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Butts McCokey
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 10:22 pm    Post subject: What would get you dev-ing for Gentoo? Reply with quote

A few questions:

If you could spare a few minutes each day to help Gentoo, would you? Could you?

If a package that you use needed maintaining would you offer your services?

Have you tried to become a developer before? Done the dev exam?

Have you ever written an ebuild? Could you show others how to?
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 10:36 pm    Post subject: Re: What would get you dev-ing for Gentoo? Reply with quote

cokehabit wrote:
Done the dev exam?
I'm not a developer, but if I were, I certainly wouldn't take a "dev exam."
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 10:46 pm    Post subject: Re: What would get you dev-ing for Gentoo? Reply with quote

pjp wrote:
cokehabit wrote:
Done the dev exam?
I'm not a developer, but if I were, I certainly wouldn't take a "dev exam."
Good, it's comments like that that Gentoo needs to hear.

I've taken it, you need to to become an Arch Tester
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gentoo have already shown they are unwilling to really get rid of "troublemakers" so ... no I don't think there is anything gentoo can do that would interest me in becoming a dev... Ill stick with helping hardened, bugging, irc...
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 10:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
Gentoo have already shown they are unwilling to really get rid of "troublemakers"
Well, they did manage to kick ciaranm out on his petulant ass.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

w1n73rmu7e wrote:
Naib wrote:
Gentoo have already shown they are unwilling to really get rid of "troublemakers"
Well, they did manage to kick ciaranm out on his petulant ass.


no, not really and that is the problem (kicked in name yer)
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
no, not really
Huh? I thought he was gone for good?

Naib wrote:
and that is the problem (kicked in name yer)
:?: I'm confused...
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

After about 10,000 years. How long has there been talk about an official wiki? That's the problem with Gentoo, a whole lot of talk, and not a whole load of action. I can't be arsed with that.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

w1n73rmu7e wrote:
Naib wrote:
no, not really
Huh? I thought he was gone for good?

Naib wrote:
and that is the problem (kicked in name yer)
:?: I'm confused...


who is "lead" of the PMS and who has too much pull over what gets to go in or not... go check the ML and see how long it too for kdebuild to actually get removed from the PMS (something that should NEVER have been in there in the 1st place), or the BS over semantics w.r.t. the MINIMUM version of BASH that is needed (for sooo long the PMS just did not reflect reality and a certain person refused to actually accept this or patches associated with it...) and some of the BS surrounding ...
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Last edited by Naib on Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:11 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Butts McCokey
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AidanJT wrote:
After about 10,000 years. How long has there been talk about an official wiki? That's the problem with Gentoo, a whole lot of talk, and not a whole load of action. I can't be arsed with that.
http://gentoo-ev.org/wiki/Official_Gentoo_wiki :P
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

w1n73rmu7e wrote:
Well, they did manage to kick ciaranm out on his petulant ass.
all they did was take away his @gentoo.org mail address. Other forms of communication are still poisoned by him.

Would you maintain a package for gentoo or try to become a developer if they needed it?
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Butts McCokey
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AidanJT wrote:
After about 10,000 years. How long has there been talk about an official wiki? That's the problem with Gentoo, a whole lot of talk, and not a whole load of action. I can't be arsed with that.
yeah, but would you help out with some of the developing?
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cokehabit wrote:
w1n73rmu7e wrote:
Well, they did manage to kick ciaranm out on his petulant ass.
all they did was take away his @gentoo.org mail address. Other forms of communication are still poisoned by him.

Would you maintain a package for gentoo or try to become a developer if they needed it?
Sure, but I only really know Python. What little Bash I know is just from Googling, etc. I've modified ebuilds in the past to update them, but never written one from scratch.

Naib wrote:
who is "lead" of the PMS and who has too much pull over what gets to go in or not... go check the ML and see how long it too for kdebuild to actually get removed from the PMS (something that should NEVER have been in there in the 1st place), or the BS over semantics w.r.t. the MINIMUM version of BASH that is needed (for sooo long the PMS just did not reflect reality and a certain person refused to actually accept this or patches associated with it...) and some of the BS surrounding ...
:lol: IAH, I didn't understand 75% of what you said, but I'll take your word for it ;)
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

w1n73rmu7e wrote:
cokehabit wrote:
w1n73rmu7e wrote:
Well, they did manage to kick ciaranm out on his petulant ass.
all they did was take away his @gentoo.org mail address. Other forms of communication are still poisoned by him.

Would you maintain a package for gentoo or try to become a developer if they needed it?
Sure, but I only really know Python. What little Bash I know is just from Googling, etc. I've modified ebuilds in the past to update them, but never written one from scratch.
You could copy some bits over and ask someone if what you have done is right. After a few times you'll be making ebuilds with your eyes closed
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cokehabit wrote:
w1n73rmu7e wrote:
cokehabit wrote:
w1n73rmu7e wrote:
Well, they did manage to kick ciaranm out on his petulant ass.
all they did was take away his @gentoo.org mail address. Other forms of communication are still poisoned by him.

Would you maintain a package for gentoo or try to become a developer if they needed it?
Sure, but I only really know Python. What little Bash I know is just from Googling, etc. I've modified ebuilds in the past to update them, but never written one from scratch.
You could copy some bits over and ask someone if what you have done is right. After a few times you'll be making ebuilds with your eyes closed
I've already done that in the past. The thing is that there's a big difference between modifying some ebuilds and becoming a Gentoo developer. It sounds like there's a long and convoluted process that you have to go through to become a dev.
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Butts McCokey
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

w1n73rmu7e wrote:
cokehabit wrote:
w1n73rmu7e wrote:
cokehabit wrote:
w1n73rmu7e wrote:
Well, they did manage to kick ciaranm out on his petulant ass.
all they did was take away his @gentoo.org mail address. Other forms of communication are still poisoned by him.

Would you maintain a package for gentoo or try to become a developer if they needed it?
Sure, but I only really know Python. What little Bash I know is just from Googling, etc. I've modified ebuilds in the past to update them, but never written one from scratch.
You could copy some bits over and ask someone if what you have done is right. After a few times you'll be making ebuilds with your eyes closed
I've already done that in the past. The thing is that there's a big difference between modifying some ebuilds and becoming a Gentoo developer. It sounds like there's a long and convoluted process that you have to go through to become a dev.
Well what I am doing is gaugeing the community's view of the developer recruitment process.

There are some points that need to be fixed in Gentoo and one of those is the staffing needs. The more people like you an PJP who effectively say "I wouldn't go near it because of the convoluted process to become a developer" the better. Gentoo now knows from the horses mouth what the problems are.

Also, if we get people saying "I am unsure if I can become a full time developer because of home commitments but if could look after $package because I use it quite a lot" then Gentoo knows that it needs to rethink the organisational structure of the developer community.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AidanJT wrote:
How long has there been talk about an official wiki? That's the problem with Gentoo, a whole lot of talk, and not a whole load of action. I can't be arsed with that.
Apparently nobody else can be arsed with it either, which is why there is no wiki. Someone has to volunteer to get it going and then there has to be interest to maintain it.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:25 pm    Post subject: Re: What would get you dev-ing for Gentoo? Reply with quote

cokehabit wrote:
I've taken it, you need to to become an Arch Tester
Is that some sort of Jesus complex? "I've taken the test so you don't have to?" :P

But seriously, are those just two completely unrelated thoughts in the same sentence, or what?

As long as my mouse doesn't work with HAL, I'm not really in a position to do much with my desktop. I haven't decided what I'm going to do with it. Too big for a router type box, too small for a virtualization server.

I'd love to have a job though which allowed me to spend some work time helping a project out somehow.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pjp wrote:
AidanJT wrote:
How long has there been talk about an official wiki? That's the problem with Gentoo, a whole lot of talk, and not a whole load of action. I can't be arsed with that.
Apparently nobody else can be arsed with it either, which is why there is no wiki. Someone has to volunteer to get it going and then there has to be interest to maintain it.
This is a direct result of a small community. Why is it that other power-user distros like Arch are able to attract and maintain a large userbase, while Gentoo isn't? If that problem can be fixed, a lot of issues that aren't directly related to development can be fixed as well. Maintaining a wiki can mostly be done by the community, rather than by the developers.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:28 pm    Post subject: Re: What would get you dev-ing for Gentoo? Reply with quote

pjp wrote:
cokehabit wrote:
I've taken it, you need to to become an Arch Tester
Is that some sort of Jesus complex? "I've taken the test so you don't have to?" :P

But seriously, are those just two completely unrelated thoughts in the same sentence, or what?

As long as my mouse doesn't work with HAL, I'm not really in a position to do much with my desktop. I haven't decided what I'm going to do with it. Too big for a router type box, too small for a virtualization server.

I'd love to have a job though which allowed me to spend some work time helping a project out somehow.
Sorry, I wrote that wrong, it meant to read
Quote:
I've taken it, you need it to become an Arch Tester

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

w1n73rmu7e wrote:
This is a direct result of a small community. Why is it that other power-user distros like Arch are able to attract and maintain a large userbase, while Gentoo isn't? If that problem can be fixed, a lot of issues that aren't directly related to development can be fixed as well. Maintaining a wiki can mostly be done by the community, rather than by the developers.
I didn't realize it was that small of a community. Maybe people just don't like source-based distros.

I'm personally losing interest due to a lack of ebuilds* in portage, or what seems like things staying in masked for an eternity**.

* May LJ reviewed handbrake, which only offers Ubuntu binaries. The ebuild has been in bugzilla since 2005.

** Sunrise is a nice effort, and overlays may be a nice technical capability, but I really want a single package management system / environment. sync, search, emerge.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pjp wrote:
May LJ reviewed handbrake, which only offers Ubuntu binaries. The ebuild has been in bugzilla since 2005.
To be fair, that is because of Handbrake's supremely shitty-ass build system.

pjp wrote:
I didn't realize it was that small of a community. Maybe people just don't like source-based distros.
One solution to this is some sort of system by which precompiled copies of popular software (or those that take a long time to build) for the most popular architectures and with the most popular USE flag combinations could be made available for download.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

w1n73rmu7e wrote:
pjp wrote:
May LJ reviewed handbrake, which only offers Ubuntu binaries. The ebuild has been in bugzilla since 2005.
To be fair, that is because of Handbrake's supremely shitty-ass build system.

Yeah, but in 5 years you could have written the application from scratch, nevermind its build system.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AidanJT wrote:
w1n73rmu7e wrote:
pjp wrote:
May LJ reviewed handbrake, which only offers Ubuntu binaries. The ebuild has been in bugzilla since 2005.
To be fair, that is because of Handbrake's supremely shitty-ass build system.

Yeah, but in 5 years you could have written the application from scratch, nevermind its build system.
Well, that's up to upstream, isn't it?
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

w1n73rmu7e wrote:
Well, that's up to upstream, isn't it?

If it benefits downstream then its up to them as well. Patching the build system is every bit as important for distros as patching buggy/insecure code.
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