA-0" "main_monitor"
EndSection
Section "Monitor"
Identifier "main_monitor"
EndSection
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But I get:
Code: | [ 64.161]
X.Org X Server 1.20.8
X Protocol Version 11, Revision 0
[ 64.162] Build Operating System: Linux 5.4.64 x86_64 Gentoo
[ 64.162] Current Operating System: Linux alt 5.4.66-gentoo-x86_64 #1 SMP Sun Sep 27 18:29:52 MSK 2020 x86_64
[ 64.162] Kernel command line: BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-5.4.66-gentoo-x86_64 root=UUID=00f7b30a-e080-430c-a94d-fe902efac208 ro
[ 64.163] Build Date: 26 September 2020 09:28:26PM
[ 64.164]
[ 64.164] Current version of pixman: 0.40.0
[ 64.165] Before reporting problems, check http://wiki.x.org
to make sure that you have the latest version.
[ 64.165] Markers: (--) probed, (**) from config file, (==) default setting,
(++) from command line, (!!) notice, (II) informational,
(WW) warning, (EE) error, (NI) not implemented, (??) unknown.
[ 64.167] (==) Log file: "/home/andrey/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log", Time: Mon Sep 28 01:45:50 2020
[ 64.170] (==) Using config file: "/etc/X11/xorg.conf"
[ 64.170] (==) Using system config directory "/usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d"
[ 64.170] (==) No Layout section. Using the first Screen section.
[ 64.170] (==) No screen section available. Using defaults.
[ 64.170] (**) |-->Screen "Default Screen Section" (0)
[ 64.170] (**) | |-->Monitor "<default monitor>"
[ 64.170] (==) No device specified for screen "Default Screen Section".
Using the first device section listed.
[ 64.170] (**) | |-->Device "renoir"
[ 64.170] (==) No monitor specified for screen "Default Screen Section".
Using a default monitor configuration.
[ 64.170] (==) Automatically adding devices
[ 64.170] (==) Automatically enabling devices
[ 64.170] (==) Automatically adding GPU devices
[ 64.170] (==) Max clients allowed: 256, resource mask: 0x1fffff
[ 64.171] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/misc/" does not exist.
[ 64.171] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 64.171] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/TTF/" does not exist.
[ 64.171] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 64.171] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/OTF/" does not exist.
[ 64.171] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 64.171] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/Type1/" does not exist.
[ 64.171] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 64.171] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/100dpi/" does not exist.
[ 64.171] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 64.171] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/75dpi/" does not exist.
[ 64.171] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 64.171] (==) FontPath set to:
[ 64.171] (==) ModulePath set to "/usr/lib64/xorg/modules"
[ 64.171] (II) The server relies on udev to provide the list of input devices.
If no devices become available, reconfigure udev or disable AutoAddDevices.
[ 64.171] (II) Loader magic: 0x557720b17ce0
[ 64.171] (II) Module ABI versions:
[ 64.171] X.Org ANSI C Emulation: 0.4
[ 64.171] X.Org Video Driver: 24.1
[ 64.171] X.Org XInput driver : 24.1
[ 64.171] X.Org Server Extension : 10.0
[ 64.172] (++) using VT number 1
[ 64.173] (II) systemd-logind: took control of session /org/freedesktop/login1/session/_31
[ 64.173] (II) xfree86: Adding drm device (/dev/dri/card0)
[ 64.718] (II) systemd-logind: got fd for /dev/dri/card0 226:0 fd 10 paused 0
[ 64.722] (--) PCI: (3@0:0:0) 1002:7340:1462:12b5 rev 193, Mem @ 0xd0000000/268435456, 0xe0000000/2097152, 0xfe500000/524288, BIOS @ 0x????????/131072
[ 64.722] (--) PCI:*(7@0:0:0) 1002:1636:1462:12b5 rev 198, Mem @ 0xb0000000/268435456, 0xc0000000/2097152, 0xfe400000/524288, I/O @ 0x0000e000/256
[ 64.722] (II) LoadModule: "glx"
[ 64.726] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/extensions/libglx.so
[ 64.732] (II) Module glx: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
[ 64.732] compiled for 1.20.8, module version = 1.0.0
[ 64.732] ABI class: X.Org Server Extension, version 10.0
[ 64.732] (II) LoadModule: "amdgpu"
[ 64.732] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/drivers/amdgpu_drv.so
[ 64.737] (II) Module amdgpu: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
[ 64.737] compiled for 1.20.8, module version = 19.1.0
[ 64.737] Module class: X.Org Video Driver
[ 64.737] ABI class: X.Org Video Driver, version 24.1
[ 64.737] (II) AMDGPU: Driver for AMD Radeon:
All GPUs supported by the amdgpu kernel driver
[ 64.738] (EE) No devices detected.
[ 64.738] (EE)
Fatal server error:
[ 64.738] (EE) no screens found(EE)
[ 64.738] (EE)
Please consult the The X.Org Foundation support
at http://wiki.x.org
for help.
[ 64.738] (EE) Please also check the log file at "/home/andrey/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log" for additional information.
[ 64.738] (EE)
[ 64.742] (EE) Server terminated with error (1). Closing log file.
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If I try
Code: | Section "Device"
Identifier "renoir"
Driver "amdgpu"
BusID "pci:0@07:00:0"
Option "Monitor-VGA-0" "main_monitor"
EndSection
Section "Monitor"
Identifier "main_monitor"
EndSection
Section "Screen"
Identifier "main_screen"
Device "renoir"
Monitor "main_monitor"
SubSection "Display"
EndSubSection
EndSection |
I get
Code: | [ 163.914]
X.Org X Server 1.20.8
X Protocol Version 11, Revision 0
[ 163.914] Build Operating System: Linux 5.4.64 x86_64 Gentoo
[ 163.914] Current Operating System: Linux alt 5.4.66-gentoo-x86_64 #1 SMP Sun Sep 27 18:29:52 MSK 2020 x86_64
[ 163.914] Kernel command line: BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-5.4.66-gentoo-x86_64 root=UUID=00f7b30a-e080-430c-a94d-fe902efac208 ro
[ 163.914] Build Date: 26 September 2020 09:28:26PM
[ 163.914]
[ 163.914] Current version of pixman: 0.40.0
[ 163.914] Before reporting problems, check http://wiki.x.org
to make sure that you have the latest version.
[ 163.914] Markers: (--) probed, (**) from config file, (==) default setting,
(++) from command line, (!!) notice, (II) informational,
(WW) warning, (EE) error, (NI) not implemented, (??) unknown.
[ 163.914] (==) Log file: "/home/andrey/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log", Time: Mon Sep 28 01:54:58 2020
[ 163.917] (==) Using config file: "/etc/X11/xorg.conf"
[ 163.917] (==) Using system config directory "/usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d"
[ 163.917] (==) No Layout section. Using the first Screen section.
[ 163.917] (**) |-->Screen "main_screen" (0)
[ 163.917] (**) | |-->Monitor "main_monitor"
[ 163.917] (**) | |-->Device "renoir"
[ 163.917] (==) Automatically adding devices
[ 163.917] (==) Automatically enabling devices
[ 163.917] (==) Automatically adding GPU devices
[ 163.917] (==) Max clients allowed: 256, resource mask: 0x1fffff
[ 163.918] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/misc/" does not exist.
[ 163.918] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 163.918] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/TTF/" does not exist.
[ 163.918] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 163.918] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/OTF/" does not exist.
[ 163.918] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 163.918] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/Type1/" does not exist.
[ 163.918] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 163.918] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/100dpi/" does not exist.
[ 163.918] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 163.918] (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/75dpi/" does not exist.
[ 163.918] Entry deleted from font path.
[ 163.918] (==) FontPath set to:
[ 163.918] (==) ModulePath set to "/usr/lib64/xorg/modules"
[ 163.918] (II) The server relies on udev to provide the list of input devices.
If no devices become available, reconfigure udev or disable AutoAddDevices.
[ 163.918] (II) Loader magic: 0x55733bf1fce0
[ 163.918] (II) Module ABI versions:
[ 163.918] X.Org ANSI C Emulation: 0.4
[ 163.918] X.Org Video Driver: 24.1
[ 163.918] X.Org XInput driver : 24.1
[ 163.918] X.Org Server Extension : 10.0
[ 163.919] (++) using VT number 1
[ 163.922] (II) systemd-logind: took control of session /org/freedesktop/login1/session/_31
[ 163.922] (II) xfree86: Adding drm device (/dev/dri/card0)
[ 164.468] (II) systemd-logind: got fd for /dev/dri/card0 226:0 fd 10 paused 0
[ 164.473] (--) PCI: (3@0:0:0) 1002:7340:1462:12b5 rev 193, Mem @ 0xd0000000/268435456, 0xe0000000/2097152, 0xfe500000/524288, BIOS @ 0x????????/131072
[ 164.473] (--) PCI:*(7@0:0:0) 1002:1636:1462:12b5 rev 198, Mem @ 0xb0000000/268435456, 0xc0000000/2097152, 0xfe400000/524288, I/O @ 0x0000e000/256
[ 164.473] (II) LoadModule: "glx"
[ 164.474] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/extensions/libglx.so
[ 164.480] (II) Module glx: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
[ 164.480] compiled for 1.20.8, module version = 1.0.0
[ 164.480] ABI class: X.Org Server Extension, version 10.0
[ 164.480] (II) LoadModule: "amdgpu"
[ 164.480] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/drivers/amdgpu_drv.so
[ 164.485] (II) Module amdgpu: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
[ 164.485] compiled for 1.20.8, module version = 19.1.0
[ 164.485] Module class: X.Org Video Driver
[ 164.485] ABI class: X.Org Video Driver, version 24.1
[ 164.485] (II) AMDGPU: Driver for AMD Radeon:
All GPUs supported by the amdgpu kernel driver
[ 164.486] (EE) No devices detected.
[ 164.486] (EE)
Fatal server error:
[ 164.486] (EE) no screens found(EE)
[ 164.486] (EE)
Please consult the The X.Org Foundation support
at http://wiki.x.org
for help.
[ 164.486] (EE) Please also check the log file at "/home/andrey/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log" for additional information.
[ 164.486] (EE)
[ 164.490] (EE) Server terminated with error (1). Closing log file.
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54237 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2020 10:26 am Post subject: |
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Astolfo,
Code: | [ 164.485] (II) AMDGPU: Driver for AMD Radeon:
All GPUs supported by the amdgpu kernel driver
[ 164.486] (EE) No devices detected.
[ 164.486] (EE) |
That says that the amdgpu kernel driver could not detect a GPU at BusID "pci:0@07:00:0"
Either the driver is the wrong one or the BusID is incorrect.
As you are telling Xorg what to do, it won't try auto detection for the bits you have in your xorg.conf _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail. |
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Astolfo n00b
Joined: 27 Sep 2020 Posts: 12
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Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2020 7:54 pm Post subject: |
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Specifying discrete gpu as a device in xorg.conf I was able to start x however only with hdmi external monitor, so I do believe that the problem is with integrated graphics and with:
Code: | *-display
description: Display controller
product: Navi 14 [Radeon RX 5500/5500M / Pro 5500M]
vendor: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI]
physical id: 0
bus info: pci@0000:03:00.0
version: c1
width: 64 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: pm pciexpress msi bus_master cap_list rom
configuration: driver=amdgpu latency=0
resources: irq:90 memory:d0000000-dfffffff memory:e0000000-e01fffff memory:fe500000-fe57ffff memory:fe580000-fe59ffff
*-display UNCLAIMED
description: VGA compatible controller
product: Renoir
vendor: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI]
physical id: 0
bus info: pci@0000:07:00.0
version: c6
width: 64 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: pm pciexpress msi msix vga_controller bus_master cap_list
configuration: latency=0
resources: memory:b0000000-bfffffff memory:c0000000-c01fffff ioport:e000(size=256) memory:fe400000-fe47ffff |
I ran dmesg: (what does it mean [ 4.521142] [drm] This hardware requires experimental hardware support. )
Full dmesg https://pastebin.com/6CSqHguj |
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54237 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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Astolfo,
You are using the stable kernel
Code: | [ 0.000000] Linux version 5.4.66-gentoo-x86_64 |
Try the testing kernel, which is 5.8.x or even the almost ready 5.9.0-rc7 _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail. |
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Astolfo n00b
Joined: 27 Sep 2020 Posts: 12
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Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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NeddySeagoon,
Thank you very much, it worked!
I really appreciate your help. I installed 5.7.19 (I don't want to go too far from "stable") and it worked!
Thank you very much!
(I should test it for a couple of days, if everything is fine I will add [SOLVED]) |
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54237 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2020 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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Astolfo,
With very new hardware, there may be kernel regressions that stop it working sometime.
Now you have a kernel that works, don't lose it.
By all means try newer kernels but keep 5.7.19 on your boot menu just in case the update breaks something.
A word of warning. The 5.7 kernel has gone from gentoo, so that kernel series is no longer maintained.
What I had in mind was keywording sys-kernel/gentoo-sources to permit portage to install the testing sys-kernel/gentoo-sources.
That's 5.8.12, as I write. _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail. |
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