Woe is me (Can anybody solve the mystery?)

flaw3d · n00b Joined: 07 Aug 2002 Posts: 20

Oh woe is me..

What is the problem you say?

I had been running debian for quite some time before I decided to make the change to Gentoo. After installing it I have to say it is definitely my favourite distro now. That being said two problems have arisen.

1. Grub failed to install, lilo won't install

Lilo tells me that the first sector of /dev/hda1 doesn't have a valid boot signature, lies! fdisk clearly shows that it does. Strangely enough whilst grub might claim to have installed it actually just goes to the command line grub interface where I can successfully enter.

kernel /boot/bzImage root=/dev/hda1
-enter-
boot

Presto, system boots. I only tell you about this error because I want to make sure it doesn't have anything to do with the next (and final) problem.

2. The Random Reboots!

This system has been liable to randomly reboot at times for no apparent reason, I have suspected it was hardware related but at the end of the day it only appeared after software installation. The reboot is just a hard flash and she's gone. I'm risking it now yet it more often happens when the computer is idle or reaches an idle state. (but not a screen off timeout).. ie when I walk out the room the bastard thinks its time to stuff me up

I will try to explain the common times I have seen in reboot.

- Often when I have finished playing a game, it might reboot exactly after the game has finished. This has happened with RTCW, Warcraft 3 and maybe GTA 3.

- Almost consistantly if I use our mp3 server to play an album from.

- Other completely random times.

- It once rebooted after I pulled out the stereo plug in my soundcard. I suspected perhaps a naughtly feedback firing amp was perhaps the case. The system has since rebooted when the amp is off just to keep me guessing.

Anyway, have any of you experienced this? I will post more as people make suggestions and I implement them. It is strange that it is such a hard reboot though.

thanks..

rommel · Posted: Wed Aug 07, 2002 6:22 am Post subject:

what version of gentoo (gcc version)? possibly some harware details , kernel you have installed?....help them help you.

just for the record i have never had a random reboot running gentoo ...i have been running it only since april....i have lost an install due to ignorance...but i am trying to control that problem even as i type this

flaw3d · n00b Joined: 07 Aug 2002 Posts: 20

Duron 1200
Abit KT7A
CMI7878 (i think) chipset soundcard
Realtek chipset Network card

Gcc: Current 2.95.3-r7
Latest Kernel
Latest Nvidia kernel drivers

(A very new gentoo installation)

flaw3d · n00b Joined: 07 Aug 2002 Posts: 20

I seriously doubt many (if any) people are experiencing random reboots. My flatmate certainly does not.

delta407

rommel · Posted: Wed Aug 07, 2002 6:35 am Post subject:

latest gentoo kernel? or linus kernel?...if its a gentoo kernel rm /usr/src/linux adn the src's directory and emerge the vanilla 2.4.19 kernel and try it, assuming you dont have a specific need that only a gentoo kernel can meet (like xfs)

Pigeon · Guru Joined: 21 Jun 2002 Posts: 307

Is APM or ACPI enabled? In your kernel?

flaw3d · n00b Joined: 07 Aug 2002 Posts: 20

Nope, APC and ACPI are not enabled.

The kernel is the latest gentoo patch yes.

Delta407: No, not overclocking. menu.1st is fine, lilo doesn't install either, there is obviously a bigger problem.

I am experimenting with keeping the sound module out of the kernel at the moment. The system has not yet reboot. The acid test will be to leave it on all night, which I shall do.

mgirard · n00b Joined: 30 Jul 2002 Posts: 64

I experianced ALOT of hard lock-ups (not rebooting though) shortly after I installed gentoo. In my case it was just a coincidence as the problem was my motherboard flaking out. At first I thought it was my video card (a geforce 2) as it always seemed to lock up in X... but it was definitely the MB.

Just be open to the possibility of hardware issues with your kind of problem...

-Mg

thor · n00b Joined: 18 Jul 2002 Posts: 25 Location: m-ger

hi

my guess:
weak power supply
and/or
cpu overheating ...

have you verified this yet?

th.
_________________
good things come to those who ....................... wait

harsha · Posted: Wed Aug 07, 2002 2:30 pm Post subject:

Delta407>Sounds like /boot/grub/menu.lst (lst as in LIST, not 1st) is missing or something
Flaw3d>No, not overclocking. menu.1st is fine, lilo doesn't install either, there is obviously a bigger problem.

This seems to be the problem for your first question.
I've had some random reboots a couple of times, but got fixed when I recompiled my kernel. I made sure I did an make mrproper, and removed the power management options. I guess I left some option ON before this, I have no idea wt it is though. Once it started workin fine, I never bothered about it again.

Harsha

flaw3d · n00b Joined: 07 Aug 2002 Posts: 20

CPU is not overheating. For one it is winter here and it does not go over 45 degrees (that is the cpu temp). Power supply is admitably cheap but functioned a-okay before gentoo came along, not that it couldn't be showing signs of poor performance though. Actually, come to think of it, the computer does reset when too much thumping on the floor is applied near it. I might investigate this a little further.

The soundcard module was unloaded and the computer left on, it still rebooted so obviously the problem lies not in the software implementation of the soundcard.

I have a feeling the kernel is the problem or the power supply. I will try to acquire another power supply to test this phenomena. I will of course build a vanilla 2.4.19 kernel today.

Thanks for your help people, all of these things I probably could have thought of but its a lot easier when people ask you questions and give you ideas to work on.

rommel · Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2002 5:14 am Post subject:

just post back if you fix it and know how or what did it...just incase someone else happens across a similar problem

aardvark · Guru Joined: 30 Jun 2002 Posts: 576

BOOT:If you have installed+set up grub just like in the install guide, it should work. Have you veryfied?

REBOOTS: I have seen no mentions here of the athlon/nvidia/linux "bug"
there is a known problem on some systems (mine) with random freezes/ reboots. A workaround is the following :

Add this to your kernel boot line (as an option)

aardvark · Guru Joined: 30 Jun 2002 Posts: 576

insomniac · Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2002 6:38 am Post subject:

Definitely sounds like a hardware problem to me... The boot thingy could be a flaky harddrive... and it's definitely not a good sign if the computer reboots when you thump on the floor near it..
_________________
My next computer is also a Gentoo computer

rac · Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2002 7:02 am Post subject:

phong · Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2002 1:16 pm Post subject:

I agree that it sounds like a possible hardware problem. Try reseating cards and redoing power connections inside the case. It is possible something hardware-wise started flaking out at the same time you installed Gentoo by coincidence. Try pulling out cards completely - live without your sound card for a few days to see if it's the culprit, etc.

Back in "the day" I had a VLB video card that seemed to work fine most of the time, but would cause occasional random reboots because it wasn't seated quite perfectly (apparently random vibrations would cause it to break connections or something). VLB cards never seated well though so...

michaelb · Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2002 2:15 pm Post subject:

toliman · n00b Joined: 08 Aug 2002 Posts: 14 Location: Melbourne, AU

i would have to agree, it's a hardware problem.

if you don't feel comfortable with trusting gentoo / linux, then copy the distfiles dir to a cd-rom or another machine for later reinstall, install windows 2k/98se/xp, with the latest servicepack/patches, the latest via chipset 4in1's (if appropriate) , latest nvidia WHQL (from the nvidia website) and try to run a few games. if the hardware reset problem perisists, or if it works fine with windows & not gentoo, then come back to tell us.

first bootsector error might be something else, maybe your BIOS has some setting that is locking the bootsector from modification (anti-virus protect), maybe not.

i used to have the same problem, with the "rock 'n reboot" and one day, the PSU blew up. was really very good, i was holding the case as i was plugging it back after cleaning behind the computer... i replaced it, and the system went from bad to flaky. replaced the SDRAM with faster, more expensive and more reliable SDRAM, worked like a charm. 2 years later, still works.

i used to think it was an interrupt conflict problem, but if i took out hardware devices, it would get better. i had no idea on what caused it.

you might not feel that the hardware is at fault. in that case, 2nd best option is to tweak the BIOS configuration.you can slow a system down purposefully or put settings that can damage hardware & stability by simply flipping a BIOS option.

give your BIOS a lookover, or consult a guide on BIOS tweaking to have a look at what is 'normal' and what is 'wrong'. The options are not simple, rojakspot.com has a pretty generic BIOS optimisation guide you can check out that has been researched.

syadnom · Guru Joined: 09 May 2002 Posts: 531

AggieEmpeg · n00b Joined: 16 Apr 2002 Posts: 63

I had similar issues back when I first installed Gentoo on my machine. I had to disable either Local APIC support in the kernel or MTTR (Memory Type Range Register), I can't remember which. After doing this, my machine worked like a dream. Try disabling both, recompile and install then test it.

Hope that helps.

flaw3d · n00b Joined: 07 Aug 2002 Posts: 20

Exactly how thorough did you want me to go?

You were right on the menu.lst issue though, damn similiar fonts.

I did a new kernel up, its all solved now. I'm not really sure what I had enabled though to destroy it. MTRR is enabled and APIC is disabled but I'm more than sure I had APIC disabled before. Anyway, its not broke anymore.

Thanks to everybody.

syadnom · Guru Joined: 09 May 2002 Posts: 531

excuse ment flaw3d, i missed that post