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eeyrjmr
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 2:16 pm    Post subject: [Can't] cycling gives off more CO2 Reply with quote

Typical Republican't and their catchphrase-like ability to confirm their stupidity..

Ed Orcutt wants to tax cycling, ok he is a politician and is trying to raise money.

The reasoning however is just baffling
Starting with Orcutt does not feel bicycling is environmentally friendly and finishing with his clarification
Quote:

You would be giving off more CO2 if you are riding a bike than driving in a car
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Go go fox science!
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Technically, he is correct - but so, so wrong.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

when you fire a gun, you're expelling a ton of bad gases, so we need to repeal the second amendment, or at least tax it in the name of the environment.

when you speak, or go to church you're producing CO2... we need to repeal the first amendment too. you shouldn't be allowed to speak unless you pay the government money for the damage you're causing to the earth.

also, when you come to court to defend yourself against charges, you're expelling greenhouse gases regardless of how you get there, so we should repeal the 4th, 5th, and 8th amendments. you shouldn't have a trial unless you pay to save the environment.

THE ENDS JUSTIFY THE MEANS! GO GREEN GO GREEN!
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2013 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Who is "Ed Orcutt"? Never heard of him.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 1:33 am    Post subject: Re: [Can't] cycling gives off more CO2 Reply with quote

eeyrjmr wrote:
Typical Republican't and their catchphrase-like ability to confirm their stupidity..
Stupidity surpassed without effort by Democrats.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 1:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What gas comes out of your ass? I don't think it is CO2.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

notageek wrote:
What gas comes out of your ass? I don't think it is CO2.

It's called "fart gas". It's a mixture of stuff, including carbon-dioxide, swallowed air, methane, hydrogen, and teeny tiny particles of what Texans call "sheeeiiiiiiiit".
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 2:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

How much CO2?
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

notageek wrote:
How much CO2?

It depends, but just about everything in there except the swallowed air is a greenhouse gas, so you can pretty much count farts as a greenhouse gas. This is another compelling reason to eliminate the less-capable 30% or so of humanity.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 2:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So... impose carbon tax on beans and stuff that make you fart after you eat them.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 2:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcgruff wrote:
Technically, he is correct - but so, so wrong.
Elaborate if you would, please.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exercising harder means you'll eat more. Since agriculture depends heavily on oil, that means increased fossil fuel consumption.

However, the amounts involved are negligible. Also, vastly more CO2 emissions would be saved by abandoning the car in favour of a bike.

Ed Idiot is an Orcutt.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exercise in any form should be taxed, because it causes increased liberation of carbon dioxide. People sitting idle and minimizing their level of activity produce less carbon dioxide (far less).

It's almost impossible to effectively regulate activity, but we can regulate food, which is the actual fuel that humans convert into energy, carbon dioxide, and other waste products. So, the practical answer here is to ration food.

By outlawing certain food (most notably beans, eggs, and crossiferous vegetables), by seriously rationing food, along with all other forms of energy consumption by each individual, and inflicting severe punishiment on violators (e.g., having rations reduced and being placed in stocks in village square), we can help people to do what's good for themselves, and reduce the amount of carbon they liberate from its natural solid form (where it's nice and safe) and instead put into the atmosphere, where it has no business being.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

:lol:
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's not negligible at all. Exercise throws the body into hyperdrive, increasing by a factor of x5 to x8 the metabolic rate (and amount of carbon spewed).

Now, a typical person spews about as much carbon in a day as a gasoline-burning car gives off in only three miles. So let's say you live 9 miles from work. If you were to cycle there and home, you'd probably double or triple your metabolic rate for the day (spewing three man-days worth of carbon). But if you drive there and back, your car gives off six man-days' worth of carbon.

So, clearly, cycling is twice as green as driving a car. Just in terms of fuel conversion. It also uses a lot more materials (if you don't count the need to construct special "bike fag lanes" and "bike fag paths" everywhere).

However, comma, it's only about 1/2 as harmful as driving. So he's not really too far out in la-la land to be saying it should be taxed (or that food should be taxed, or rationed). The logic is precisely the same.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's not negligible at all. Exercise throws the body into hyperdrive, increasing by a factor of x5 to x8 the metabolic rate (and amount of carbon spewed).

Now, a typical person spews about as much carbon in a day as a gasoline-burning car gives off in only three miles. So let's say you live 9 miles from work. If you were to cycle there and home, you'd probably double or triple your metabolic rate for the day (spewing three man-days worth of carbon). But if you drive there and back, your car gives off six man-days' worth of carbon.

So, clearly, cycling is twice as green as driving a car. Just in terms of fuel conversion. It also uses a lot more materials (if you don't count the need to construct special "bike fag lanes" and "bike fag paths" everywhere).

However, it's about 1/2 as harmful as driving, which is far from "negligible". So he's not really too far out in la-la land to be saying it should be taxed (or that food should be taxed, or rationed). The logic is precisely the same.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 10:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
It's not negligible at all. Exercise throws the body into hyperdrive, increasing by a factor of x5 to x8 the metabolic rate (and amount of carbon spewed).

Now, a typical person spews about as much carbon in a day as a gasoline-burning car gives off in only three miles. So let's say you live 9 miles from work. If you were to cycle there and home, you'd probably double or triple your metabolic rate for the day (spewing three man-days worth of carbon). But if you drive there and back, your car gives off six man-days' worth of carbon.

So, clearly, cycling is twice as green as driving a car. Just in terms of fuel conversion. It also uses a lot more materials (if you don't count the need to construct special "bike fag lanes" and "bike fag paths" everywhere).

However, it's about 1/2 as harmful as driving, which is far from "negligible". So he's not really too far out in la-la land to be saying it should be taxed (or that food should be taxed, or rationed). The logic is precisely the same.


that of course doesn't take into account the transport of fuel. Oil needs to be shipped from various parts of the world to other parts and put into the cars. Also with food. The computation should include that. Making the car too.

but I am not sure your computation is solid. You say that cycling that 9 miles will double or triple your rate for the day. Assuming that a 9 mile ride takes about an hour, and you are spewing 5 times the CO2 for that hour, you are taking 23 X base + 1 x base x 5 = 29 (base = rest spew/hour). Let's even change that 5 times spew to 10 times spew. you are now 33 x base, still well under twice.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 12:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
Who is "Ed Orcutt"? Never heard of him.
Google says he's a member of the Washington State House of Representatives.

He's a politician in a group that doesn't matter, (because the Republicans don't control the House) in a legislative body that doesn't matter, (because they're trumped by the Washington State Senate) in a state that doesn't matter. (because it's fucking Washington State)

The hilarious bit about all of this is that the guy is totally inconsequential. He spouted some righty crazy shit, all the lefty crazies got up in arms about it, and now everyone's talking about him. All you lefty crazies legitimized his crazy, because instead of being ignored as being totally irrelevant, people are talking about him as if what he says fucking matters. Which is what he wanted, when he introduced legislation which doesn't have a snowball's chance in hell of passing which demonized a bunch of people who were never going to vote for him in the first place.

It's like North Korea and their nukes. They don't want nukes, they don't want a nuclear war, they just want the US to give them more money. Introducing absurd legislation is a significant part of inconsequential politicians' re-election campaigns. It's free press.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcgruff wrote:
Exercising harder means you'll eat more. Since agriculture depends heavily on oil, that means increased fossil fuel consumption.

However, the amounts involved are negligible. Also, vastly more CO2 emissions would be saved by abandoning the car in favour of a bike.
Don't forget the additional emissions from automobiles having to decelerate and accelerate while navigating around cyclists. Plus having to do loops to repeatedly drive "too close" to the SOBs. Their expressions are priceless, so it's worth it.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 12:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
It's not negligible at all. Exercise throws the body into hyperdrive, increasing by a factor of x5 to x8 the metabolic rate (and amount of carbon spewed).

Now, a typical person spews about as much carbon in a day as a gasoline-burning car gives off in only three miles. So let's say you live 9 miles from work. If you were to cycle there and home, you'd probably double or triple your metabolic rate for the day (spewing three man-days worth of carbon). But if you drive there and back, your car gives off six man-days' worth of carbon.

So, clearly, cycling is twice as green as driving a car. Just in terms of fuel conversion. It also uses a lot more materials (if you don't count the need to construct special "bike fag lanes" and "bike fag paths" everywhere).

However, it's about 1/2 as harmful as driving, which is far from "negligible". So he's not really too far out in la-la land to be saying it should be taxed (or that food should be taxed, or rationed). The logic is precisely the same.


that of course doesn't take into account the transport of fuel. Oil needs to be shipped from various parts of the world to other parts and put into the cars. Also with food. The computation should include that. Making the car too.

but I am not sure your computation is solid. You say that cycling that 9 miles will double or triple your rate for the day. Assuming that a 9 mile ride takes about an hour, and you are spewing 5 times the CO2 for that hour, you are taking 23 X base + 1 x base x 5 = 29 (base = rest spew/hour). Let's even change that 5 times spew to 10 times spew. you are now 33 x base, still well under twice.

Exercise elevates your metabolism for a long time after you finish. I'm sure you know this, but just didn't think of it. I think a doubling of the average daily metabolic rate is, if anything, a very conservative estimate for cycling 18 miles a day.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 12:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pigeon768 wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
Who is "Ed Orcutt"? Never heard of him.
Google says he's a member of the Washington State House of Representatives.

He's a politician in a group that doesn't matter, (because the Republicans don't control the House) in a legislative body that doesn't matter, (because they're trumped by the Washington State Senate) in a state that doesn't matter. (because it's fucking Washington State)

The hilarious bit about all of this is that the guy is totally inconsequential. He spouted some righty crazy shit, all the lefty crazies got up in arms about it, and now everyone's talking about him. All you lefty crazies legitimized his crazy, because instead of being ignored as being totally irrelevant, people are talking about him as if what he says fucking matters. Which is what he wanted, when he introduced legislation which doesn't have a snowball's chance in hell of passing which demonized a bunch of people who were never going to vote for him in the first place.

It's like North Korea and their nukes. They don't want nukes, they don't want a nuclear war, they just want the US to give them more money. Introducing absurd legislation is a significant part of inconsequential politicians' re-election campaigns. It's free press.

I don't think he spouted crazy shit. I think he was being sarcastic. I think he was presenting an extreme case of the logic being used by others who advocate taxing various things that liberate carbon. This is a common method of pointing out flawed logic.

He might have been safer if he had instead said, "By that same logic, we should blah blah blah....", but then the trolling value would have been lost.

I offer this speculation on his motivation without knowing anything about the guy. He might be dipshit, and maybe he actually meant it. :lol:
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 4:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In my experience, it's always safe to assume a politician is a dipshit.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 4:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
I don't think he spouted crazy shit.
For me, the burden of proof is on Ed. The GOP and science don't usually mix well together.
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