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chronicwilly
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 9:58 pm    Post subject: Tried others, didnt work, IS GENTOO FOR ME>??? Reply with quote

So far I have tried, Redhat, Very impressed with optimization, etc etc, but not so much with the gaming, or music modding etc, Tried fedora, Epic syste, good for gaming and all around cutting edge, I found it has to many bugs, to many rediculous useless crap, and to many updates constantly getting in the way, Tried mint, Puked, Tried ubuntu, Puked, Tried debian, shook my head first 5 min, Tried open suse, Bugs................ etc etc etc etc etc.. But I have not tried gentoo...

What kind of system im looking for? Im looking for something that when setup can be good for gaming, wine, crossover etc etc, good security, selinux etc, staying anonymous for my activities, as best as possible, Good programs like pulseaudio equalizer, and vlc, mainly for there parametric EQ, Ardour etc etc etc...
Nice simple interface like mate, with eyecandy such as compiz etc, or other simple windows manager, I dont like kde bloat crap.. Something where I can Raid my 3 harddrives for extra speed, and be able to also dual boot with windows, nvr done this b4 new to me... Minimal updates, with maximin satisfaction, optimization and security.. The ability to create a custom live cd for myself for when i go to reinstall gentoo on another system or my own, with same programs i have already preset.. And u can see the image im getting at.... Ive been using linux for about half a year, lost count, I dont work atm cause of our messed up recession world, so i have lots of time on my hands, and so yea.. and please if your just gunna give me rtfm answers, please dont post here. thanks and post ur opinions on what would worrk for me.
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LoTeK
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hope I won't say anything wrong or too subjective..

gentoo is a system that is hard to install the first time. The package management is very flexibel, but it takes also much more time to install a package because you compile it from the source.

When you mastered the first hard steps then it will become a very flexibel system and much more lightweight than the other distributions, but without any loss of functionality. You can configure any desktop you want with or without eyecandy. for example I have dwm with compton, so I have a very light desktop but even so with composting. Of course you can do this with every other distribution but in gentoo you are kind of forced to build your system. But on the other hand you don't build your own system in a LFS way (at least most of the gentoo users, but of course you can also build it "the real hard way").

all the programs you've mentioned are in the portage tree (afaik) and I think you can setup a game machine just as good as with any other linux-system (or maybe as bad as any other distribution, but I don't know :) )

If you want to focus on security you can install a hardened kernel with or without selinux. Moreover there are other supported systems like RSABC.
If you have a lot of time (as you've said) and are willing to make your hands dirty (but not entirely dirty as you would have to with LFS) and if you want a highly customized system then I definitely recommend gentoo.

Moreover afaik the community is definitely one of the greatest of all linux communities, you can even discuss religion and politics :lol:
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chronicwilly,

Welcome to Gentoo. You will see very few read the friendly manual responses here but when you ask specific questions your respondents may point you at specific parts of the fine documentation to avoid copying and pasting.

Gentoo and all those other distros can all do what you want - its a question of how much effort do you want to put in. The other distros that you list will need less input from you.

Gentoo is different in that you get to make all the choices that binary distros make for you, if you don't get them right ... never mind, change your settings and Gentoo will rebuild your software. With Gentoo, you (your PC) builds everything from the source code, so you get a) Only what you ask for and b) only what you need to support what you asked for.
Conversely, if you don't ask you don't get, so you system is clutter free.

You mention raid and dual booting with Windows. I would install Windows first and when it works, add Gentoo. Windows and Linux can share a raid set but if you really want to do that windows has to dictate the terms.

There is no installer, such as you are used to with binary distros. To see the installer, look in the bathroom mirror. You are the installer. The install related documentation is very good, read it end to end, then follow it. Post here with problems and issues.

One hint ... Use System Rescue CD as your boot media, or some other liveCD. That way you get a GUI to reed the handbook on line, post/read the forums and join #gentoo at irc.freenode.net
System Rescue CD is Gentoo based and is all ready for you to follow the handbook. Other liveCDs need a few extra steps.

Have fun and don't worry about right first time. If you go ahead with Gentoo, you are building your very own distro.

Enjoy your Gentoo
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chronicwilly
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well first id like to say WOW, amazing support in what?? 20 minutes or so? hehe, I can post on others and wait 2 days sometimes to hear a reply.... that being said...
This is exactly what im looking for, The goal, Well this is basically a project for me since i havent anything else to do and am a lonly nerd, So im ready to climb the mountain.. I wanna build a very unique system which people will look at and think im like secret service or something, not literally... U see my point, I dont like anything to much the same as other people, any computer ive used has been customized..Ive learned my way around fedora pretty good, But i cant say ive ever built anything from the source, Mainly I just installed things, played with existing codes, and over configured most of the systems ive used, But theres always 1 or the other issue, and its time I take control!!

I only have 1 pc atm, dual monitors, lets say i run into an uh oh while installing it? and no way to reach toe community? would my cell phone on wifi work lol? and if so where would i ask?
I dont mean to ask so many questions, But i am a noob to gentoo, and I know u guys are a great community :)
I think ive finally found my home, its just guna take lots of remodeling :)
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wswartzendruber
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For what it's worth, I had tried a bunch of other distros and Gentoo was the only one I thought was done right. Debian was a close second. I learned a lot about UNIX-like systems just from installing Gentoo.
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chronicwilly
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wswartzendruber wrote:
For what it's worth, I had tried a bunch of other distros and Gentoo was the only one I thought was done right. Debian was a close second. I learned a lot about UNIX-like systems just from installing Gentoo.


Well ive used fedora for my main for almost 5 months, and I actually tried debian today, I love mate desktop n all, But It just was alien to me and didnt seem worth figuring out.., it not being rpm and all...Also When I hit restart, it only restarted the shell...... not the pc... I major sighed and stopped there...
I mean theres not a whole lot I do with a pc anyway, cept 24/7 music, games n stuff, and researching anonymously..and learning...So I think gentoo is going to be just right for me!!
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wswartzendruber
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cool, but remember to come here and ask for help if you need it. Chances are, what we tell you won't be what you're expecting. Windows and UNIX are fundamentally two different breeds. So you might say, "I want XYZ," but we'll say, "XYZ doesn't really work here, we use ABC instead, and here's why..." Any solution in UNIX is generally going to fit into a larger picture of things.
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chronicwilly
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wswartzendruber wrote:
Cool, but remember to come here and ask for help if you need it. Chances are, what we tell you won't be what you're expecting. Windows and UNIX are fundamentally two different breeds. So you might say, "I want XYZ," but we'll say, "XYZ doesn't really work here, we use ABC instead, and here's why..." Any solution in UNIX is generally going to fit into a larger picture of things.


Well I use linux 99% of the time, Cause TBH I ******* hate everything about windows :) abandoned it 5 months ago, I only use it when I hop onto skyrim, Or like now when my 2nd half of my partition is wiped :)
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 11:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chronicwilly,

There is no need to worry about no way to reach the community.

You build your Gentoo using some other Linux that can reach the internet. If you can build stuff you can reach the community.
Its early days to teach you how to recover when, not if, something goes wrong but you go back to you boot CD and pick up the pieces.

Its actually quite difficult to mess up Gentoo so the only way out is to reinstall. It may take longer to fix it than to reinstall but valuable lessons are learned along the way.
Reinstalls are a bad habit you need to unlearn.

If you use System Rescue CD, it has a web browser, a irc client and a root shell, which is all you need to install Gentoo and stay in touch with the community.

The hard bit is the first bit, which takes you from a bare metal PC to a PC that can boot Gentoo on its own.
Its ready to build more code but booting is all it does.
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chronicwilly
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well i definetly know im supported well, im already in love with community, straight forward replies, nice n quick, very very professional, Not noobs who just give u an outside link to an answer, So thats not an issue, And Im hoping to learn alot so maybe oneday I can put my skills towards university. Im told by many that if I know how to use gentoo fully, I can rul any pc there is, not sure how true this is, But I have 3,5gb to go on my download o.O and i guess ill go from there :)..
LOL I remember when I first Installed Redhat, I Was familiar, At the same time lost in the blackhole... So much configuring, and especially with me trying to figure out the apache, sql, php thing... I think I drank 4 pots of coffie and stayed up 2 days solid figuring it out with much success, So I can just imagine how much time ima Put into this system :) Ill be sure to keep u Informed of my progress, But one things for sure, this is definetly the best community ive seen yet.. GJ.
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 11:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chronicwilly,

3.5Gb ??
What are you downloading?
That sounds like the Gentoo liveDVD. You can install from there but its not needed. The Gentoo minimal CD is well under 100Mb and System Rescue CD is about 350Mb.

Gentoo will download the sources you need as it needs them, the binaries are not used.
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chronicwilly
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NeddySeagoon wrote:
chronicwilly,

3.5Gb ??
What are you downloading?
That sounds like the Gentoo liveDVD. You can install from there but its not needed. The Gentoo minimal CD is well under 100Mb and System Rescue CD is about 350Mb.

Gentoo will download the sources you need as it needs them, the binaries are not used.


OOps D: LOL.......
...
Well I did download the 100mb one, and sorta got lost so thought maybe i had downloaded the wrong one which is why im downloading the live dvd....

Dunno wat am doin with gentoo
Bit I "WILL learn" :D always do

Should i use virtual machine manager first to test the ropes?
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Kollin
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

chronicwilly wrote:

Should i use virtual machine manager first to test the ropes?


What!?
Real men never use ropes! :D
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chronicwilly
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kollin wrote:
chronicwilly wrote:

Should i use virtual machine manager first to test the ropes?


What!?
Real men never use ropes! :D

So I take it thats a grow some balls and schrew vmm :D? and install it like a man?


btw..Lulllz no idea what i really even said there, smoked to much or somethin ;), nah, people in games used to ask me to show em the ropes.... meaning show that noob wtf to do, i guess i used the term in myself... no clue :D:D:D

Lol reading the handbook atm, kinda sucks when i dont have a printer lol..

LMFAO just lulzy
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chronicwilly,

You don't need a printer.

You can use the liveDVD to install, or System Rescue CD.

However you choose to install, you will use a Linux system to install your Gentoo.
Linux systems vary from fully featured like the liveDVD, to very bare, like the Gentoo minimal *.iso.

You can do other things with the Linux you use to install Gentoo, while you install Gentoo.
That includes, read the handbook, browse the forums, join in IRC and view your pr0n collection.
Exactly what you can do depends on the live distro you choose. System Rescue CD allows you to do all but one of the items on the above list.

Oh, System Rescue CD also says "Don't Panic" in large friendly letters on the cover.
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chronicwilly
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NeddySeagoon wrote:
chronicwilly,

You don't need a printer.

You can use the liveDVD to install, or System Rescue CD.

However you choose to install, you will use a Linux system to install your Gentoo.
Linux systems vary from fully featured like the liveDVD, to very bare, like the Gentoo minimal *.iso.

You can do other things with the Linux you use to install Gentoo, while you install Gentoo.
That includes, read the handbook, browse the forums, join in IRC and view your pr0n collection.
Exactly what you can do depends on the live distro you choose. System Rescue CD allows you to do all but one of the items on the above list.

Oh, System Rescue CD also says "Don't Panic" in large friendly letters on the cover.


Well, I know i dont need a printer, Bit ive tried live dvd, and DHCP would not connect to the net, and The system does not read my wifi, So I tried minimal, and Was reading the handbook with my wifi on my cell phone, and my screens about 2.5 inchesx1.5 inches, hense why a printer would be able to print out the handbook, so i have handy all times..been needing one anyway..I could have prolly installed from liveDVD, but could not figure out how to change root passwd. Until i stumbled upon passwd "Enter" and type "root" while using minimal install, does this still apply with liveDVD?

and using minimal after hitting f1, typing gentoo for kernel, then i hit net-setup eth0 and on n on setup it up, then typed /etc/init.d/net.setup start, atleast im pretty sure its what i typed, and failed to connect, so redid net-setup this time using eth1, set it up etc... typed the same thing to start it, and it said ok on the first warning, thingy, other 2 said could not start interface, but when i tried to use links, it would not connect, so its obvious i have to manually setup the net, but nvr done that before. so really no idea what im doing lol. and i do want to try and avoid the livedvd cause, my goal is all about choices and i do want minimal....
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The community and devs are about the best, and that counts for a lot. I'd used Suse, Redhat, Slackware previously. Check my join date to see how long Gentoo has been my primary OS.
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chronicwilly
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bammbamm808 wrote:
The community and devs are about the best, and that counts for a lot. I'd used Suse, Redhat, Slackware previously. Check my join date to see how long Gentoo has been my primary OS.


Well when it comes to stability, and all that, id say redhats been my#1 But I found it harder to setup etc..and I only used it for my wiki, on apache, surfing, and security, But I didnt find it good for usability such as, programs like ardour, wine, etc.... hense why I am currently using fedora, im still havin a hard time figuring out how to install gentoo, But I know its the best system, which is why ima keep on trying, im sure its something really stupid, that takes me hours to figure out, but thats like any, pfft, both centos and redhat, for me took forever to get the hang of, and it was always cause i had made the wrong choices.

oh crap u joined in 2002 , clearly that makes up my mind there. :)
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,
to startup the network manually it is probably the easiest way to just type "dhcpcd eth0" (or eth1, depends on your hadware... if unsure, see which interfaces you have with a simple "ifconfig").

It doesn't matter which live media you use to do the install, as you will have to take the same stage3.tar.bz2 to do the baseinstall anyway! ;-)
The "minimal" in the media-name only tells you that it is a minimal live-environment... This has nothing to do with the install on your disk and how bloated you would like to have it...

An typical gentoo install is like that:
1. boot any linux system (this could be anything with fdisk, mkfs, tar and chroot available... A full blown live media or a minimal one as well as another linux install on another partition)
2. prepare disks
3. untar the stage and portage-tree
4. chroot to install a kernel and a bootloader and do some initial config like hostname, timezone, keyboardlayout, password and so on
5. reboot and have fun

HTH, cheers
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 2:58 am    Post subject: yeah some of us have been around for a while Reply with quote

I lurked around here for a while before setting up a username and contributing back. I think one of my "installs" has been constantly upgraded and cloned from old hardware to new desktop now for about 10 years :D

That's at home. At work I've done desktops, servers, embedded systems and even thin client images with gentoo. That includes stuff that's been hardened and approved for government contract work.

You mentioned games. There's a Gentoo based steam client that I think wraps Valves packaging for Ubuntu. I haven't looked at that yet, but I do play Fallout New Vegas and a bunch of other stuff under Wine (not at work of course).

What you learn here and on the Gentoo wiki will help you elsewhere. I can easily move a Fedora or RHEL installation from a VMWare of KVM guest to a real install or back. One of the crib notes that I carry around with me for doing stuff like that comes from the community wiki.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:16 am    Post subject: Re: yeah some of us have been around for a while Reply with quote

vaxbrat wrote:
I lurked around here for a while before setting up a username and contributing back. I think one of my "installs" has been constantly upgraded and cloned from old hardware to new desktop now for about 10 years :D
Yep. Me too. :D
Code:
ceres ~ # head -n1 /var/log/emerge.log
1077142680: Started emerge on: Feb 18, 2004 22:18:00
(Although this line is from the stage build, my build was shortly thereafter.)

- John
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:58 pm    Post subject: I guess I did lose my original one Reply with quote

Was just poking around and the earliest only goes back to 2008. I vaguely remember something very nasty happening with an orphan cleanup gone awry....
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 9:22 am    Post subject: Re: yeah some of us have been around for a while Reply with quote

John R. Graham wrote:
Code:
ceres ~ # head -n1 /var/log/emerge.log
1077142680: Started emerge on: Feb 18, 2004 22:18:00
(Although this line is from the stage build, my build was shortly thereafter.)

That file must be many megabytes long on your machine.
I usually logrotate it, but unfortunately then genlop/qlop is sometimes not able to guess the merge times (not surprising but annoying :wink: ).
Has anybody ever written a script to logrotate/shorten emerge.log in a "smart" way (e.g. keeping only the last emerges of packages etc?)
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 5:16 pm    Post subject: Re: yeah some of us have been around for a while Reply with quote

mv wrote:
Has anybody ever written a script to logrotate/shorten emerge.log in a "smart" way (e.g. keeping only the last emerges of packages etc?)

I'd like that too: shouldn't be too hard, eh? I can already see an awk script, so I'm sure you have something in mind.. ;-)
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i thought the problem with logrotating emerge.log had something to do with portage itself
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