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Otherworlds
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 12:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

khayyam wrote:
Otherworlds wrote:
But this udev and eudev thing I haven't heard of yet till now, so if I may ask which one is better and why?

Otherworlds ... basically, udev was incorporated into systemd, subsequently some gentoo developers forked udev, naming the project eudev. Since that time various distributions have opted to use eudev as a replacement for udev's device management. The reasons for this are many, but primarly it is so as to get out from under the presure to adopt systemd, as udev-standalone was variously described as a "dead end", or those still using it provided a "wake-up call" in the form of "we will not support non-systemd systems with udev anymore".

Which is better? You decide ;) BTW, I don't use either, there are other methods of doing device management, such as mdev, or static-dev, so it's not an either/or proposition.

best ... khay


Thanks for the enlightenment dude appreciate it, so many things changing I'm glad to catch them when I can..
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Fitzcarraldo
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2016 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

antiX Linux 16-sid available:

http://antix.mepis.org/index.php?title=Main_Page#News

Quote:
Basically it is antiX-core plus xorg (needed to keep it free from systemd). eudev replaces udev.

It even installs a systemd-free xfce and kde.

sysvinit - no systemd!, no libsystemd0!, no udev-systemd!
kernel: 4.3.0-custom
gcc5 and cpp-5
xorg: 1:7.7+13
xterm
ceni and dhclient to connect to net
elinks browser
irssi chat
antiX live remaster and persistence scripts
rsync
smxi/inxi scripts

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Yamakuzure
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't know about xfce, but both KDE4 and Plasma 5 work just fine without systemd...
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Naib
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yamakuzure wrote:
Don't know about xfce, but both KDE4 and Plasma 5 work just fine without systemd...
xfce should be systemd agnostic, but KDE was heading down the GNOME route of relying on logind
Quote:

Going forward, KDE developers may look at making greater use of systemd user units, potentially replacing parts of the KDE daemon with systemd directly for managing services.

The systemd usage in KDE Plasma isn't yet mandated given that some platforms (particularly the BSDs) lack systemd and that alternatives for implementing these interfaces are still maturing.

that was one year ago so no idea if they actually did it
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asturm
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
but KDE was heading down the GNOME route of relying on logind

That's an interesting statement considering git master works fine without systemd.
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Naib
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

genstorm wrote:
Naib wrote:
but KDE was heading down the GNOME route of relying on logind

That's an interesting statement considering git master works fine without systemd.
I take it you can cite where I stated it relies on. I clearly stated "route of relying on"
http://blog.davidedmundson.co.uk/blog/systemd-and-plasma
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, a possible future development in that direction doesn't matter for the current release of one antiX-core. And if there is going to be a logind hard-dependency for Plasma-5, there are already shims available (to be able to start kwin_wayland with non-systemd). At this point you can even go without *kit altogether afaik, and going forward upstream has also accepted patches to support consolekit2 as an alternative to systemd.
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Naib
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That doesn't answer my question. Where did I say it did
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asturm
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Erm, what? I was precisely answering to your 'route' to systemd in KDE, stating actions in their git repository against the statement of an individual.
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2016 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Add Gentoo.

rich0 wrote:
The council has approved the following decision 7-0:

"In light of the support for eudev among Gentoo non-systemd users, and
a lack of strong technical drivers to block a change, the Council
approves changing the default virtual/udev provider for non-systemd
users to eudev. The council encourages all maintainers to try to
support either provider and cooperate with those who provide patches
when necessary."


In a message to the -dev mailing list timed at Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2016 12:14:48 -0500
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Ottre
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2016 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NeddySeagoon wrote:
Add Gentoo.


Done.

Gentoo is rolling, so a link to the git commit would be appropriate.
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Ottre
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2016 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yocto Project will switch soon:

https://bugzilla.yoctoproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8998

http://www.yoctoproject.org/docs/1.6/dev-manual/dev-manual.html#selecting-an-initialization-manager
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blueness
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2016 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can someone do me a favor and prepare this as a list to go into the README.md file at https://github.com/gentoo/eudev/blob/master/README.md I'd like it to look like the README.md for https://github.com/gentoo/pax-utils/blob/master/README.md Thanks!
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CasperVector
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 29, 2016 1:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

blueness wrote:
Can someone do me a favor and prepare this as a list to go into the README.md file at https://github.com/gentoo/eudev/blob/master/README.md I'd like it to look like the README.md for https://github.com/gentoo/pax-utils/blob/master/README.md Thanks!


Code:
curl -s 'https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-1003230.html' |
awk '{ if (pr) print } /positive feedback about eudev/ { pr = 1 } /Last edited by Ottre/ { exit }' |
sed 's@</span.*@@' | sed -n 's/^[0-9]\+\./*/p' | sed -r 's@<a href="([^"]+)"[^<>]*>([^<>]+)</a>@[\2](\1)@g' |
dos2unix


... which outputs:

Code:
* AUSTRUMI switched to eudev in March 2013 (see [package list](http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=austrumi&amp;pkglist=true&amp;version=2.6.8) for the 2.6.8 release).
* Parted Magic switched to eudev in [August 2013](http://web.archive.org/web/20130806145635/http://partedmagic.com/doku.php?id=news).
* Quirky (experimental version of Puppy Linux) switched to eudev in [December 2013](http://distro.ibiblio.org/quirky/quirky6/x86/quirky-6.0/release-Quirky-6.0.htm).
* 0linux switched to eudev in [February 2014](http://forum.0linux.org/index.php/topic,3.0.html) (see [base packages](http://ftp.igh.cnrs.fr/pub/os/linux/0linux/paquets/eta/x86_64/a/) for the eta release).
* Linux From Scratch (standard version) switched to eudev in [March 2014](http://lists.linuxfromscratch.org/pipermail/lfs-dev/2014-March/068942.html) (see [this commit](http://wiki.linuxfromscratch.org/lfs/changeset/10504)).
* Vine Linux switched to eudev in [June 2014](http://ml.vinelinux.org/vineseed/msg09850.html).
* Funtoo Linux switched to eudev in [June 2014](https://bugs.funtoo.org/browse/FL-986).
* CRUX switched to eudev in [July 2014](http://crux.nu/Main/ReleaseNotes3-1).
* Kwort switched to eudev in July 2014 (see [package list](http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=kwort&amp;pkglist=true&amp;version=4.1#pkglist) for the 4.1 release).
* Void Linux switched to eudev in July 2014 (see [this commit](https://github.com/voidlinux/void-packages/commit/cba732602a33147254856fd970fc337681e20a78#diff-5f441df5882a9c58fcbb535645ba80a6)).
* Guix System Distribution switched to eudev in [September 2014](https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/guix-devel/2014-09/msg00251.html).
* NuTyX switched to eudev in [October 2014](http://forums.nutyx.org/index.php?topic=40.0) (see [system packages](http://downloads.nutyx.org/saravane/latest/system/) for the Saravane release).
* Puppy Linux (standard version) switched to eudev in [October 2014](http://distro.ibiblio.org/puppylinux/puppy-tahr/iso/tahrpup%20-6.0-CE/release-Tahrpup-6.0-CE.htm) (see [package list](http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=puppy&amp;pkglist=true&amp;version=6.0#pkglist) for the 6.0 tahrpup release).
* Manjaro Linux (OpenRC edition) has used eudev since the initial release in [December 2014](http://manjaro.org/2014/12/01/manjaro-0-8-11-released/).
* Calculate Linux switched to eudev in [April 2015](http://www.calculate-linux.org/blogs/en/530/show).
* Alpine Linux (desktop edition) switched to eudev in [July 2015](http://git.alpinelinux.org/cgit/aports/commit/?id=4c317f94bb0d512ae091e3598475f6134cec0ba1).
* Obarun has used eudev since the initial release in July 2015 (see [package list](https://www.obarun.org/src/x86_64/)).
* AgiliaLinux switched to eudev in [August 2015](https://agilialinux.net/news/14-daidzhest-distributiva-agilialinux-c-3-08-2015-po-9-08-2015.html).
* Unity Linux has used eudev since September 2015 (see [this commit](https://github.com/jmiahman/unity-linux/commit/7fb5f7bf901903fbf3bff5f26d5f5a798960337c)).
* Slackware switched to eudev in [November 2015](ftp://ftp.osuosl.org/pub/slackware/slackware64-current/ChangeLog.txt).
* TriOS GNU/Linux switched to eudev in [January 2016](https://foss.rs/threads/trios-switch-to-eudev.4880/).
* Zenwalk switched to eudev in [January 2016](http://support.zenwalk.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&amp;t=981689) (see [package list](http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=zenwalk&amp;pkglist=true&amp;version=8.0-beta2#pkglist) for the 8.0-beta2 release, same packages were used in beta1).
* Pisi Linux switched to eudev in [January/February 2016](http://www.pisilinux.org/en/blog/2016/02/21/pisi-linux-2-0-kde-5-alfa-7/) (see [package list](http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=pisi&amp;pkglist=true&amp;version=2.0-alpha7#pkglist) for the 2.0-alpha7 release).
* antiX switched to eudev in [February 2016](http://antix.mepis.org/index.php?title=Main_Page#News).
* Gentoo switched to eudev in [February/March 2016](https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=575718) (see [this commit](https://gitweb.gentoo.org/repo/gentoo.git/commit/?id=032a08c5e57bf727cadf91749db02804b221c0a6)).
* OpenEmbedded switched to eudev in March 2016 (see [this commit](http://git.openembedded.org/openembedded-core/commit/?id=a22797f7c37a865420837b5c29b270f73ee4c6ce)).


EDIT 1: added handling of special case at the end.
EDIT 2: added dos2unix and an updated list as of 20160311.
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Last edited by CasperVector on Fri Mar 11, 2016 7:01 am; edited 1 time in total
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Ottre
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a screencap of Obarun showing that /usr/bin/udevd is provided by the eudev-libgudev package:

http://i.imgur.com/2f6SvwH.png
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Ottre
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2016 1:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a screencap of Unity Linux showing that it uses eudev:

http://i.imgur.com/ZQ8dagL.png
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Ottre
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2016 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

eudev used in Zenwalk 8.0-beta1:

http://i.imgur.com/VmkhQoA.png

This was released in January, see this thread.

If you go by Distrowatch you'd think they switched in February, when Zenwalk 8.0-beta2 was released.
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Ottre
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 4:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Screencap of Pisi Linux using eudev:

http://i.imgur.com/JXFW70T.png

This is a big deal, Pisi Linux has 13 developers and thousands of users.

It seems to be the most popular Linux distro in Turkey.
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Ottre
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 5:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Simplicity Linux 16.04 is still using udev:

http://i.imgur.com/GiXj2mN.jpg

Which is odd, considering it's based on Puppy Linux, and Puppy switched to eudev over a year ago.
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Ottre
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 12:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Screencap of TriOS GNU/Linux showing the udev package is "Sourced from eudev".

http://i.imgur.com/FiNyRP5.png

Clicking on the package homepage link brings you to the eudev wiki article.
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Ottre
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 7:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Screencap of 4MLinux using eudev:

http://i.imgur.com/xCS96BI.png

Above is the contents of the addon_eudev-3.1.5.tar.xz package, below is the OS booting up.
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Ottre
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TLD Linux is probably using eudev:

Quote:

udev 3.1.5-1 Device manager for the Linux kernel


http://cri.tld-linux.org/tld-2016.01.x64.txt

EDIT: confirmed they have switched to eudev, by digging through the wiki and mailing list.
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Ottre
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Slackware-based version of Puppy Linux is still using udev-182:

http://i.imgur.com/GAp8ecb.png

It's going to be a long wait before they all switch to eudev.
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krinn
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Must say i appreciate your efforts to keep it up to date Ottre, thank you
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What krinn said. ++
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