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krinn
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pappy_mcfae wrote:
Daniel hasn't gotten back to me about a new page iteration. I don't want to push, because I'm betting he has a few more irons in the fire than mine. I am sure he'll get around to me in time.

Disagreeing with you there, memory is by far worst than workload ; being busy enough to forget about seeds is enough to not coming back to you. And you would then wait for nothing.
Just query him, if he is too busy, he will tell you, but if he had just forget, he will welcome the reminder.
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

He also decided to keep it up. I am honored.

Cheers.
Pappy
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

krinn wrote:
Just query him, if he is too busy, he will tell you, but if he had just forget, he will welcome the reminder.


Okay. I'll send an email to see where things are. It certainly can't hurt.

Cheers,
Pappy
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

They're a bit late, but the seeds for 4.13.0 are up and ready for download.

32-bit
64-bit

As always, enjoy!

Cheers,
Pappy
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DaggyStyle
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pappy_mcfae wrote:
They're a bit late, but the seeds for 4.13.0 are up and ready for download.

32-bit
64-bit

As always, enjoy!

Cheers,
Pappy


tried them on 4.13.2, got this:
Code:

NCC-5001-D linux # mv ~dagg/Downloads/FWAg0cRC.txt .config
NCC-5001-D linux # make oldconfig
scripts/kconfig/conf  --oldconfig Kconfig
*
* Restart config...
*
*
* Gentoo Linux
*
Gentoo Linux support (GENTOO_LINUX) [Y/n/?] (NEW) ^Cmake[1]: *** [scripts/kconfig/Makefile:86: oldconfig] Interrupt
make: *** [Makefile:547: oldconfig] Interrupt

that happened the same when I tried to run oldconfig on a config from 4.12.9
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pjp
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 4.12.0 64-bit config seems to work for me on 4.12.12 (though I haven't tried to customize and boot from it yet).
Code:
$ sudo make oldconfig
  HOSTCC  scripts/kconfig/conf.o
  HOSTLD  scripts/kconfig/conf
scripts/kconfig/conf  --oldconfig Kconfig
*
* Restart config...
*
*
* Gentoo Linux
*

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DaggyStyle
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 6:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok, the 4.13.x config is missing the gentoo part and the rest of it's deps, the auto restart fixes the issue.
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2017 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The odd part here is that this is not set up on any of my old kernels. I have searched for it using make xconfig, and found nothing. I have looked for it in raw .config text files, and I don't see it anywhere. Do you know the yes/module combination that makes this visible? I don't know how necessary that is considering none of my machines have it set in their .configs. Still if it exists, I should at least see if it seems to offer any benefit in machine operation.

Cheers,
Pappy
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pjp
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 2:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@pappy_mcfae:

You're only releasing vanilla sources, correct? I believe DaggyStyle is referring to patches from the gentoo-sources kernel.

From a freshly emerged kernel with no changes:
Code:
/usr/src/linux-4.13.3-gentoo $ sudo make defconfig
*** Default configuration is based on 'x86_64_defconfig'
#
# configuration written to .config
#
/usr/src/linux-4.13.3-gentoo $ grep GENTOO .config
CONFIG_GENTOO_LINUX=y
CONFIG_GENTOO_LINUX_UDEV=y
CONFIG_GENTOO_LINUX_PORTAGE=y
CONFIG_GENTOO_LINUX_INIT_SCRIPT=y
# CONFIG_GENTOO_LINUX_INIT_SYSTEMD is not set

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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That must be it.

While I used to keep kernels of various flavors on my machine to boot into, I haven't done that since I stopped making the first round of seeds. I use mostly vanilla-sources, unless I get inspired to see if zen sources are still being developed. I never saw an advantage to gentoo-sources, but did run them occasionally.

I've streamlined a bit.

Cheers,
Pappy
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 9:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm only a few days late. I might be getting the hang of this all again. The seeds for 4.14.0 are at pastebin, and ready for download.

32-bit
64-bit

As always, enjoy!

Cheers,
Pappy
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Gordex
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for all your work, Pappy.. your seeds are always a useful help
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm glad that I have an opportunity to share my little contribution to the furthering of the open-source community and its ideals.

Cheers,
Pappy
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walkingcorpse
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was about to ask where could I have found more info on manual kernel configuration and updated kernel seeds but luckily I've found this thread, keep up the good work! :)
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Elleni
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 2:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I d like to add another thank you for contributing these preconfigs, which I find very helpful. Great Job and again - thank you very much. :D
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 30, 2017 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is mind-blowing to thing that one little idea became such a hit. I am honored that my idea was embraced and remains popular. Thank you for your support.
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 7:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not too bad on the time this time. I was watching for its release. The seeds for 4.15.0 are up on pastebin and just waiting for download.

32-bit
64-bit

The patches that address Spectre and Meltdown are turned on in these seed versions. They do seem to slow things down a bit, but security should always be of concern. I know one is in the CPU settings section. I think the other two are in kernel hacking. You can turn them off if you wish, but they are on by default.

As always, enjoy!

Cheers,
Pappy
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 9:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pappy_mcfae,

You are using the 'S' word again :)
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep. Got to love the spirit of open-source. Daniel doesn't mind.

Cheers,
Pappy
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My most humble apologies for being so late with the latest seeds. My financial woes and attempting to break their hold on me have been especially taxing this past month. On the good side, typing make oldconfig will update the seed to the version of source you're using.

32-bit
64-bit

If you would like to donate to my cause in appreciation for the seeds, you can do so at the historical copy of the old seeds pages currently housed here. Your support will be greatly appreciated.

As always, enjoy!

Cheers,
Pappy

PS: My continued and voluminous thanks to Neddy Seagoon for hosting the historical page.
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MarcoMarin
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,
Quote:
typing make oldconfig will update the seed

Maybe useful to some: According to the Docs, make olddefconfig will answer each new option with the new defaults. I think plain oldconfig will answer "no" to everything? Could be better, depending on the situation.

Anyways, thanks for the Seeds. : )
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P.Kosunen
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2018 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oldconfig asks input for every new option, you can just keep hitting enter for defaults.
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2018 7:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Part of the reason I put together the idea of seeds in the first place was that the defaults included unneeded and unwanted hardware and other options. Using make oldconfig allows you to change defaults, and in doing so, avoid a lot of cruft.

For instance, when updating a kernel from version to version, the default situation is for all, let me repeat, ALL new hardware drivers to be turned on. make oldconfig allows you to say no to the extra unnecessary drivers. Once you change the default from Y to N by hitting N twice in two successive requests, then default changes to N, and stays that way until you move from the device drivers section.

The same holds true with other new kernel features. Some are pushed forward for no reason except they're new features. Whether they help your system operate is not a consideration. Using make oldconfig gives you control. make olddefconfig would remove your ability to change things, and in doing so, remove the idea behind the seed in the first place.

What one does with a seed is up to them. Using the method shown in the historical page always yields acceptable results. Using them in other ways seems a waste of time, but I just put them out there for use. How they are used is up to the user, as it should be.

Cheers,
Pappy
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MarcoMarin
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PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2018 12:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, Pappy, I agree completely and am very grateful for your efforts. Specially making the whole webpage describing the rationale for many of the choices. This was what started me on the path to learning more about the Kernel, after Gentoo opened up the Gnu/Linux black box for me, of course. (thanks guys! \o)

Regarding the make parameter, in my case I'm always afraid some new option may be needed somehow. On the other hand, after one configures the Kernel once, and it's thorough and/or satisfactory, there is indeed very little need for new options to be on by default*. It's best to go in afterwards and see what changed, so what I do now is diff a vanilla "defconfig" with my old setup and see whats new. Or simply load it right in, into menuconfig, and check the (NEW) tags, I do like the context it gives and the B/W linear console always confuses me a bit :oops: not to mention I can change my mind before I forget what I changed my mind about :D

But I guess deep down the primary reason for me not to use oldconfig is that I can't tell upfront how long it's gonna take. What if they added lots and lots of options? what if I have to interrupt it somehow? what if I reserve the whole day for it and it's just a couple options!


Awesome!
Kind regards.

* though, arguably, with the demise of grSecurity and the ensuing gradual migration of new implementation directly upstream we'll be seeing hereon, there could be an advantage if say, lack of time or particular knowledge in that domain... were it not the audience for this not already inclined to go in and fiddle with everything anyway ^_^
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2018 10:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I have a question about the kernel and any new settings while make oldconfig is running, I check with Google to find information about whether or not the setting in question is actually needed for operation of the kernel. Such is the case with the new settings to disable two CPU vulnerabilities. Since I already knew of the exploits and their causes, I made sure these options were turned on in the last iteration of the seed.

For the most part, new kernel iterations usually contain new device drivers, and very few truly needed options that aren't already in the mix. If any of the new options are needed, the help will usually tell you. A simple press of the question mark while make oldconfig is running gives you this information. In general, I have found few needed options that were recreated or split from another routine and made optional. I don't think I've ever had to take them into consideration up to now.

That is part of why I make the seed. I have a general working knowledge of what makes a computer tick, and with that and Google, I can be sure of what is or isn't needed in the kernel to make things work as they should. And, I don't release the new seed until I have that particular kernel running on my machine for at least a day. If it crashes my system first, it doesn't get released until that is fixed. So far, so good.

I am glad to know that others have benefited from the seed concept in more ways than just getting their machines running. The biggest idea behind them was for new users or others unfamiliar with kernels and their wherefores and whys to gain some knowledge of the hidden and fascinating world of what happens to the hardware when you do certain things. I am glad that my idea has helped others gain a greater knowledge of hardware systems and what it takes to integrate all that with the right kernel options so machines run as glitch-free as possible.

Cheers,
Pappy
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