| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
yzg
Guru
Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Posts: 493
|
 Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 1:41 am Post subject: world update is causing kde5 upgrade [SOLVED] |
 |
|
A routine portage world update on ~amd machine is given me a whole list of kde-frameworks/* packages to install. I do not want to upgrade this computer to kde5 now.
Do I have to upgrade to kde5?
Last edited by yzg on Thu Aug 27, 2015 2:29 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
asturm
Developer
Joined: 05 Apr 2007
Posts: 8936
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 1:48 am Post subject: |
|
|
There is no kde5. You have chosen to run an ~amd64 system, so you get new packages early. If it is only kde-frameworks/* packages (which are just libs) you see in portage output, it is most likely not a package from the core kde categories that is pulling them in. It could be konversation, e.g.
However you can always mask packages you don't want, guides available in Gentoo Handbook. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yzg
Guru
Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Posts: 493
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 1:51 am Post subject: |
|
|
| But should the decision to change to change from kde4 to kde5 be more explicit? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
asturm
Developer
Joined: 05 Apr 2007
Posts: 8936
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 1:58 am Post subject: |
|
|
What do you mean?
There is an upgrade to plasma-5, which is a manual decision.
There is an upgrade from kde4-based to kde-frameworks-5 based applications, which is happening gradually over the last year and continuing so, all the while having both kf5-based and kde4-based applications living side by side.
Then there are external applications gradually migrating to Qt5 and occasionally also using kde-frameworks-5, pulling those in (that is happening in your case I guess). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yzg
Guru
Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Posts: 493
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 3:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
I found the problem:
I have kde-base/kde-meta-4.14.3 installed. It is calling kde-apps/kdemultimedia-meta. The version of kde-apps/kdemultimedia-meta was pumped from 4.14.3 to 15.08.0. The new version is now calling kde-apps/kdenlive-15.08.0 which brings the kde-frameworks/* packages.
Masking kde-apps/kdemultimedia-meta-15.08.0 solved the problem.
What I meant is if I install kde-base/kde-meta:4, should I get kde-apps/kde*-meta:4 only?
I'm playing with kde5 on another test computer. It still has problems and I do not like the way sddm is forcing users to switch to systemd. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
asturm
Developer
Joined: 05 Apr 2007
Posts: 8936
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 5:30 am Post subject: |
|
|
| yzg wrote: | | What I meant is if I install kde-base/kde-meta:4, should I get kde-apps/kde*-meta:4 only? |
No, as you can see in your example above, because the dependencies are listed as unslotted >=${PV}, that means you will get any subsequent unmasked :5 upgrade as well.
You would want something like kde-apps/*:5 in your package.mask file. Be aware that it is going to be a growing list of outside-of-kde-apps/ atoms in the future. Also note that kde-frameworks installs just libraries and there is no interference with your kde4 workspace, no 'switch' to kde5 as you call what I suspect you really mean plasma-5.
| yzg wrote: | | and I do not like the way sddm is forcing users to switch to systemd. |
Except it doesn't. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yzg
Guru
Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Posts: 493
|
| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2015 2:28 am Post subject: |
|
|
I hope so.
Anyway I do not think it is a correct behavior for kde-apps/kde-meta:4 to install kde-apps/*:5 packages. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
steveL
Watchman
Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 5153
Location: The Peanut Gallery
|
| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2015 10:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
| yzg wrote: | I have kde-base/kde-meta-4.14.3 installed. It is calling kde-apps/kdemultimedia-meta. The version of kde-apps/kdemultimedia-meta was pumped from 4.14.3 to 15.08.0. The new version is now calling kde-apps/kdenlive-15.08.0 which brings the kde-frameworks/* packages.
Masking kde-apps/kdemultimedia-meta-15.08.0 solved the problem. |
I'd file a bug for the 4.14 package, so that it has the correct slotted dependency.
| Quote: | | What I meant is if I install kde-base/kde-meta:4, should I get kde-apps/kde*-meta:4 only? |
What genstorm said applies, if you're running unstable (a bad idea, ime: better to unmask only the packages you can deal with breaking.)
I agree with you on the overall point, but typically not many developers on the desktop side care too much about keeping things smoothly upgradeable. Certainly not when it comes to a choice between that and the latest "shiny" crapfest, and KDE major upgrades are well known as a PITA, in every distro. 4.x was a nightmare of idiotic ideas bringing in a slew of dependencies, which we can only workaround because it's from-source (the backstop that cannot be denied); not because a lean stable desktop was anyone's priority, let alone smooth upgrades.
I'd anticipate having to mask packages, and possibly USE flags, is what I'm getting at; especially if you're on unstable, where the tree takes time to settle (such as converting to slotted dependencies, though I'd have expected them from the start. Could have sworn the eclasses do that.)
And ofc the standard advice about trying with a new user to avoid the old configs (which I find insanely annoying when you're just going from 4.x to 4.y.)
| Quote: | | I'm playing with kde5 on another test computer. It still has problems and I do not like the way sddm is forcing users to switch to systemd. |
Ouch; how does it do that? (Though the name may be a clue..) That it's infecting the DM is likely a reason to use a different one.
The whole point of KF5 was to be more modular, not less.
Talk of "wayland needs systemd" which some of the more baroque developers occasionally come out with can be annoying, but the general approach is meant to be more modularity, and more choice about how to mix and match components. Or it's not modular.
Anyhow I wouldn't worry too much, since the saner heads within KDE are behind the push to modularity, and there is no way it's ever going to be a Linux-only ("so there!") project like systemd.
It's a showcase for Qt, which is multi-platform; or pointless. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
asturm
Developer
Joined: 05 Apr 2007
Posts: 8936
|
| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2015 11:19 am Post subject: |
|
|
| steveL wrote: | | Quote: | | I'm playing with kde5 on another test computer. It still has problems and I do not like the way sddm is forcing users to switch to systemd. |
Ouch; how does it do that? (Though the name may be a clue..) That it's infecting the DM is likely a reason to use a different one. |
As I said, it does not. In fact, master just gained consolekit2 support. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
steveL
Watchman
Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 5153
Location: The Peanut Gallery
|
| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2015 11:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
| genstorm wrote: | | As I said, it does not. In fact, master just gained consolekit2 support. |
Ah I see; so it did (presumably require loginkit) right up until recently.
Funny how quick you are to make sales-pitches, but never to answer the substantive. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
asturm
Developer
Joined: 05 Apr 2007
Posts: 8936
|
| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2015 11:43 am Post subject: |
|
|
| steveL wrote: | | genstorm wrote: | | As I said, it does not. In fact, master just gained consolekit2 support. |
Ah I see; so it did (presumably require loginkit) right up until recently. |
It didn't enforce systemd at any point, it just didn't support consolekit1 properly which required editing pam (which was described in elog message). If you want to discuss doing without systemd _and_ consolekit entirely that was also easily possible all the time with sddm, aside from losing some comfort.
Funny how quick you are to bitch around (again).
| steveL wrote: | | I agree with you on the overall point, but typically not many developers on the desktop side care too much about keeping things smoothly upgradeable. Certainly not when it comes to a choice between that and the latest "shiny" crapfest, and KDE major upgrades are well known as a PITA, in every distro. 4.x was a nightmare of idiotic ideas bringing in a slew of dependencies, which we can only workaround because it's from-source (the backstop that cannot be denied); not because a lean stable desktop was anyone's priority, let alone smooth upgrades. |
The whole point of how kde applications are handled is smooth upgrades as opposed to how 4.0 worked out (not that they succeed every time as 15.08 did show). :4 and :5 work side by side (with limitations) as applications are slowly ported to kf5. Consequently meta packages have lost slot dependencies. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
Portage & Programming
