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Package Manager - thinking a new design outside specs!!
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Mr. T.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 5:27 pm    Post subject: Package Manager - thinking a new design outside specs!! Reply with quote

I would like to know what are the main components of the package manager? Can you describe the package manager globally?

I would like to transform the package manager like the original poster. This is a personal project.


Last edited by Mr. T. on Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:14 am; edited 1 time in total
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

helecho,

The requirements are fully described in the Package Manager Specification.
How you implement that is up to you.
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skellr
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 6:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NG? NG takes me back to 1987.

I feel a face stabbing coming on.
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Mr. T.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would like to modify the architecture of the package manager. Therefore, changes will be formally incorrect related to the specification.

My request may be unfounded!! In my mind, it is to perceive concepts associated to the package manager and reuse some mechanisms.

I would like to transform the ebuild tree, create a different interface, transform an ebuild (remove Bash, merge eclasses, ...), remove configuration files ...
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

helecho,

That sounds like it will take several lifetimes.

There are already several different architectures of package manager. Portage, Pkgcore and Plaudis all solve the same problem in different ways.
The Package Manager Specification tells what is required, it says nothing of possible architectures that might result in a compliant Package Manager.

By definition, package managers that do not comply with the Package Manager Specification have bugs.
The Package Manager Specification is a minimum requirement. Implementations may contain extra features that are not required but any extra features cannot be used in the gentoo repo until the Package Manager Specification has been updated to require them.
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Ant P.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm beginning to wonder if the message being replied to here is from the same person. They have a lot in common.

In any case, the reply is good enough for this subthread.


Last edited by Ant P. on Sun Mar 25, 2018 10:05 pm; edited 1 time in total
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pjp
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

helecho wrote:
I would like to know what are the main components of the package manager? Can you describe the package manager globally?

I would like to transform the package manager like the original poster. This is a personal project.


@helecho,

As I mentioned in your other thread...
pjp wrote:
Split from the 2014 thread as this is a new effort and not directly related to the events from 4 years ago.


Please stop necroposting.

Thank you,
--pjp
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Mr. T.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@pjp: It seemed right to refer to the appropriate threads. Others before me tried to change the package manager and their reflection can be useful.
Finally, my reflections do not have to be necessarily related to Portage or the package manager specification.

NeddySeagoon, I disagree. The adaptation of software is a value adopted by free software developers: you are free to change the program.
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

helecho,

helecho wrote:
NeddySeagoon, I disagree. The adaptation of software is a value adopted by free software developers: you are free to change the program.


Agreed, that's mostly why we are all here. Go ahead and do it, there is no need to ask.
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Mr. T.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2018 10:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@NeddySeagoon: it's OK!
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John R. Graham
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2018 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

helecho wrote:
I would like to modify the architecture of the package manager. Therefore, changes will be formally incorrect related to the specification.
Well, not necessarily. But, even so, surely the whole content of the PMS isn't useless to you. For one early example, consider sections 3.2 (Version Specifications) and 3.3 (Version Comparison). These sections tell the package manager what form that package versions may take and how to unambiguously compare those versions. This is largely an experience-based codification of how other projects have created package versions historically. It's not Portage specific domain knowledge at all: instead, it's a well thought out description of the way the world is.

Similar comments can be made about the dependency specification language (Chapter 8). There essentially has to be a way of codifying dependencies. Even if you dislike the form that the current specification language takes, the PMS documents the types of dependencies that must be represented. (Admittedly there's some room for debate there about certain types and the trouble they've caused.)

So even if you're thinking about creating a fundamentally incompatible package manager (in the common vernacular, a hard fork), you'd be well served to study the PMS. Also, like all good open source projects, the PMS source code is readily available and can be modified by you.

If you want to take a look at the PMS, Portage makes something complex trivially easy :wink: :
Code:
emerge pms
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John R. Graham
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2018 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

helecho wrote:
@pjp: It seemed right to refer to the appropriate threads. Others before me tried to change the package manager and their reflection can be useful.
I agree: it's right but not proper. The proper way to refer to those old threads is with a [topic=] link, like this: Portage-NG: brainstorming. We have a longstanding policy against resurrecting excessively old threads which, hmm, I see is not currently reflected in the Guidelines. Sorry; will have to do something about that.

- John
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Mr. T.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2018 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

John R. Graham, thank you for your feedback! I will eventually exploit the specification after establishing a template to avoid mixing ideas.
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