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Bondppq n00b
Joined: 19 Apr 2023 Posts: 8
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2023 11:09 am Post subject: Trying to Create Bootable USB X3 Partitions-Testing Distros |
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Can I have 3 different bootable Linux distro each on their own partitions on 1 USB thumbdrive, but what would happen when you insert the thumbdrive? Would a boot menu load first asking the user which partition you would like to start from?
I would like to eliminate any extra steps so that I can just plug in the thumbdrive and it goes into an autoloader mode to install the Linux distro, but a simple boot menu as described above is fine besides anything else further. Will this be possible and how much space would I need for this per partition, per Linux distro?
And with a new USB - (SanDisk Ultra Luxe 32GB USB 3.1 SDCZ74-032G-G46) after reformatting to EXT4 for these partitions will I be wiping away any vital Linux drivers or kernels that would prevent me from doing the set up what I’ve described above? thanks in advance for your advice. |
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Hu Moderator
Joined: 06 Mar 2007 Posts: 21490
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2023 4:11 pm Post subject: |
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You can store as many Linux distributions on a single device as you can fit within the available space. Nothing would happen when you insert the thumbdrive unless the system's firmware notices the drive and reacts to it. Assuming the firmware does notice and react, it would run the bootloader from the thumbdrive. What that bootloader would then do depends on who configured the thumbdrive and how. You could provide a bootloader that jumps straight into one of the Linux distributions, giving the user no choice about what to do.
I don't know what SanDisk shipped to you, but it's very unlikely they put anything Linux-related on the drive. |
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szatox Advocate
Joined: 27 Aug 2013 Posts: 3105
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2023 4:23 pm Post subject: |
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Think of a pendrive the same way you would if it was a regular hard drive and you're good to go.
You can either chain-load them or (IMO a better option:) create a common boot partition and create menu entries for all 3 systems under a single bootloader. It's not difficult to set up, you just have to make sure all those systems don't accidentally "fix" your bootloader's config making themselves the owners and kicking everything else out. |
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Bondppq n00b
Joined: 19 Apr 2023 Posts: 8
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2023 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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Just to be clear - I don’t want to run a Linux distro off of the USB thumb drive as a daily workstation, I want to just plug the USB into many different computers to autoload install full versions of different Linux distros into different computers.
Will Ventoy or PenDrive do what I have just described? …or does it act as “only” a portable Linux op system working off of a USB drive? I’m trying to understand the true purpose of it, or maybe it acts as both?
And with Ventoy I don’t actually need to have 3 different partitions with 1 distort in each to load into other computers, I can have just 1 partition and have multiple Linux distro autoloaders on it right? |
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szatox Advocate
Joined: 27 Aug 2013 Posts: 3105
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2023 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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I see. So it belongs in Unsupported software rather than installing.
Well, installer is pretty much a linux liveCD + scripts + packages, so it surely can be done, but it's probably not a scenario the creators of those liveCDs expected, so you will likely need to make some manual adjustments. In particular: write your own boot lines to let your kernels find their respective squashed roots.
Initramfs from a hybrid image (one that can be burned on either CD or pendrive) will be capable of running from a partition, so you have the basics covered.
I'd extract the isos into subdirectories instead of dumping the entire images as files or burning them directly into the device, and then add the bootloader by myself, using the pieces provided in (now extracted) iso images for reference. This is quite similar to finalizing your own liveCD, and also similar to netboot setups which I'm already familiar with, so easy pick for me. YMMV.
It's the first time I've ever heard of Ventoy, so no idea what it can do and how to use it.
You're also making "PenDrive" sound like some kind of software, in which case no idea either. |
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54098 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2023 8:01 pm Post subject: |
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Moved from Installing Gentoo to Unsupported Software.
as it one of these. _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail. |
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Bondppq n00b
Joined: 19 Apr 2023 Posts: 8
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2023 8:09 pm Post subject: |
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szatox wrote: | I see. So it belongs in Unsupported software rather than installing.
Well, installer is pretty much a linux liveCD + scripts + packages, so it surely can be done, but it's probably not a scenario the creators of those liveCDs expected, so you will likely need to make some manual adjustments. In particular: write your own boot lines to let your kernels find their respective squashed roots.
Initramfs from a hybrid image (one that can be burned on either CD or pendrive) will be capable of running from a partition, so you have the basics covered.
I'd extract the isos into subdirectories instead of dumping the entire images as files or burning them directly into the device, and then add the bootloader by myself, using the pieces provided in (now extracted) iso images for reference. This is quite similar to finalizing your own liveCD, and also similar to netboot setups which I'm already familiar with, so easy pick for me. YMMV.
It's the first time I've ever heard of Ventoy, so no idea what it can do and how to use it.
You're also making "PenDrive" sound like some kind of software, in which case no idea either. |
I guess I had this in the wrong section, but what you have described above is way out of my league in terms of my own capabilities, but I think Ventoy and PenDrive package all of this stuff up and does that for you in an easy step system, but I don't know for sure, I just hope. |
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54098 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2023 8:49 pm Post subject: |
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Bondppq,
It looks like Ventoy can do what you want.
I can't find the PenDrive package for the pages of PenDrive Ads on the web.
Do you have a link?
-- edit --
There is nothing special about a pen drive. Its usually cheap and cheerful FLASH memory, closely related to the memory in a SSD or NVMe card.
There are usually corners cut on the speed and wear levelling to:
a) keep the price down
b) discourage their use in place of their more expensive cousins. _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail. |
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Bondppq n00b
Joined: 19 Apr 2023 Posts: 8
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2023 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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NeddySeagoon wrote: | Bondppq,
I can't find the PenDrive package for the pages of PenDrive Ads on the web.
Do you have a link?
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https://www.pendrivelinux.com/ |
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Bondppq n00b
Joined: 19 Apr 2023 Posts: 8
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2023 10:36 pm Post subject: missing the smaller boot menu drive |
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I'm using Windows at the moment (hate it) reformatted my new USB to EXT4 using Eassos DiskGenius. Then installed Ventoy on it which reformatted the USB back to FAT (I guess that's why I had to download the Windows version of Ventoy) but Ventoy did not create 2 partitions. I'm missing the smaller boot menu drive and not sure why that happened. I have copy-pasted 2 distros on to the main drive but now still can't boot from it. What happened and what to do now? |
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Bondppq n00b
Joined: 19 Apr 2023 Posts: 8
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Posted: Thu Apr 20, 2023 9:42 pm Post subject: |
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okay so I was finally able to just now successfully install Ubuntu 22.04.2 Linux Lite 6.4.iso onto this small Asus TS10 VivoStick which has only 32 gb's HD on it. The Deepin' says it needed 64 gb's for an install, not sure why so much, it's crazy so I wasn't able to install my preferred distro.
I could not have done this install without this YouTube tutorial - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuonyS3xdwg which gives a good and "real" step-by-step through the BIOS menus and blue screens. You can't just plug-in a USB and expect it to load up and its as simple as that. It doesn't work that way despite what people or YouTube says, there are these blue screen menu steps involved.
I am more than thrilled that I now have a viable route to get away from Windows forever. And now for some reason the 2nd boot menu loader E drive was showing up in Windows when it wasn't before.
Does anybody know how to permanently shutoff any and all automatic updates of all programs in Ubuntu? Does anybody here use Ubuntu and know how? I am a staunch non-believer in updates, I shut them off in all computers and PDA's I have. Windows auto-updates is what got me into this flooding of these small hard drives to begin with.
I don't know which final (or combo-of) distro(s) I will choose to put on these 4 mini-PC systems. I have 9 distros loaded onto this 1 USB partition now with Ventoy to explore. But my choices will be barebones, superlight systems with zero bloatware as I only use these mini-PC's to run a stock trading platform called Think or Swim and I don't use them for anything else. I use a Mac for my workhorse. |
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54098 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Fri Apr 21, 2023 5:44 pm Post subject: |
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Bondppq
Quote: | Does anybody know how to permanently shutoff any and all automatic updates of all programs in Ubuntu? Does anybody here use Ubuntu and know how? I am a staunch non-believer in updates, I shut them off in all computers and PDA's I have. Windows auto-updates is what got me into this flooding of these small hard drives to begin with. |
Install it then never connect to any network again. That way you won't get any updates and it will be safe from anyone who does not have physical access too.
With no updates, it only a question of when, not if, the system gets compromised.
A Gentoo install will fit into 8G. To achieve that the build environment needs to be separate, like on USB or NFS, so it is not attached at run time.
That's Xfrc4, libreoffice and firefox. _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail. |
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Bondppq n00b
Joined: 19 Apr 2023 Posts: 8
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Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2023 10:59 am Post subject: |
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Any time that a "forced" update was thrust upon me it always broke the system somewhere. I have used a 2011 OSX 10.6.8 Snow Leopard (now still on OSX 10.12.6 Sierra) until like 2 years ago when the browsers wouldn't work anymore on their last compatible versions.
But other than that I have had ZERO breaks and with my iOS iPhone as well because I shut OFF the automatic updates as the first thing to do when I purchase the phone or laptop or new installs, it's the very first thing before connecting to a wi-fi and then the 2nd thing is to shut off all autoupdates on any new browsers.
And going this route, I have never had a problem with a system being broken since 2009. Until I started using Windows again last year since dropping it in 2008. Now Win 10 forces all updates and can't be shut-off which is why I'm moving to Linux for the first time.
How many 3rd party app vendors can't keep up with the frequent rigorous update cycle of AAPL or MSFT which breaks 3rd party apps every few weeks and then you can't use them. How many people have been in that situation before. I truly truly believe that updates are the WORST thing you can do to your system, its a scam. "If it ain't broke, don't try to fix it" the old maxim fully applies to software updates. |
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54098 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2023 11:54 am Post subject: |
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Bondppq,
and how many times has your obsolete system been broken into?
You don't know and can't tell as the first thing any competent 'black hat' does, is to hide the fact they they have control of your system.
Get updates under your own control and do them when it suits. The rest of the world does not want you distributing spam or being part of a botnet.
You don't want that (or worse) either. _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail. |
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GDH-gentoo Veteran
Joined: 20 Jul 2019 Posts: 1507 Location: South America
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Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2023 2:25 pm Post subject: |
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Bondppq wrote: | "If it ain't broke, don't try to fix it" the old maxim fully applies to software updates. |
How many times have I read this here... People: if you haven't audited the code, or aren't capable of doing so, you don't know if it "ain't broke". _________________
NeddySeagoon wrote: | I'm not a witch, I'm a retired electronics engineer |
Ionen wrote: | As a packager I just don't want things to get messier with weird build systems and multiple toolchains requirements though |
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pjp Administrator
Joined: 16 Apr 2002 Posts: 20054
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Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2023 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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NeddySeagoon wrote: | The rest of the world does not want you distributing spam or being part of a botnet. | I've read of an ISP blocking customers due to the problems that resulted from having been compromised. I don't recall the ISP or where they were located, but it seems like a reasonable response. _________________ Quis separabit? Quo animo? |
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Bondppq n00b
Joined: 19 Apr 2023 Posts: 8
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Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2023 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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NeddySeagoon wrote: | Bondppq,
and how many times has your obsolete system been broken into?
The rest of the world does not want you distributing spam or being part of a botnet.
You don't want that (or worse) either. |
I'm using my computers everyday, no one has broken into them... besides Mi5 when I was living in London a few years back, or maybe it was the Met but my camera light suddenly turned on under someone else's control. but that's a hard hack from Scotland Yard or something.
and how am I "distributing spam or being part of a botnet" if I say that I unwaveringly do not believe in updates on any electronic devices at all. Just because you don't agree with that, that makes me a spammer |
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Hu Moderator
Joined: 06 Mar 2007 Posts: 21490
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Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2023 11:42 pm Post subject: |
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As explained to you above, some intrusions are relatively stealthy, because they want to use your resources and not be discovered. I suspect your comment about the camera is a joke, but if not, remote camera activation is easy once someone has root on the system.
Neddy is not saying that failure to apply updates causes you to spam. He is noting that if you consistently fail to apply updates, you become a very easy target and could be hacked to become a spammer, without your knowledge.
Incidentally, given Gentoo's nature as a rolling release meta-distribution, this is probably the last place you want to be if you are determined not to apply updates, because one of the first responses when you bring up a problem will be to ask if it still happens in the latest version. |
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szatox Advocate
Joined: 27 Aug 2013 Posts: 3105
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Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2023 9:35 am Post subject: |
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This topic took a funny turn, from putting a few distros on a single device, to putting a few installers on a single device, to never updating windows, to never updating linux either.
Anyway, Bondppq, it doesn't seem like anyone here has any experience with tools you're trying to use. There's no tutorial waiting for you.
Gotta give it a shot and see what happens. If it fails in some particular way, we might be able to figure out why, but there is really nothing we can tell you until you actually give us something to work with. |
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NeddySeagoon Administrator
Joined: 05 Jul 2003 Posts: 54098 Location: 56N 3W
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Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2023 9:54 am Post subject: |
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Bondppq,
Quote: |
and how am I "distributing spam or being part of a botnet" if I say that I unwaveringly do not believe in updates on any electronic devices at all. Just because you don't agree with that, that makes me a spammer |
Your install was believed to be secure at the time of install. Its more that nobody knew how to break in. Subsequent events will prove that to be incorrect.
The driver behind updates is that they fix these problems as the come to light.
That's often hidden by new bells and whistles that you don't want. You do want the security updates though.
With a bit of luck, your attackers will only want to run a crypto miner, so the rest of the world won't be affected by your insecure system.
Nobody knows what an intruder may choose to do. Spam and botnets are popular well known examples. _________________ Regards,
NeddySeagoon
Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail. |
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