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patrix_neo
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcgruff wrote:

from article wrote:

Past global climate changes had strong regional expression.


This, just makes me wonder, if it's not like that even today..
mcgruff wrote:

from article wrote:

To elucidate their spatio-temporal pattern, we reconstructed past temperatures for seven continental-scale regions during the past one to two millennia.


How did that reconstruct make happend?
No, wait, I have to pay for knowing how science work. Is that another CO2 tax?

mcgruff wrote:

Realclimate is one of the most detailed and scientifically literate resources on climate on the internet. I fully understand if that is a problem for you but if you want to find out what real climate scientists think as opposed to unqualified blowhards with a blog like Anthony Watts, that's where to go.

I dont follow that piece of garbage called whattsupwiththat.com. And so should no one other. But you are entitled to follow another religous site. I am not the spanish inquisition.

Quote:

There was no globally synchronised medieval warm period. The paper which you cite doesn't even demonstrate a temperature trend in Antarctica never mind globally.

There were a variety of regional warming and cooling trends on various timescales overlaid on top of a general (global) cooling trend.


Ok, it was not synchronized, my apology. That article demonstrate the method, you as a person have to understand the underlining of it. I did not...
Still, the summa summarum was, it had a global effect. It was not centralized to europe.
On the other hand, your url-reply did actually not convince me (surprise!). The same sample-results as in europe(eans) was shown elsewhere. As far as antarctica.
IF the papers are/was right.

mcgruff wrote:

Scientists have an important job to do. Part of that job is to tell people who spew anti-scientific nonsense to f*ck off.

Like Silby?

Quote:

I think he messed up his proxy work by sampling mixed organic matter when his method demanded fossil shells exclusively.

Your oppinion, ofcourse.

mcgruff wrote:

Every time we've thought we've seen a divergence in CO2 and temperature it turns out to be wrong after further research with improved methods.

I think I love you...

mcgruff wrote:

We've done this already. It hasn't stopped warming. Even if it had, anyone who claims such a short period is significant has just self-identified as scientifically illiterate.
Climate scientists will of course be curious about temperatures which might appear to have stalled. They'll want to try to explain it because they're interested in climate processes on all scales. However, they will not claim that short timescales such as this prove anything about global climate trends. They don't really need to: there are more than enough stupid people around to take that job on.


The scientist in question in the right position at the right time has to be openminded /My opinion
Based on what? Science is settled?
And, A climate scientist is not an entity, they are individuals
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patrix_neo
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Prenj wrote:
mcgruff wrote:
known

orly?

I do not know why but that one made me laugh...sry. Very unscientifical of me ofcourse...
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McGruff
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

patrix_neo wrote:
This, just makes me wonder, if it's not like that even today.


Of course it is, at least in a loose sense. We've moved into a new climate regime so climate processes are not identical.

patrix_neo wrote:
you are entitled to follow another religous site


And you are full of shit. Realclimate is staffed by real climate scientists who are active in the field. It is not a "religious" site.

patrix_neo wrote:
On the other hand, your url-reply did actually not convince me (surprise!).


It's not meant to convince you. It's meant to show other people that you're talking out your ass.

patrix_neo wrote:
Like Silby?


Shitby can publish or he can f*ck off. It's a free country.

patrix_neo wrote:
Your oppinion, ofcourse.


Actually it isn't. That's how Rothman's work has been judged by the wider climate science community but you'd have to read some books to find that out. It's mentioned in "The Phanerozoic Carbon Cycle : CO2 and O2: CO2 and O2" by Robert Berner, for example.

That's your problem right there. You don't have a clue and you won't try to learn. Cluelessness itself may be excusable but only if you are genuinely trying to learn.

All you are doing is cherry-picking items after the most superficial of readings which seem to challenge the orthodoxy but you haven't seen any of the thousands of other papers on the same subject or followed the technical discussions which take place amongst real scientists to judge their worth.
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patrix_neo
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcgruff wrote:

Of course it is, at least in a loose sense. We've moved into a new climate regime so climate processes are not identical.

So what are we arguing about, actually? A median value? If so, what does that value mean? Do you or any other scientist have a straight answer?

mcgruff wrote:

And you are full of shit. Realclimate is staffed by real climate scientists who are active in the field. It is not a "religious" site.

Do not make climate scientists ubiquotos to every climate scientists alive.
I feel I know when a pot of stew are made of truths and own beliefs in this case.

mcgruff wrote:

It's not meant to convince you. It's meant to show other people that you're talking out your ass.

brrrup!
As mature an answer as your was.

mcgruff wrote:

Shitby can publish or he can f*ck off. It's a free country.

brrrrrrrup!!

mcgruff wrote:

Actually it isn't. That's how Rothman's work has been judged by the wider climate science community but you'd have to read some books to find that out. It's mentioned in "The Phanerozoic Carbon Cycle : CO2 and O2: CO2 and O2" by Robert Berner, for example.

That's your problem right there. You don't have a clue and you won't try to learn. Cluelessness itself may be excusable but only if you are genuinely trying to learn.

All you are doing is cherry-picking items after the most superficial of readings which seem to challenge the orthodoxy but you haven't seen any of the thousands of other papers on the same subject or followed the technical discussions which take place amongst real scientists to judge their worth.

Actually, that is my point. It IS your opinion. And you chose to use it as you like.
Ok, I can admit in your perspective I must be an illiterate. I have not read that book. If I try to learn or not, is not your responsibility, and now you are talking out your ass. This kind of behaviour would I expect from someone wanting to diminish a person.
Coming with a decoct of; look - I've read something noone else have! (joke).
At the same time, I cannot see you having any objection to the Svensmark video. I find that you have to be emotionally incapable to see a man suffering.

[edit] I forgot something, I am not saying IPCC are totally wrong. I am just saying "what's this all about? I have unanswered questions"
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McGruff
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

patrix_neo wrote:
So what are we arguing about, actually? A median value? If so, what does that value mean? Do you or any other scientist have a straight answer?


Measuring a global trend requires that you take account of the whole, er, globe. The illusion of a medieval warm period only appears if you cherry-pick all the highs from different regions and different periods. Not very scientific.

patrix_neo wrote:
I feel I know when a pot of stew are made of truths and own beliefs in this case.


See dunning-kruger.

patrix_neo wrote:
This kind of behaviour would I expect from someone wanting to diminish a person.


I try to be fair. Cruel, but fair.

patrix_neo wrote:
At the same time, I cannot see you having any objection to the Svensmark video. I find that you have to be emotionally incapable to see a man suffering.


I like to watch bad scientists suffer. What's wrong about that?

In a just world, people would immediately suffer a heart attack every time they opened their mouth to lie - and none of that pansy-assed, second-chance pacemaker shit.
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patrix_neo
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

Measuring a global trend requires that you take account of the whole, er, globe. The illusion of a medieval warm period only appears if you cherry-pick all the highs from different regions and different periods. Not very scientific.


Can you extrapolate a little here? What made it a cherry pick scenario? If you have no proof, it was not.

Quote:

See dunning-kruger.


I cannot answer whom of us fit in here...

mcgruff wrote:


patrix_neo wrote:
This kind of behaviour would I expect from someone wanting to diminish a person.

I try to be fair. Cruel, but fair.


Try to be when applicable.

Quote:

I like to watch bad scientists suffer. What's wrong about that?


This I cannot justify with an answer
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcgruff wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
They're not Orthodox.


Did someone drop you on your head when you were a baby? I've already explained what I meant by "climate orthodoxy". The big picture of climate forcings and future effects is very well known and has a solid evidentiary basis but it's not set in stone. To me an "orthodoxy" also implies that there also may be unorthodox views. That's fine - providing they are based on solid science.

Words have definitions and connotations. If you want to communicate intelligibly, don't use words you don't understand. Outside the religious context, the word "orthodoxy" is used today to imply a religion-like, dogmatic, truth- or correctness-controlling group, the body of information under their dominion, or the state of conforming to them.

In a scientific context, it's a derogatory term. You probably read it somewhere and, because of strictures to your already religioscientific thought processes, failed to recognize it as such. Then, being a parrotting kind of guy and thinking it sounded intelligent, you foolishly parrotted it, unaware that you were making an ass of yourself. Dunning-Kruger indeed. :lol:
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Prenj
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
Dunning-Kruger indeed. :lol:

:lol: Now you made me look it up.
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GabrielYYZ
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just leaving this here, to see if the thread can continue...

Thesaurus.com wrote:
Orthodox

Main Entry: accustomed
Part of Speech: adjective
Definition: normal, usual
Synonyms: accepted, chronic, common, conventional, customary, established, everyday, expected, general, habitual, ordinary, orthodox, regular, routine, set, traditional, typical
Antonyms: abnormal, unaccustomed, unusual
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McGruff
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@BK

Words do indeed have definitions but that doesn't appear to stop you trying to redefine them.

Orthodoxy refers to a common belief.

A scientific orthodoxy implies a theory which is well-developed, substantive, and widely accepted. A theory which is more speculative and in dispute cannot be called an orthodoxy. Orthodoxy implies a battle won.

Unlike religion, a scientific orthodoxy isn't fixed. For example, there is still plenty of interesting research to do on the subject of evolution. Everything is up for grabs provided only that there is solid evidence to support the new line of thought and if the new theory becomes widely-accepted, this becomes the new orthodoxy.

Let me try to explain it in terms you can understand. Two of your teddy bears think you're a doofus, but two others think you're a dingus: heterodoxy. All four teddy bears think you're a dingus: orthodoxy.


Last edited by McGruff on Thu Jul 04, 2013 12:50 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcgruff wrote:
Orthodoxy refers to a common belief.

This is for GabrielYYZ as well.

Read it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orthodoxy

Here's it's disambiguation: look at all of its notable uses:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orthodoxy_(disambiguation)

Here is a typical dictionary entry; the religious connotations are heavy. In a scientific context, the word is laden with innuendo.
Quote:
or·tho·dox [awr-thuh-doks] Show IPA adjective of, pertaining to, or conforming to the approved form of any doctrine, philosophy, ideology, etc. of, pertaining to, or conforming to beliefs, attitudes, or modes of conduct that are generally approved. customary or conventional, as a means or method; established. sound or correct in opinion or doctrine, especially theological or religious doctrine. conforming to the Christian faith as represented in the creeds of the early church.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/orthodox

Particularly in the context of the dynamics of contention over climate science, use of the phrase "scientific orthodoxy" (by anyone with a 3-digit IQ and a full command of English) could only be a sarcastic jab. Find me a couple of instances of established authors or journalists using it without intending it as such, and I'll shut up and apologize.
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Prenj
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

McGruff is like 1.0 version of a communication protocol insisting that all the following versions are wrong.

P.S.
@ BK: I looked it up, it was reassuring to know that there was a word for it :lol:
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McGruff
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 04, 2013 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
Find me a couple of instances of established authors or journalists using it without intending it as such, and I'll shut up and apologize.


Here ya go.
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 5:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's what I thought.

I don't mean to be harsh, by the way; I'm just clarifying the meaning of the phrase. I realize that English may not be your native language.
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McGruff
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 6:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't sweat it. Discovering that your own teddy bears don't really like you would be a shock for anyone.
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pjp
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's why they always end up decapitated.
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

:lol:
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You know how I keep complaining about Shitby not doing any real work? Well look what's happened: Shitby has been canned.

Quote:
Statement regarding the termination of Professor Murry Salby

10 July 2013

Macquarie University does not normally comment on the circumstances under which employees leave the University. However, we feel in this instance it is necessary to do so in order to correct misinformation.

The decision to terminate Professor Murry Salby’s employment with Macquarie University had nothing to do with his views on climate change nor any other views. The University supports academic freedom of speech and freedom to pursue research interests.

Professor Salby’s employment was terminated firstly, because he did not fulfil his academic obligations, including the obligation to teach. After repeated directions to teach, this matter culminated in his refusal to undertake his teaching duties and he failed to arrive at a class he had been scheduled to take.

The University took this matter very seriously as the education and welfare of students is a primary concern. The second reason for his termination involved breaches of University policies in relation to travel and use of University resources.

The termination of his employment followed an extensive and detailed internal process, including two separate investigations undertaken by a committee chaired by a former Australian Industrial Relations Commissioner and including a union nominee.


You guys sure know how to pick 'em.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I glad to see your climate science arguments showing so much improvement. :lol:

There is more entertainment value in one of your posts than a whole hour of Killer Klowns from Outer Space.
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pjp
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 3:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Macquarie University does not normally comment on the circumstances under which employees leave the University. However, we feel in this instance it is necessary to do so in order to correct misinformation.

The decision to terminate Professor Murry Salby’s employment with Macquarie University had nothing to do with his views on climate change nor any other views.
LOL. It's not him, it's them.
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 4:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

:lol:

They had to put out a press release to quell the asphalt-undulating, concrete-cracking sympathetic vibrations caused by the wanton, tribalistic, balls-out fapping of all the mcgruffians. "Ooooaaauggh.... teh Shitby.... yer mah sister... teh Scyents!"
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