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Logicien
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 Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2023 7:52 am Post subject: Energy Gentoo versus binary systems. |
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It have pass to my mind how much more energy consume a source distribution versus a binary one to be both installed and maintained on the same system. Have it ever been measured? By expansion, if Gentoo was dominating the computer systems market it would use a lot more energy to compile Gentoo on each computer unless massive images copies.
Can Gentoo expand mainly by being a source distribution or it need the help of Gentoo binaries coming from preceeded compilations? Is Gentoo compatible with energy saving?
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sabayonino
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| Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2023 8:29 am Post subject: |
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A question : Who compiled the binary packages for you/us and distribuite them over the network for the other distros ?
The Network infrastructure has much more energy comsuption
Binary packages don't come from < /dev/null 
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fedeliallalinea
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| Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2023 8:38 am Post subject: |
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| sabayonino wrote: | A question : Who compiled the binary packages for you/us and distribuite them over the network for the other distros ?
The Network infrastructure has much more energy comsuption
Binary packages don't come from < /dev/null |
This is not entirely correct given that gentoo has its own mirrors, therefore an infrastructure, for distributing sources not from upstream.
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sabayonino
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NeddySeagoon
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| Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2023 11:12 am Post subject: |
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Logicien,
Major Gentoo user don't | Quote: | | compile Gentoo on each computer |
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They use Gentoo to make their own binary distro then install that once its tested.
e.g. Google and ChromeOS at one time.
Personally, I try to avoild building on low end systems, like my E-350 media player, assorted Raspberry Pis and so on.
How much energy has Gentoo saved by keeping old systems alive and out of landfill?
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Goverp
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| Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2023 11:21 am Post subject: |
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The best way to save energy is to switch the computer off. ... It also makes more free time available to the user. 
There's perhaps some small saving using Gentoo with USE flags and choosing which packages to install over (a) compiling everything (such as alternative desktops) and (b) producing code that runs faster because it's handling fewer configurations (and also using less memory). Using Gentoo AND building your own binary package server will probably produce a leaner and more efficient setup than selecting bits from a generic binary distro. Or if you are running some seriously intensive application, the savings from compiling with march=native, and LTO and PGO, may more than compensate for the compilation costs.
Then, of course, my study gets some extra heating from "make -j32" for the Linux kernel!
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Logicien
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| Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2023 11:43 am Post subject: |
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Thank-you for your replies. Many binaries distributions allow us to install only the basic binaries set from which you add your personnal extra as you can do with Gentoo. Of course someone must compile something to have binaries. I suppose that's what binaries distributions do before offering their binaries set.
I have not think that the USE flags can make save energy by restricting the compiling options to it's values contain. In an other field, more you pass time on low level softwares less you have to high level ones. Is the goal of computing is to enjoy the high level softwares possibilities? In that field there is a lot to explore too. It's the user end goal and satisfaction.
It was just a funny thought.
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Ralphred
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| Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2023 2:00 pm Post subject: |
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| NeddySeagoon wrote: | | How much energy has Gentoo saved by keeping old systems alive and out of landfill? |
A good question indeed. |
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flexibeast
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zah21
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| Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2023 12:44 am Post subject: |
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How is this important from a computing perspective? Do you mean the effort needed to install & maintain Gentoo systems as opposed to binary equivalents?
If you're a regular Linux user, ubuntu or mint are usually good enough. Gentoo is important if you truly want to learn more about Linux on your own, but it doesn't all problems, creates more headaches in my opinion.
Still it's worth pursuing, especially if you have interest in Cyber Security, who knows you could create a secure baseline with minimal set of packages. |
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psycho
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| Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2023 1:43 am Post subject: Re: Energy Gentoo versus binary systems. |
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| Logicien wrote: | | Is Gentoo compatible with energy saving? |
Depends how much energy you want to save. Is driving compatible with energy saving? Is using a computer at all compatible with energy saving?
Source-based distros probably use far more power than binary distros: vastly more than stable distros like Debian and Ubuntu LTS and so on. Even if there were thousands of servers involved in building the binaries, once they're distributed they sit there on all the installed systems. With Gentoo, not only are the binaries built separately on every user's systems, but it's rolling release, so for many users they're built over and over again. Some packages like Firefox and so on are regularly built over and over again on countless boxes all burning power to do this... so a rolling release source distro like Gentoo is probably about as bad as it can get, in terms of energy usage. No doubt this is somewhat offset by the fact that some of us are continuing to use very old systems, thus avoiding all the energy costs involved in producing new ones... but stable binary distros like Slackware also support old hardware and yet don't burn power with endless updates involving building from source.
It is what it is. If I really wanted to save energy I'd ride my bicycle everywhere. Bad global citizen that I am, I choose to get there faster by driving. Next to that spectacular waste of energy (and pollution of the atmosphere and serious threat to the lives of others on the road and so on and so on), I don't think I'm going to feel guilty about using my favourite distro.
[Edit] Actually that's another good point. How many of the geeks heating up their CPUs by building Gentoo would, if they weren't doing that, instead be heating up their GPUs as well by gaming? Every geek distracted from gaming by Gentoo is an energy saving |
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Goverp
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| Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2023 8:42 am Post subject: |
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FWIW my desktop is in my study, which is heated by a thermostat-controlled radiator. So in winter, the heat from the PC eliminates an equivalent amount from the radiator. To be green, I shouldn't sync in summer
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