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Muso
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 7:58 pm    Post subject: Socialists Are Cheaters Reply with quote

Socialists Are Cheaters, Says New Study

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"The longer individuals were exposed to socialism, the more likely they were to cheat on our task," according to a new study, "The (True) Legacy of Two Really Existing Economic Systems," from Duke University and the University of Munich. The team of researchers concluded this after working with 259 participants from Berlin who grew up on opposite sides of the infamous wall.

When playing a dice game that could earn them €6 ($8 ), subjects originally from the East, which was for four decades under socialist rule, were more likely than their market economy counterparts in West to lie about how they fared. The Economist explains the task:
Quote:
The game was simple enough. Each participant was asked to throw a die 40 times and record each roll on a piece of paper. A higher overall tally earned a bigger payoff. Before each roll, players had to commit themselves to write down the number that was on either the top or the bottom side of the die. However, they did not have to tell anyone which side they had chosen, which made it easy to cheat by rolling the die first and then pretending that they had selected the side with the highest number. If they picked the top and then rolled a two, for example, they would have an incentive to claim—falsely—that they had chosen the bottom, which would be a five.

The results were that "East Germans cheated twice as much as West Germans overall," leaving the researchers to conclude the "the political regime of socialism has a lasting impact on citizens' basic morality."


Continues in TFA
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I read that article.

east germans were communists. not socialists.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
east germans were communists. not socialists.

I was just going to respond with 'bullshit', but instead I'll ask you to explain.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
I read that article.

east germans were communists. not socialists.

Same thing; it's just a matter of degree. The idea that there is some fundamental difference is just leftie propaganda to overcome fear inspired by the massive atrocities committed, and the military threats presented, by the U.S.S.R., China, etc. Saying Europe is not communist is like saying the U.S. is not imperialist -- it's just that only the head of the penis is in (and you know what happens next).
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bones McCracker wrote:
juniper wrote:
I read that article.

east germans were communists. not socialists.

Same thing; it's just a matter of degree. The idea that there is some fundamental difference is just leftie propaganda to overcome fear inspired by the massive atrocities committed, and the military threats presented, by the U.S.S.R., China, etc. Saying Europe is not communist is like saying the U.S. is not imperialist -- it's just that only the head of the penis is in (and you know what happens next).


the conversation can't go anywhere if your stance is that europe is communist.

Dr Willy wrote:
I was just going to respond with 'bullshit', but instead I'll ask you to explain.


East germany was communist. What do you dispute?

socialism is such a broad word as to be meaningless. I wouldn't call sweden socialist, but BK calls all of europe communist. The thing with east germany is that it was communist and that shit can really fuck you up. People didn't trust their family members or neighbours under communism, so yes sure as hell they are going to cheat a bit.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
East germany was communist. What do you dispute?

The statement that they were not socialist.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Communist is to Socialist as rectangle is to parallelogram.

Communist is to Socialist as Presbyterian is to Baptist.

If you're socialist, then whining that you're not communist is quibbling, from the perspective of free-thinking, non-Marx-worshiping individuals, who are no more wrong when they lump you all together as "commies" than when they lump Christians together as "Jesus Freaks".
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not all Christians are Jesus Freaks. Jesus Freaks are Jesus Freaks. IMO, the distinction is with those Christians who are lunatic fringe, stupid, ignorant and/or any other term generally used to describe extremists. There absolutely are Christians who are not Jesus Freaks.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bones McCracker wrote:
Communist is to Socialist as rectangle is to parallelogram.

Communist is to Socialist as Presbyterian is to Baptist.

If you're socialist, then whining that you're not communist is quibbling, from the perspective of free-thinking, non-Marx-worshiping individuals, who are no more wrong when they lump you all together as "commies" than when they lump Christians together as "Jesus Freaks".


depends on what your definitions are. communism gives totalitarian regimes. If your definition of socialism does not, then they are quite different.

It would help if you listed countries in both camps. however, no reasonable definition would give that europe is communist (as I am typing this less than 5km from the world's banking centre).
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bones McCracker wrote:
Communist is to Socialist as rectangle is to parallelogram.

Communist is to Socialist as Presbyterian is to Baptist.

If you're socialist, then whining that you're not communist is quibbling, from the perspective of free-thinking, non-Marx-worshiping individuals, who are no more wrong when they lump you all together as "commies" than when they lump Christians together as "Jesus Freaks".
and communist is to socialist as a circle is to a straight line.... Perspective.
Bottom-Up: from the end-user, the common old garden prole then yes the end-result distinguishing features are just different shades of gray - The people are given something identical to everyone else irrespective of how much they work (or not) for it and everyone pays for it whether or not they need it
Top-Down: While funding is drawn centrally, the distribution is not... Socialism hands the money over to members of that field and they make the decisions not the central government.

This distinction sways EastGermany more towards communism than Socialist as the control came from gov'n bodies
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It boils down to are you symbiotic or predatory bacteria. :lol:
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
Bones McCracker wrote:
Communist is to Socialist as rectangle is to parallelogram.

Communist is to Socialist as Presbyterian is to Baptist.

If you're socialist, then whining that you're not communist is quibbling, from the perspective of free-thinking, non-Marx-worshiping individuals, who are no more wrong when they lump you all together as "commies" than when they lump Christians together as "Jesus Freaks".


depends on what your definitions are. communism gives totalitarian regimes. If your definition of socialism does not, then they are quite different.

Untrue. Communism is supposed to eliminate the need for government as well as classes. It may not work out that way in practice, but neither does socialism. The bottom line is that you can't violate people's rights on a massive scale without using massive force; the extent to which communism and socialism violate people's rights is merely a matter of degree. Furthermore, it is a very slippery slope.

Do not capitalism and democracy similarly have tendencies toward the violation of individual rights? Yes, they do, and they must similarly be attenuated; but they are less collectivist in nature and less utilitarian in moral philosophy, and therefore they are far less dangerous. It is the collectivist, utilitarian nature of socialism/communism that produces dehumanizing social constructs eventually leading to atrocities on an inconceivable scale. We have seen time and again that, unless it is aggressively and relentlessly resisted, the authoritarian collectivist penis does not stop only an inch deep in the ass of humanity, despite whatever platitudes are whispered in our ear.
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