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lizardcry
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 Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:06 pm Post subject: Does Gentoo have a KDE bias? |
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| Does Gentoo have a KDE bias? |
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UncleOwen
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:09 pm Post subject: |
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lizardcry
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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Why does Gentoo put an unstable, non-compilable version of Gnome in the stable branch? |
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Shan
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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To expand on Owen's rather terse answer, No, Gentoo doesn't have a <i>direct</i> bias towards one DE / WM or another, the reason it might appear as such is because it is built by, and with, the community. The greater the demand for something, the greater emphasis that will be placed upon it by the developers. Since a lot of Gentoo Users happen to be KDE users, it stands that we place a larger demand on the developers. If it takes longer for 'fresh' versions of Gnome to appear in gentoo, its because there is a lack of developers for Gnome, not because they're deliberately hindering the release.
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Earthwings
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:16 pm Post subject: |
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Moved from Other Things Gentoo to Gentoo Chat.
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UncleOwen
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:17 pm Post subject: |
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| lizardcry wrote: |
Why does Gentoo put an unstable, non-compilable version of Gnome in the stable branch? |
Why don't you post a bug report instead of whining? |
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lizardcry
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 13 May 2005
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Location: Iceland
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Shan wrote: | | To expand on Owen's rather terse answer, No, Gentoo doesn't have a <i>direct</i> bias towards one DE / WM or another, the reason it might appear as such is because it is built by, and with, the community. The greater the demand for something, the greater emphasis that will be placed upon it by the developers. Since a lot of Gentoo Users happen to be KDE users, it stands that we place a larger demand on the developers. If it takes longer for 'fresh' versions of Gnome to appear in gentoo, its because there is a lack of developers for Gnome, not because they're deliberately hindering the release. |
That's perhaps a "predisposition" rather than a "bias". Gnome 2.10.2 is in the stable branch and WILL NOT compile because of an obvious bug in the ebuild -- missing 'menu.tree.h'.
To me, this indicates that gentoo's 'stable' branch is not so well purged of defects after all. |
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Shan
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:41 pm Post subject: |
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| lizardcry wrote: | | Shan wrote: | | To expand on Owen's rather terse answer, No, Gentoo doesn't have a <i>direct</i> bias towards one DE / WM or another, the reason it might appear as such is because it is built by, and with, the community. The greater the demand for something, the greater emphasis that will be placed upon it by the developers. Since a lot of Gentoo Users happen to be KDE users, it stands that we place a larger demand on the developers. If it takes longer for 'fresh' versions of Gnome to appear in gentoo, its because there is a lack of developers for Gnome, not because they're deliberately hindering the release. |
That's perhaps a "predisposition" rather than a "bias". Gnome 2.10.2 is in the stable branch and WILL NOT compile because of an obvious bug in the ebuild -- missing 'menu.tree.h'.
To me, this indicates that gentoo's 'stable' branch is not so well purged of defects after all. |
"Stable" and "unstable" are naming misnomers, more accurately they should be called "tested somewhat" and "completely untested". We don't have the resources to fully test every package before release, and what might have worked fine for enough people to get it taged 'stable', might not work at all for you.
My suggestion is to look at gentoo's bugzilla and around the forums; odds are your problem has already been reported with (likely) a solution as well.
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Ctrl+Alt+Del
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:43 pm Post subject: |
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Well shit happens, i wouldn't treat a single bug in Gnome as a sign that Gentoo is KDE biased.
That said, i myself am a gnome user and quite happy with it, i rarely suffer from bugs, most of what goes wrong is thanks to me screwing things up.
Kudos to the Gnome Team  |
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j-m
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:44 pm Post subject: |
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What about filing a bug (if there's not one yet) instead of trying to start flamewar here?   |
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amne
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:46 pm Post subject: |
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| j-m wrote: | | What about filing a bug (if there's not one yet) instead of trying to start flamewar here? |
Perhaps he already did, but since all Gentoo devs hate gnome they silently deleted it. 
Searching bugs.gentoo.org for menu.tree.h yields no results - if a bug isn't known it can't be fixed.
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lizardcry
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Joined: 13 May 2005
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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| amne wrote: | | j-m wrote: | | What about filing a bug (if there's not one yet) instead of trying to start flamewar here? |
Perhaps he already did, but since all Gentoo devs hate gnome they silently deleted it.
Searching bugs.gentoo.org for menu.tree.h yields no results - if a bug isn't known it can't be fixed. |
How does a gentoo noob start talking about stuff like this without "starting a flamewar"? In any event, my suspicions have been confirmed. For whatever reason, there are a larger quantity of KDE packagers than for gnome.
As for the bug, they are talking about it another forum. |
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Monkeh
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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| lizardcry wrote: | | Gnome 2.10.2 is in the stable branch and WILL NOT compile because of an obvious bug in the ebuild -- missing 'menu.tree.h'. |
Ehem.. My currently running (but gone, as I'm in the process of switching to ~x86) compile of Gnome 2.10.2 compiled without errors overnight some time ago.  |
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Shan
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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| lizardcry wrote: | | amne wrote: | | j-m wrote: | | What about filing a bug (if there's not one yet) instead of trying to start flamewar here? |
Perhaps he already did, but since all Gentoo devs hate gnome they silently deleted it.
Searching bugs.gentoo.org for menu.tree.h yields no results - if a bug isn't known it can't be fixed. |
How does a gentoo noob start talking about stuff like this without "starting a flamewar"?
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I don't think J-m was implying you intentionally sought out to start a flamewar, its just in how you worded your posting. More often than not, people coming to the forums saying things like "Gentoo is XXX Biased" or such is just vying for attention.
| Quote: | | In any event, my suspicions have been confirmed. For whatever reason, there are a larger quantity of KDE packagers than for gnome. |
Again, this isn't inherently true. I don't know for a fact that there are more KDE devs than Gnome (I'm a kde guy myself so I can't even begin to guess with any sort of certainty). I'm merely stating that it is a likely possibility.
| Quote: | | As for the bug, they are talking about it another forum. |
If by another forum you mean an entirely different site (not another subforum here) then its indeed not a gentoo problem at all, but a gnome one. If this is the case then posting a more thorough explenation of your problem here could at the very least, help us figure out if it can be fixed locally (EG with Gentoo devs) or upstream (Gnome devs).
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amne
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Joined: 17 Nov 2002
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:01 pm Post subject: |
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| lizardcry wrote: | | As for the bug, they are talking about it another forum. |
It's very simple: Once a bug report is filed, it can be assigned to the gnome team and they can fix it. If people are talking about it in another forum (where?) it just doesn't help the gnome team fixing the bug.
I really fail to see in what way Gentoo is biased if no one even reports a bug and gives us a chance to fix it.
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lizardcry
Tux's lil' helper
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | As for the bug, they are talking about it another forum. If by another forum you mean an entirely different site (not another subforum here) then its indeed not a gentoo problem at all, but a gnome one. If this is the case then posting a more thorough explenation of your problem here could at the very least, help us figure out if it can be fixed locally (EG with Gentoo devs) or upstream (Gnome devs). |
I meant here in the desktop enviro forum - not some other site. They're talking about probs with 2.10, but my specific questions with posts of errors have gone without any response. And even if it was a gnome-specific issue, then the whole gnome version with that fatal flaw should stay out of stable, IMHO. |
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lizardcry
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:07 pm Post subject: |
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| amne wrote: | | lizardcry wrote: | | As for the bug, they are talking about it another forum. |
It's very simple: Once a bug report is filed, it can be assigned to the gnome team and they can fix it. If people are talking about it in another forum (where?) it just doesn't help the gnome team fixing the bug.
I really fail to see in what way Gentoo is biased if no one even reports a bug and gives us a chance to fix it. |
Okay. I will go look at the bug reports, and see what's there. Assuming I can find where that is / / /  |
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Shan
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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| lizardcry wrote: | | And even if it was a gnome-specific issue, then the whole gnome version with that fatal flaw should stay out of stable, IMHO. |
Not if the people that experiance it are a (apparently) small percentage of the total "testers". That is, if the bug is 'rare' then delaying an entire release of a program until its solved doesn't make sense. You release it to the public (who will then find more things to fix) and you update it later with better releases. The only time you hold a release back is when its a major thing that a lot of people will encounter, or if its a big security risk.
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j-m
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:23 pm Post subject: |
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Ah, this debate is just wonderful. FF does not compile for me, does Gentoo have a Konqueror/Opera bias?
File a bug so that Gnome devs actually know about the problem (no, they don't have paranormal abilities and don't screen these forums because they have better things to do), provide needed information and it'll be fixed/filed upstream/troubleshooted/whatever...  Apparently, I works for lots of other people who do not experience such problem at all. |
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j-m
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:26 pm Post subject: |
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| lizardcry wrote: |
How does a gentoo noob start talking about stuff like this without "starting a flamewar"? In any event, my suspicions have been confirmed. For whatever reason, there are a larger quantity of KDE packagers than for gnome.
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First, choosing an appropriate descriptive subject instead of one that clearly suggests you are trying to start a flame would be really helpful. |
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lizardcry
Tux's lil' helper
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Location: Iceland
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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| j-m wrote: | | lizardcry wrote: |
How does a gentoo noob start talking about stuff like this without "starting a flamewar"? In any event, my suspicions have been confirmed. For whatever reason, there are a larger quantity of KDE packagers than for gnome.
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First, choosing an appropriate descriptive subject instead of one that clearly suggests you are trying to start a flame would be really helpful. |
Ridiculous! The question was "Does gentoo have a kde bias?" If someone has an opinion on that around here, I wanted to hear it. Not going to apologize for asking that question.
Take care. |
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j-m
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:45 pm Post subject: |
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| lizardcry wrote: |
Ridiculous! The question was "Does gentoo have a kde bias?" If someone has an opinion on that around here, I wanted to hear it. Not going to apologize for asking that question.
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Yes, you are completely right. Your attitude is just plain ridiculous. You are clearly flaming here - first by posting some question which has an obvious answer, only to continue with
| lizardcry wrote: |
Why does Gentoo put an unstable, non-compilable version of Gnome in the stable branch?
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when the obvious answer comes, just to fuel the flame further. 
| lizardcry wrote: |
Take care. |
This thread will be best taken care of by closing it, so that we don't waste DB space for pointless rants. File a bug, unsubstantiated and uncalled for flames are not welcome.
If we were KDE-biased, there would be no Gnome in portage (enjoy Slackware).
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Earthwings
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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Folks, take a breath, nothing here worth starting some silly flamewar.
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lizardcry
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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Shan's response above was quite informative. As for your responses, I don't understand why you would write these attacks. If you don't like a question or how it was asked or don't know the answer, just leave it for others to deal with, i.e., ignore it. You really need to pipe down with this b.s. personal flamewar garbage. You will get no apology from me. I reject your admonishment because it is b.s. My questions were legit. If you can't deal with it, then go meditate under a palm tree.
| j-m wrote: | | lizardcry wrote: |
Ridiculous! The question was "Does gentoo have a kde bias?" If someone has an opinion on that around here, I wanted to hear it. Not going to apologize for asking that question.
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Yes, you are completely right. Your attitude is just plain ridiculous. You are clearly flaming here - first by posting some question which has an obvious answer, only to continue with
| lizardcry wrote: |
Why does Gentoo put an unstable, non-compilable version of Gnome in the stable branch?
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when the obvious answer comes, just to fuel the flame further.
| lizardcry wrote: |
Take care. |
This thread will be best taken care of by closing it, so that we don't waste DB space for pointless rants. File a bug, unsubstantiated and uncalled for flames are not welcome.
If we were KDE-biased, there would be no Gnome in portage (enjoy Slackware).
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lizardcry
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| Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Earthwings wrote: | | Folks, take a breath, nothing here worth starting some silly flamewar. |
Okay. |
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