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Prolifiration of specialized build sysems [rant]
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Ionen
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2020 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dmpogo wrote:
If a developer wants to write his docs in rst - sure, his choice, but it is 2 sec of CPU to convert them to roff before packaging. You know rst and roff looks almost the same, why should I get first and not the second ?
Most devs do in fact take extra care and include pre-generated man pages (along with other stuff like generated autoconf files), but not everyone will do it and you just need 1 package to pull in all the deps by itself.

Lot of sources are just as-is generated from github/gitlab and the like without any real post-processing, and are left up to downstream maintainers to handle for users.
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Ionen
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2020 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To go back on the original net-misc/bind-tools issue, they _do_ provide built man pages but that one single tarball had a mistake in it that caused it to rebuild them (despite being available) and gentoo immediately added the sphinx dep as the initial solution and was very unwilling to remove it :| .. despite, again, the man pages being already generated, plus users providing patches to use those. Thankfully another more willing maintainer came in and solved everything.
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dmpogo
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2020 11:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ionen wrote:
dmpogo wrote:
If a developer wants to write his docs in rst - sure, his choice, but it is 2 sec of CPU to convert them to roff before packaging. You know rst and roff looks almost the same, why should I get first and not the second ?
Most devs do in fact take extra care and include pre-generated man pages (along with other stuff like generated autoconf files), but not everyone will do it and you just need 1 package to pull in all the deps by itself.

Lot of sources are just as-is generated from github/gitlab and the like without any real post-processing, and are left up to downstream maintainers to handle for users.



I agree that gentoo maintainers are not the guilty party, indeed opposite, they took effort to make non-trivial ebuilds which do the job. And indeed, Gentoo model is that tarballs come from upstream, and patching/modifying is done on user machines via ebuild scripts. So maintainers intercepting and modifying the tar balls is not a standard workflow. My beef is with upstream.
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Anon-E-moose
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2020 11:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only thing I want the gentoo devs to do, is write a proper ebuild, with the ability to drop man/doc generation if I so desire. If I can figure out how to modify an ebuild to do that, then the brilliant gentoo devs should certainly be able to. If I want docs, there's everything from google searches for man pages, to docs from the upstream website itself (usually).
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Ionen
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, updated earlier and did my usual depclean only to see this:
Code:
>>> Unmerging (1 of 28) dev-python/sphinx-3.2.1...
Farewell 28 packages. See commit (1), (2), and (3), same was done for clang.

Being BDEPEND there's no need to rebuild to get this either, assuming nothing else depending on it anyway.
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pjp
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, thanks for posting that. Because it eliminates 28 dependencies, that might be one of the most valuable changes I've seen, certainly in recent memory.
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Anon-E-moose
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 8:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting
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figueroa
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm glad I looked in here. I'm 15 packages lighter now.
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