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statikregimen
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 3:35 pm    Post subject: Non-root power management without DE? Reply with quote

Hello,

This is an awkward question - I'm not sure where to categorize it, so here it is :)

The actual underlying question is probably more like, "is there any way to allow a user to run some commands without sudo and without entering a password"? If not, I shall pursue the sudo route.

The more specific problem I'm trying to solve, is that I'd like to set up my "non-DE" with some way to automatically suspend+lock with an idle timer, and allow non-root users to suspend/shutdown/reboot. I would be curious to know how actual DE's handle this?

I'm using XDM+Qtile, with Xautolock+Slock. I've managed to get suspend and screen locking working w/ the laptop lid and/or power button, but that's not enough, nor am I pleased with the set up. Right now, it only locks after the Xautolock timer, so if the machine is woken up before it kicks in, the screen is not locked. I was unable to get slock to engage instantly through /etc/acpi configs - at best, it would do nothing; at worst the machine would freeze. Ideally, ANY time the system is put to sleep by any means (power button, lid, direct command), it should lock the screen with it (even more ideally, it should lock any tty sessions as well).

I spent a few hours last night and today googling but came up empty. Seems that since 99% of Linux users run proper desktop environments, most/all of the solutions were specific to those.

As always, any help/insight/advice is much appreciated!

Cheers.
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Last edited by statikregimen on Sat Jul 14, 2018 12:24 am; edited 1 time in total
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khayyam
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 11:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

statikregimen ...

the fact that the machines "freezes" may be a sign that the underlying mechanism (I assume swsusp) is unreliable, there may be an issue with some driver that doesn't suspend well (and you may need to make sure that its unloaded/loaded on suspend/resume).

That said you haven't stated what you're using (ie, sys-power/suspend, or sys-power/hibernate-script, etc) and what you're doing in /etc/acpi. I doubt you're using pm-utils, or upower, but it'd help to know what components you're currently working with.

As for slock, it's probably a case of needing to provide the DISPLAY environment variable, and user of that display. I'm not sure about xautolock but I would suspect there is a command to 'lock now', and most likely this also need to be provided DISPLAY and the user.

I can probably help in some way or other, but lets see what you're doing first. BTW, if you search for keywords 'acpid' and author 'khayyam' It'll probably bring up some examples of the above ... if you're in a rush.

I should note that I'm using tuxonice, sys-power/hibernate-script, sys-power/acpid, and don't use a DE (or the standard pm-utils/upower-pm-utils combination) ... so I've probably encountered some of the issues you're currently stuck on. However I don't lock the display, I suspend to an LVM swap within an dm-crypt volume.

best ... khay
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statikregimen
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

khayyam wrote:
statikregimen ...

the fact that the machines "freezes" may be a sign that the underlying mechanism (I assume swsusp) is unreliable, there may be an issue with some driver that doesn't suspend well (and you may need to make sure that its unloaded/loaded on suspend/resume).

That said you haven't stated what you're using (ie, sys-power/suspend, or sys-power/hibernate-script, etc) and what you're doing in /etc/acpi. I doubt you're using pm-utils, or upower, but it'd help to know what components you're currently working with.

As for slock, it's probably a case of needing to provide the DISPLAY environment variable, and user of that display. I'm not sure about xautolock but I would suspect there is a command to 'lock now', and most likely this also need to be provided DISPLAY and the user.

I can probably help in some way or other, but lets see what you're doing first. BTW, if you search for keywords 'acpid' and author 'khayyam' It'll probably bring up some examples of the above ... if you're in a rush.

I should note that I'm using tuxonice, sys-power/hibernate-script, sys-power/acpid, and don't use a DE (or the standard pm-utils/upower-pm-utils combination) ... so I've probably encountered some of the issues you're currently stuck on. However I don't lock the display, I suspend to an LVM swap within an dm-crypt volume.

best ... khay


Thanks for the reply. Sorry for the lack of info. I was convinced the freezing was just a configuration/software issue based on the symptoms, which is why I tried to gloss over it. It only seemed to come into play when I called Slock in the /etc/acpi/default.sh script. When I got home from work, however, the machine wouldn't get past turning on the backlight when trying to wake it up...Soooo...I guess I do have an issue with freezing!

First, let me be clear, the freezing issue is specifically that it fails to wake up. With slock in play, sometimes I get some some blocks and lines of color, depending on if I call it before sleep or after resume (in the acpi default.sh script). Otherwise, when it happens, it will wake up as far as turning the backlight on, but the screen remains black.

I am using the machine to type this so will now commence the unloading of infos! :D

I followed the wiki articles https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Power_management/Guide and https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Suspend_and_hibernate

I've opted out of hibernation support, thus ended up with:
Code:
*  sys-power/suspend
      Latest version available: 1.0_p20150810
      Latest version installed: 1.0_p20150810


In short, the machine is an AMD A12 laptop w/ R7 graphics. HP Pavilion, Model No 15z-cd000 - https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIADVH6Y73900&nm_mc=TEMC-RMA-Approvel&cm_mmc=TEMC-RMA-Approvel-_-Content-_-text-_-

lspci -k:
http://meaninglessinfo.com/tech/meaningless_desktop/HP_Pavilion_15z-cd000/lspci.txt

My /etc/acpi/default.sh: http://meaninglessinfo.com/tech/meaningless_desktop/etc_acpi_default.txt - It's almost stock, except the lid case.

Xautolock is only in play to lock the screen after a time....and I thought it was getting me around the wake-up freeze issue. Slock can be called directly, when I need to "lock now", which is how I call it via key combo in Qtile, and also how I tried in the acpi script. But it seems so far, any time it's in the equation, I have issues waking up. I will be testing without any slock at all tonight, when I put the computer to sleep for many hours until I get home tomorrow evening (prior tests that reliably caused the issue, only took seconds to reproduce - the latest one happened only after many hours apparently, but remains to be seen...Maybe it's just that intermittent).

I would love to hear more about your setup.. It sounds considerably more secure. However, I do still like Slock for quickly taking a piss when people are around, or whatever. Not always a need to go into full-on suspend.

And now I feel like I should repost this in kernel/hardware >_>

Thanks again for the reply/help!


Last edited by statikregimen on Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:46 am; edited 1 time in total
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Hu
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 1:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you're not happy with where you started the thread, it can be moved. For fastest service, report your own thread as being misplaced. Alternately, a clear enough statement of intent in the thread itself may catch a moderator's eye and get it moved. In this case, I'm not sure whether you want to move the entire thread or open a new post for the freezing problem and keep this thread focused on making automatic lock behave as you want. Please advise, and I can move accordingly.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 6:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The answer of how a DE does this is usually going to be a combination of policykit and sudo.

I'd stick with sudo. It is easy enough to configure it to run only specific commands and require a password or not according to taste.
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khayyam
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

statikregimen wrote:
Thanks for the reply. Sorry for the lack of info. I was convinced the freezing was just a configuration/software issue based on the symptoms, which is why I tried to gloss over it. It only seemed to come into play when I called Slock in the /etc/acpi/default.sh script. When I got home from work, however, the machine wouldn't get past turning on the backlight when trying to wake it up...Soooo...I guess I do have an issue with freezing!

statikregimen ... you're welcome. I would just expect slock to fail rather than hang the system, so my guess is yes, there is a deeper problem. In the case of sys-power/hibernate-script it logs to /var/log/hibernate.log, and if you pass '--verbosity=<n>' (3=verbose, 4=debug) you can get some idea of what might be failing. I suspect that sys-power/suspend offers some means of 'blacklisting' modules, doing specific things 'OnSuspend/OnResume', etc, similar to hibernate-script (which I just noticed has 'LockXAutoLock <yes/no>') ... however, I can't tell you where to look because I've never used it.

statikregimen wrote:
First, let me be clear, the freezing issue is specifically that it fails to wake up. With slock in play, sometimes I get some some blocks and lines of color, depending on if I call it before sleep or after resume (in the acpi default.sh script). Otherwise, when it happens, it will wake up as far as turning the backlight on, but the screen remains black.

In my experience the in kernel swsusp is inferior to suspend2 (tuxonice), particularly for hibernation, that said, for suspend2 you have to either patch the kernel (which can be tricky as the tuxonice patch can lag behind 'stable' releases) or use sys-kernel/pf-sources (which in ::gentoo often lags behind upstream releases) ... I can provide (not currently in tree) pf-sources 4.14_p9, 4.15_p6, or 4.16_p1, ebuilds if you're interested, just ask.

FYI, I was never able to get swsusp to hibernate but suspend2 worked (and has continued to work) flawlessly, s2ram was also unreliable with swsusp. So, keep that in mind ... it may be the kernel swsusp which is at issue.

statikregimen wrote:
I followed the wiki articles https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Power_management/Guide and https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Suspend_and_hibernate

Hmmm ... I can't remember what I'd read at the time but I seem to remember that everything was focused on swsusp and sys-power/suspend, that still seems to be the case.

statikregimen wrote:
I've opted out of hibernation support, thus ended up with: [...] sys-power/suspend

sys-power/hibernate-script also works with swsusp suspend-to-ram (using 'hibernate-ram'), so it's not 'hibernate' specific.

statikregimen wrote:
My /etc/acpi/default.sh: http://meaninglessinfo.com/tech/meaningless_desktop/etc_acpi_default.txt - It's almost stock, except the lid case.

That may not work, when run outside of X11 environment s2ram won't know what DISPLAY is used, or who the x11 session is run by. You generally need something like the following (untested):

/etc/acpid/actions/s2ram.sh:
#!/bin/sh
set -e
xpid="$(pgrep -n X)"
xuser="$(ps -o user --no-headers $xpid)"
display="$(egrep -aoz ':[0-9](.[0-9])?' /proc/$xpid/cmdline)"
export XAUTHORITY="/home/$xuser/.Xauthority"
export DISPLAY="$display"

/usr/sbin/s2ram

You then set '/etc/acpid/actions/s2ram.sh' as the command for 'close)' (and I wouldn't '&' it). As for 'open)' is that necessary, backlight shouldn't be effected by suspend, what does set_lcd_brightness.start do? If this needs to be done then I would have it run as part of 'OnResume' (via /etc/hibernate/common.conf ... or the sys-power/suspend equivalent).

NOTE: the assumption in the above script is that x11 is running as $user and not suid (so USE="-suid" is set on xorg-server ... which is currently the default).

statikregimen wrote:
Xautolock is only in play to lock the screen after a time....and I thought it was getting me around the wake-up freeze issue. Slock can be called directly, when I need to "lock now", which is how I call it via key combo in Qtile, and also how I tried in the acpi script. But it seems so far, any time it's in the equation, I have issues waking up. I will be testing without any slock at all tonight, when I put the computer to sleep for many hours until I get home tomorrow evening (prior tests that reliably caused the issue, only took seconds to reproduce - the latest one happened only after many hours apparently, but remains to be seen...Maybe it's just that intermittent).

Keep in mind that the order of these things happening is important, waking from a suspend takes some cycles and if the machine isn't in a fit state when acpid trys to execute some task then it may not be able to do so. This is particularly true when X11 is involved, the xserver may still be suspended when slock is attempting to use it.

statikregimen wrote:
I would love to hear more about your setup.. It sounds considerably more secure. However, I do still like Slock for quickly taking a piss when people are around, or whatever. Not always a need to go into full-on suspend.

I use i3lock for that purpose, though I generally don't piss when others are around for fear of being arrested ;) If you want to know how to hibernate to LVM swap within dm-crypt then I'm happy to explain, but as it would require you backup and reformat the disk I don't think I should do that here ... ask if you wanted to take that route.

statikregimen wrote:
Thanks again for the reply/help!

Again, you're welcome ... khay
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statikregimen
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hu wrote:
If you're not happy with where you started the thread, it can be moved. For fastest service, report your own thread as being misplaced. Alternately, a clear enough statement of intent in the thread itself may catch a moderator's eye and get it moved. In this case, I'm not sure whether you want to move the entire thread or open a new post for the freezing problem and keep this thread focused on making automatic lock behave as you want. Please advise, and I can move accordingly.


This thread is apparently moving ahead now. I'd say /ideally/ it should be split in two, but now we have mixed replies so I'm not sure what to do about that. It may just be stuck here now? This turned out to be a slightly unusual case so I will just leave it up to the mods - if you want to move it or not, it makes no difference to my life...Thanks!

The Doctor wrote:
The answer of how a DE does this is usually going to be a combination of policykit and sudo.

I'd stick with sudo. It is easy enough to configure it to run only specific commands and require a password or not according to taste.


Thanks! I'll go ahead and get sudo installed then. Prior to this, never had any use for it other than making my system less secure by letting me get root with my weak user password lol

khayyam --

I'll look more closely at sys-power/suspend's features. Seems like I glanced at the man page and it was pretty bare, but I do not recall for sure. However, just switching over to sys-power/hibernate-script sounds like the better choice anyway. I mainly avoided it because "why install features I'll never use when there is a more simple package that only does the thing I need". But alas, in the open source world, sometimes what seems ideal isn't always going to be.

Hoping I don't have to patch the kernel, but will do so if nothing else flies. Would rather have a stable/working system, than avoid extra steps to maintain it. Well, also trying to keep simplicity at the forefront, as I am now managing a few Gentoo machines, and like them all to be as close to exactly the same as the hardware will permit.

Forgot to mention about the backlight. I agree, it shouldn't be affected, but for some reason, it always starts up at some default value.. That's when I made the little script /etc/local.d/set_lcd_brightness.start to set the backlight on boot (then later found I also had to use it for waking up). I don't have access to it atm, but it's something like:

Code:
echo 155 > /sys/class/backlight/acpi_video0/brightness


Where "acpi_video0" is something else. I figured this out based on https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Power_management/Guide#Configuring_display_brightness

Quote:
Keep in mind that the order of these things happening is important, waking from a suspend takes some cycles and if the machine isn't in a fit state when acpid trys to execute some task then it may not be able to do so. This is particularly true when X11 is involved, the xserver may still be suspended when slock is attempting to use it.


This has been my assumption all along - that there would be some time before the system is ready to do anything after waking up. It's probably why xautolock works, since it's not likely to process it's timer nor run slock until the system is actually ready. Prior to that, my main attempts were to call slock before s2ram, thus putting the machine in the state I'd like it to wake up in. Now I see that really the issue was just in not calling slock appropriately from the acpi script. I suspected this, but just couldn't work out how to run it correctly (the best I came up with was to try "su <user> -c slock" but that was clearly destined to fail, as it still doesn't know about the DISPLAY, nor is it running in any sane session).

I do not believe I changed any USE flags related to x11 - it should all be set up as per defaults of the default/linux/amd64/17.0/desktop profile. If your script example is incompatible with that, no worries. I can generally piece things together, once I've gotten on the right track.

I can probably google my way toward LVM/encryption. What I was mostly curious about, is what you meant by using that in lieu of locking. I've used Winderps machines that required a passphrase to decrypt the drive before booting and that would be nice on my mobile machines, but not sure if they can be "re-locked" or whatever, on suspend? I'm not paranoid, but...I'm paranoid. I moved away from winderps specifically for the purpose of security and privacy (that and Linux is awesome), so more is better.

And no, I'm not pissing in front of people! :roll: :lol:

Cheers and thanks!
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khayyam
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

statikregimen wrote:
Forgot to mention about the backlight. I agree, it shouldn't be affected, but for some reason, it always starts up at some default value.. That's when I made the little script /etc/local.d/set_lcd_brightness.start to set the backlight on boot (then later found I also had to use it for waking up).

statikregimen ... hmmm, still not sure why it would change, perhaps you are triggering dpms via some config, or perhaps you followed the above wiki to the letter and installed laptop-mode-tools?

BTW, here is a thread with save and restore backlight scripts ... somewhat similar issue (though the poster was using plasma).

statikregimen wrote:
[...] Now I see that really the issue was just in not calling slock appropriately from the acpi script. I suspected this, but just couldn't work out how to run it correctly (the best I came up with was to try "su <user> -c slock" but that was clearly destined to fail, as it still doesn't know about the DISPLAY, nor is it running in any sane session).

Correct, you would need DISPLAY for anything x11 related, so as per the above example:

Code:
#!/bin/sh
set -e
xpid="$(pgrep -n X)"
xuser="$(ps -o user --no-headers $xpid)"
display="$(egrep -aoz ':[0-9](.[0-9])?' /proc/$xpid/cmdline)"
export XAUTHORITY="/home/$xuser/.Xauthority"
export DISPLAY="$display"

su "$xuser" -c /usr/bin/slock &
/usr/sbin/s2ram

HTH & best ... khay
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 12:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're getting reasonable responses in this forum, so I am inclined not to move the thread.

Mainline has working suspend-to-RAM and suspend-to-disk for most machines. You only need a kernel patch if your specific system is unsupported or if you want something more complicated than mainline can handle.

Standard advice for using an encrypted root filesystem in conjunction with hibernation is that the swap device be encrypted, so that anyone who wants to resume the system must know the swap password. This only helps for suspend-to-disk. For suspend-to-RAM, you still need to solve the problem here relating to locking the console.
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statikregimen
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I did end up with laptop-mode-tools, from following the wiki. However, I uninstalled it, to no effect. I've set no other dpms options myself. It's not a big deal to script the backlight manually, so I will check out that thread you linked (I still have to work out the special 'fn' buttons on the keyboard to control it as well).

I didn't have much time to mess with the suspend/lock issue over the weekend, but I stopped using slock for the interim and did not have any issues with lockups/display corruption. So today, I tried your script, and the first thing it did was crash with display corruption on resume. So I'm at a loss. It appears on the surface that as soon as I try to bring screen locking into the equation, it fails more often than not. I will try Xscreensaver, in case slock is just buggy, however, I can't see how it would be /that/ buggy. It works fine as long as I don't suspend afterward.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

statikregimen wrote:
I did end up with laptop-mode-tools, from following the wiki. However, I uninstalled it, to no effect. I've set no other dpms options myself. It's not a big deal to script the backlight manually, so I will check out that thread you linked (I still have to work out the special 'fn' buttons on the keyboard to control it as well).

statikregimen ... those keys should "just work", if you run 'acpi-listen' they should provide the 'button' name (ie, volumeup, volumedown, mute).

statikregimen wrote:
I didn't have much time to mess with the suspend/lock issue over the weekend, but I stopped using slock for the interim and did not have any issues with lockups/display corruption. So today, I tried your script, and the first thing it did was crash with display corruption on resume. So I'm at a loss. It appears on the surface that as soon as I try to bring screen locking into the equation, it fails more often than not. I will try Xscreensaver, in case slock is just buggy, however, I can't see how it would be /that/ buggy. It works fine as long as I don't suspend afterward.

In the previous thread I particpated in which running acpid to lock the display (search) the poster needed to put a 'sleep 5' between locking and s2ram/hibernate. I don't remember there being a crash but you might try that, or '&& ; sleep 1 ; s2ram'.

HTH & best ... khay
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2018 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So far, this works fairly reliably: http://meaninglessinfo.com/tech/meaningless_desktop/etc_acpi_default2.txt

Basically, I have to get very specific with it, which is suboptimal for portability, but I can probably figure it out from here unless you know the answer :) I guess the reason I'm getting the wrong user for the su command, is because I'm using XDM which is started automatically during boot, and is thus running as root.

Also, what is the significance of the Xauthority stuff? I omitted that for the same reason - root's home dir is not in /home, and also root is not the droids we're looking for.

I have no idea how or if any of this is related to the freezing, but lo and behold, I have not had it happen since changing the script like that, and my screen is getting locked every time now.

Cheers and thanks
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2018 8:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

statikregimen wrote:
Basically, I have to get very specific with it, which is suboptimal for portability, but I can probably figure it out from here unless you know the answer :) I guess the reason I'm getting the wrong user for the su command, is because I'm using XDM which is started automatically during boot, and is thus running as root.

statikregimen ... yes, that would be the case if XDM is in use, but as this is a laptop, and you're the only user I don't see any harm in hardcoding those variables/parameters.

statikregimen wrote:
Also, what is the significance of the Xauthority stuff? I omitted that for the same reason - root's home dir is not in /home, and also root is not the droids we're looking for.

X11 uses ~/.Xauthority to store a "magic-cookie" for authenticating the user who's session it is, I provide this because acpid (and so the script) is run by root, and because its part of the users env. As I said, this is used with x11 running as $xuser (USE="-suid") and though I'm not doing anything that requires X11 (like slock), I am switching vt's on hibernate/resume. I expected that as you were it's probably best to provide it. If it functions without then fine ... you can do without it.

statikregimen wrote:
I have no idea how or if any of this is related to the freezing, but lo and behold, I have not had it happen since changing the script like that, and my screen is getting locked every time now.

OK, good, did you find the thread I mentioned? I wonder if, like the previous poster, the sleep was what clinched it.

statikregimen wrote:
Cheers and thanks

You're welcome & best ... khay
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

After several days of observation, the crashing returned, showing how truly intermittent it is. So, I took slock out of the equation. All seemed well until today, it froze again. With slock, it ranges from black screen w/ backlight to just noise on the screen. Without slock, it seems to fully bring the screen and whatever was last on it back but is otherwise unresponsive.

Going to pour back over everything in this thread and the other, to ensure I've tried all the suggestions so far, but looks like the issue never had anything to do w/ slock, like it seemed at first :(
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

statikregimen ...

does anything get logged to /var/log/messages ... or whatever log swsusp logs to?

If you don't have any reason not to, you might give suspend2/tuxonice a try, it's part of sys-kernel/pf-sources (ebuild for 4.16_p3 can be found here).

best ... khay
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