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richk449
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
richk449 wrote:
Honestly though, it seems silly to worry about this. Either it is okay to continue to put CO2 in the atmosphere, in which case what words Greta uses are irrelevant, or we need to reduce CO2 emissions, in which case the words Greta chooses are irrelevant.


This is about her, not the environment. The environment is indifferent to an obnoxious Swedish teen who skips school and trots the globe.

Holding this kid up as some sort of role model is foolish. What's the lesson here? Skip school, act like a completely entitled first world brat, and get rewarded with adoration and fame... she is a terrible example for kids.

She's a prop of the greens. They thought they could bring out this annoying autist, have her wag her finger at the world, and then be immune from criticism because she's an autistic kid. This is child abuse, and its turning her into a villain.

I mostly agree. So we should ignore her. And spend the time we save actually thinking about the environment.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 10:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
Not only that, to champion the Paris accord is disingenuous with lowering emissions, to rag on America and Europe for not doing enough is disingenuous to where the bulk of the pollution and the bulk of the pullution rise is coming from


Indeed, as this really has nothing to do with the environment, she is the product of "Antifa AllStar" parents.

First World Commies

richk449 wrote:
I mostly agree. So we should ignore her. And spend the time we save actually thinking about the environment.


By "we" I assume you're talking about yourself. If you really want to tackle CO2 emissions, you need to change both India and China. It's only nearing 3 billion people, should be a piece of cake.

I'll be focused on improving my skill set and earning money for my family.


{EDIT}

Side note...

Do you know what compels me to conserve energy? Convenience. I pay a lower electric bill than most of my neighbors and yet I have multiple computers running. The difference is that I use one refrigerator, I turn off lights when I don't need them, use the A/C when I need it, and I don't watch TV, I use as much gasoline as I need and don't waste it making 50 trips a week for stuff I can buy in bulk. This saves me money and 'lowers my Carbon footprint', which is already quite low as my yard is full of trees, plants, and grass.

What compels me to recycle is that it is very easy, and keeps the garbage on a good outflow without having a buildup (aside from when the state fails its contract to pick up, which happens on occasion).

I don't need top down rules forcing me to live in a pod, eat bugs, and work in an Amazon warehouse 10 hours a day.
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Last edited by Muso on Sun Dec 15, 2019 10:35 pm; edited 1 time in total
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richk449
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 10:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
Not only that, to champion the Paris accord is disingenuous with lowering emissions, to rag on America and Europe for not doing enough is disingenuous to where the bulk of the pollution and the bulk of the pullution rise is coming from

Maybe true for Europe, but the US is the second highest contributor to CO2 yearly emissions (behind China), and if you integrate over time, the US has put the most CO2 in the atmosphere of any country.

I don't think the "by-country" breakdown is really useful though - that mostly tells you which countries are big. The more useful metric is per-capita; the US is the third highest per-capita (behind Saudi Arabia and Australia). UK is just behind China at 15th.

The Paris accord was imperfect, as are all results of international negotiations. It seems like your objections to it are mostly about fairness, which is very typical of tragedy of the commons type of situations. Unfortunately, the solutions to tragedies of the commons are regulation or privatization, neither of which is possible here (would need world government to regulate; no way to privatize air). So we are stuck doing the best we can with international negotiations.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2019 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:


richk449 wrote:
I mostly agree. So we should ignore her. And spend the time we save actually thinking about the environment.


By "we" I assume you're talking about yourself. If you really want to tackle CO2 emissions, you need to change both India and China. It's only nearing 3 billion people, should be a piece of cake.

I'll be focused on improving my skill set and earning money for my family.

I'm not really interested in telling anyone what to do. I'm just speaking in a philosophical sense.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Greta gets called out
https://twitter.com/PeterRNeumann/status/1206200930879840256?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1206200930879840256&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.zerohedge.com%2Fpersonal-finance%2Fgreta-thunberg-busted-after-bizarre-feud-german-train-company

Ironically, this is the exact stunt that the lying (leader) of Labour Corbyn pulled in 2016 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traingate
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
Greta gets called out
https://twitter.com/PeterRNeumann/status/1206200930879840256?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1206200930879840256&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.zerohedge.com%2Fpersonal-finance%2Fgreta-thunberg-busted-after-bizarre-feud-german-train-company

Ironically, this is the exact stunt that the lying (leader) of Labour Corbyn pulled in 2016 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traingate


Indeed 8)
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll just repeat what I said in an earlier post. I feel sorry for the kid. She is a child being used and manipulated by adults that should know better. It is basically child abuse. She will end up needing professional help before this is over, after she is tossed aside like so much refuse.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
Naib wrote:
Greta gets called out
https://twitter.com/PeterRNeumann/status/1206200930879840256?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1206200930879840256&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.zerohedge.com%2Fpersonal-finance%2Fgreta-thunberg-busted-after-bizarre-feud-german-train-company

Ironically, this is the exact stunt that the lying (leader) of Labour Corbyn pulled in 2016 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traingate

Missed that :) I did see this a few days back and was going to post for the lulz,
Indeed 8)

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 12:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

richk449 wrote:
I don't think the "by-country" breakdown is really useful though - that mostly tells you which countries are big. The more useful metric is per-capita; the US is the third highest per-capita (behind Saudi Arabia and Australia). UK is just behind China at 15th.
If Australia produces that much of CO2 pollution to get the uranium with the tiny nano part out of a ton of stones, but this product is used elsewhere in nuclear facilities:
Why don't we add this CO2 to the budget of the countries who consume uranium ?
(Or is it counted that way?)
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 1:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ulenrich wrote:
richk449 wrote:
I don't think the "by-country" breakdown is really useful though - that mostly tells you which countries are big. The more useful metric is per-capita; the US is the third highest per-capita (behind Saudi Arabia and Australia). UK is just behind China at 15th.
If Australia produces that much of CO2 pollution to get the uranium with the tiny nano part out of a ton of stones, but this product is used elsewhere in nuclear facilities:
Why don't we add this CO2 to the budget of the countries who consume uranium ?
(Or is it counted that way?)


You mean that all of the CO2 produced in China, making the products and transporting those products to the various European countries, should be charged to those European countries?
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 3:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
If you really want to tackle CO2 emissions, you need to change both India and China. It's only nearing 3 billion people, should be a piece of cake.
I think this really gets to the core of the problem. Doing (virtually) nothing until everyone is in agreement with some politically motivated feel-good treaty demonstrates a lack of interesting in taking action. Those who want to work toward a solution should be looking for technical solutions. Others should be teaming up and getting donors to fund ships to take them to clean up plastics, etc (make it a reality show for that matter). Then when someone comes up with a scalable scrubber, China would probably install them too.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2019 4:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

flysideways wrote:
ulenrich wrote:
richk449 wrote:
I don't think the "by-country" breakdown is really useful though - that mostly tells you which countries are big. The more useful metric is per-capita; the US is the third highest per-capita (behind Saudi Arabia and Australia). UK is just behind China at 15th.
If Australia produces that much of CO2 pollution to get the uranium with the tiny nano part out of a ton of stones, but this product is used elsewhere in nuclear facilities:
Why don't we add this CO2 to the budget of the countries who consume uranium ?
(Or is it counted that way?)


You mean that all of the CO2 produced in China, making the products and transporting those products to the various European countries, should be charged to those European countries?
Wow, you got it!
The most fair and effectiv solution would be a taxation of any fossils directly at all the wells of fossil fuels.
So, this is never gonna happen. Only war can rescue mankind: Making dust of all the satellites during "Info Wars" will make us an umbrella against the sun. Trump will be praised for his vision.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 31, 2019 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://babylonbee.com/news/poll-finds-most-people-would-rather-be-annihilated-by-giant-tidal-wave-than-continue-to-be-lectured-by-climate-change-activists
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 31, 2019 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
https://babylonbee.com/news/poll-finds-most-people-would-rather-be-annihilated-by-giant-tidal-wave-than-continue-to-be-lectured-by-climate-change-activists
since most people are idiots i do not find that surprising.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 31, 2019 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
https://babylonbee.com/news/poll-finds-most-people-would-rather-be-annihilated-by-giant-tidal-wave-than-continue-to-be-lectured-by-climate-change-activists


Winner!
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 31, 2019 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

e3k wrote:
Naib wrote:
https://babylonbee.com/news/poll-finds-most-people-would-rather-be-annihilated-by-giant-tidal-wave-than-continue-to-be-lectured-by-climate-change-activists
since most people are idiots i do not find that surprising.
Here is the thing, there is a very high chance this girl is somewhere on the autistic spectrum and from her dad's own words I didn’t do it to save the climate, I did it to save my child,. All credit to the father once he saw something that helped her depression (NOTE: climate change wasn't what was giving her depresion, the focus of it helped).

This condescending attitude to everyday people is NOT going to change the climate, people were already cutting stuff out on their own, western nations had already committed to reductions and WERE reducing. She is a voice, a focal point and now she is being exploited.

Shall I let you into a little secret. if people stopped using their cars, stopped plastics, the world's pollution isn't going to in any significant manner reduce the pollution because something like 70% of the world pollution comes from a handful of top corporations. Gee wiz changing all my light bulbs from incandescent to LED, switching to double-edge razor instead of plastic laden cartridges, using bamboo toothbrushes, using greengrocers does what? reduce the UK's production by? 0.000000001%. Hitting the little people, the people that would be hit by her advocacy will NOT improve thing, it will make impoverishment and inequality worse WHILE the likes of china and india carry on spewing into the atmosphere and the rivers 10 rivers carry 90% of the plastic into the ocean, guess the countries.

What is going to solve this, what is solving this is SCIENCE and actually doing something ( Boyan Slat vs "no solution" Greta", anyone here heard of Boyan? ). Do you know what you need to go into science? an education.

At the end of all this, after the DECADES of reduction in pollution that has been going on, the banning of free plastic carrier bag's in the UK (before the UK knew of Greta) as societies and countries do clean up, Greta is still going to have an underlying condition that isn't being treated. So when people finally realise that rather than doing 0.000000001% impact, it is better to lobby gov'n to invest in the needed technology.because viable alternatives need to be realised that doesn't cost an absolute fortune (while China floods is with cheap plastic toothbrushes). Who is going to pick up the pieces of Greta as she will no longer have a focus ?
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2020 12:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As I've said already, the problem won't solve itself until a few CEOs among that 70% start turning up dead or disfigured.
Just got to wait for motivation among the general populace to rise sufficiently high to get the job done. Nearly there.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 02, 2020 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ant P. wrote:
As I've said already, the problem won't solve itself until a few CEOs among that 70% start turning up dead or disfigured.
Just got to wait for motivation among the general populace to rise sufficiently high to get the job done. Nearly there.

at that is the crux of the problem. What drives change? legislation or economic viability.

lets look at fur. It actually became unfashionable to wear and own fur due to social stigma surrounding it before legislation kicked in banning farming (some places banned the sale). Thing is who could afford fur? this isn't a common item so those socialites with a herd mentality shifted and cut sales so it became economically non-viable.

Take ring pulls on soda cans. It was a reasonable design but it failed to factor in general human nature and before long the ring pull cast-offs were littering everywhere... A slight redesign improved this vastly. Was this via legislation? no... this was actually done by the industry itself

Take plastic carrier bags. typically given away for "free" with shopping in the UK but was causing no end of litter as the light bags were blowing away all over the country. A cultural drive (ironically by the Mail) helped pushed through legislation change to remove free bags. having to pay 5p per bag suddenly got people to thing ... do i need to pay that or should i bring my own study bags. In not a lot of time the usage of plastic carrier bags plummeted to 90% of what it was.

Take city smog. The london smog caused thousands of deaths in 1952. Legislation changed to ban burning coal in the city. An evolution of this was the congestion charge to mitigate car exhaust in London, a scheme that is rolling out around the country (it is coming to Birmingham this June/July)

THe Kyoto accord, the Paris accord, antipreneur doing stuff providing viable alternatives... All these things have been occurring for decades so its really moot what one individuals says or does, she is something the social elite jump on, associate with to stay relevant in the new because they are narcissists. It is technology that is making the likes of electric cars viable, it is the likes of Cree who over the last 30years who have perfected SiC power electronics that permits the likes of electric cars and renewable technology to realise a 99% efficient inverter. It is the likes of Infineon who over the last 20 years who have perfected Si power electronics such that an inverter goes from 50% to 90% and at an affordable price.

The problem is the political elite, the social elite are soo divorced from society; the entire #meToo movement in response to Weinstein ... such behaviour is an exception in the general population because of social norms and corporate life force down our throats secual harassment re-alignment training, YEARLY. Their separation from normal society is also reflected in how far up Maslow's hierarchy of needs they are... they don't have to concern themselves with the petty little things about putting food on the table so they start interfering with everyone elses to fulfil their existence needs. Battery chicken are not the nicest way to raise food YET when a family is looking for food to feed they will buy what is cheap. While some farmers were being ethical their chickens were more expensive but when faced with a chicken that costs £5 or £1.50 what do you think will get sold? to the masses? sure the trendy socialites who were so far up each others Maslow's hierarchy would go for the ethical choice BUT joe average will feed their kids. Legislation banned battery chick driving the cost up but only to £2 as all were doing it.

So these self-righteous are pushing for us to be greener, to save the planet... but with what? if there is no alternative or if the alternative is vastly more expensive what do you think joe-average will buy £4 bamboo toothbrush or 4 for a £1 plastic? As long as there is a demand, the likes of China will pump out the "polluting" cheaper variant as they have billions of workers that the country needs to keep doing stuff.

So how to change that shortlist of companies? Legislation, viable alternatives or the likes or violent activism to force a change. NOne of which a little angry girl is doing
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2020 12:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is a great natural regulator on earth!
If you think about the stability in the climate past, you would think there must be stabilisation.

For example:
1. Much larger amounts of water in the atmosphere must come down somewhere. The earth is just becoming much greener than the planet was decades ago. Larger amounts of snow in the north of canada may build a new ice shield there, where it had been too dry in winter time to accumulate snow in previous times. We know the great lakes have been built by ice in the past.
2. Half a degree warmer waters in the ocean at the coasts of Antarktica beneath the ice shield there, will enable vast amounts of ice can glide from the continent into the ocean. This will highten the oceans about 64m in the next 400y. Large areas under water then can actively reduce the CO2 level of the atmosphere by building the coal and oil for a future civilization.

Birds will create a dino2 culture in the follow up.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2020 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pyrocumulonimbus
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 12:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Busted! Facebook Bug Reveals Greta Thunberg’s Posts Are Written by Her Father

Quote:
Wired Magazine reports that, for several hours last Thursday night, a bad code update erroneously allowed Facebook users to see exactly which accounts were posting to Facebook pages.

The edit history for Greta Thunberg’s page shows that the content has actually been written by her father, Svante Thunberg, and Adarsh Prathap, a climate activist in India who serves as a delegate at the UN’s Climate Change organization.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 7:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
Busted! Facebook Bug Reveals Greta Thunberg’s Posts Are Written by Her Father

Quote:
Wired Magazine reports that, for several hours last Thursday night, a bad code update erroneously allowed Facebook users to see exactly which accounts were posting to Facebook pages.

The edit history for Greta Thunberg’s page shows that the content has actually been written by her father, Svante Thunberg, and Adarsh Prathap, a climate activist in India who serves as a delegate at the UN’s Climate Change organization.


Puppet
You don't know the difference between written and authored: The father writing the text dictated through radiotelephone from a sailing boat. Then he let Adarsh Prathap co-author the facts, because Greta on the ocean cannot know the newest findings ...

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey ulenrich, want to buy some magic beans?
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
Hey ulenrich, want to buy some magic beans?
I showed you with my post, I have a dealer already. Knowing him personally gives me an advantage you cannot get using Facebook. #CambridgeAnalytica makes me surely reject any offer from Facebook for access (I cannot see your source)
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://www.cnbc.com/video/2020/01/22/climate-issue-is-not-being-dealt-with-in-a-candid-way-hoovers-ferguson.html
Quote:

Publicly, you have to agree with Greta Thunberg and you have to be part of the virtue-signaling community on climate change, on ESG."

"Privately, you're quietly agreeing with Trump."


Quote:
60% of CO2 emissions since Greta Thunberg was born is attributable to China... but nobody talks about that. They talk as if its somehow Europeans and Americans who are going to fix this problem... which is frustrating because it doesn't get to the heart of the matter."

"If you're serious about slowing CO2 emissions and temperatures rising it has to be China and India that are constrained."

"I don't see her in Beijing or Delhi."

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