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BoneKracker
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 Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 3:50 am Post subject: Italy To Be Next Greece, Taking Eurozone Down With It |
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Italian majority tells Germans to fuck off (until it's time to come bail them out too).
| Quote: | Italy halts austerity plan leaving EU in turmoil
Three years of German-led austerity and budget cuts aimed at saving the euro and retooling the European economy was left facing one of its biggest challenges as Italian voters' rejection of spending cuts and tax rises opened up a stark new fissure in European politics.
The governing stalemate in Rome and the vote in the general election – by a factor of three to two – against the austerity policies pursued by Italy's humiliated caretaker prime minister, Mario Monti, meant that the spending cuts and tax rises dictated by the eurozone would grind to a halt, risking a re-eruption of the euro crisis after six months of relative stability.
Fears that the deadlock will lengthen Italy's near two-year recession and spill over into the rest of the eurozone hit markets across Europe. The Italian banking sector fell 7% in value, dragging the main MIB stock market index 4% lower.
The market turmoil in Milan spread to Germany, France and the UK, with domestic banks among the biggest fallers. Deutsche Bank saw almost 5% knocked off its value, while Barclays suffered a 4% decline. The FTSE 100 fell 1.4%. The German Dax slumped more than 2% and the Paris Cac was down 2.75%. |
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/feb/26/italy-election-austerity-eurozone-turmoil
The French are watching this and saying, "See?! We don't need no stinking spending cuts!" Meanwhile Obama has his entire cabinet out peddling the same idea (and that any such discipline will mean the end of the world).
We're all going down the toilet.
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energyman76b
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:04 am Post subject: |
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oh wow 3% - and that is a 'turmoil'.
But ok - if they want to live from others people money, they can leave the EURO and EU any time. Less beggars, less money wasted on subs for their farmers. I am all in favour...
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BoneKracker
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:23 am Post subject: |
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Germans should tell the rest of the EU to fuck off. Either than or take over, once and for all (we'll tell Britain to stay out of it this time).
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Dr.Willy
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:43 am Post subject: |
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| BoneKracker wrote: | | Germans should tell the rest of the EU to fuck off. |
Are you crazy? That's the last thing we could possibly want. |
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juniper
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| Dr.Willy wrote: | | BoneKracker wrote: | | Germans should tell the rest of the EU to fuck off. |
Are you crazy? That's the last thing we could possibly want. |
Germany has an export economy. It generally is bad policy to tell your customers to fuck off. |
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John-Boy
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:00 pm Post subject: |
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And the contagion - a fiscal black death if you will - spreads.
Actually that started in the south IIRC.
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notageek
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:18 pm Post subject: |
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Let me get my cheque book, I might buy Fiat. The company.
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erm67
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:23 pm Post subject: |
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Well actually things might not be so bad for Italy, since actually the left got a lot seat, unfortunately a good share of them went to the extreme left. Assuming that an agreement can be reached between them, and since their programs are quite similar it could happen, the austerity will continue, everybody wants to lower the debt, but savings will come from other directions, for example buy less F35, less U212 submarines, spend less for military missions abroad ..... they obtained already that Sicily revoke the permission to build the MUOS that is what worries most people abroad I think 
Actually it looks like an agreement could be reached provided the govmt commits itself to cut the money to politicians, political parties, and newspapers and introduce Basic income guarantee like in many EU countries.
It could be really an opportunity to change things for better, hopefully the extreme left wont wast (again) an opportunity.
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energyman76b
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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| juniper wrote: | | Dr.Willy wrote: | | BoneKracker wrote: | | Germans should tell the rest of the EU to fuck off. |
Are you crazy? That's the last thing we could possibly want. |
Germany has an export economy. It generally is bad policy to tell your customers to fuck off. |
only as long as the customers are paying.
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| AidanJT wrote: |
Libertardian denial of reality is wholly unimpressive and unconvincing, and simply serves to demonstrate what a bunch of delusional fools they all are.
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Satan's got perfectly toned abs and rocks a c-cup. |
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John-Boy
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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| erm67 wrote: | | Well actually things might not be so bad for Italy |
I do hope so, we need some good news on the economic front, it's been my experience in life,
that there isn't any easy way - or if there is it's normally a damn sight harder than the hard way.
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erm67
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:18 pm Post subject: |
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| John-Boy wrote: | | erm67 wrote: | | Well actually things might not be so bad for Italy |
I do hope so, we need some good news on the economic front, it's been my experience in life,
that there isn't any easy way - or if there is it's normally a damn sight harder than the hard way. |
Good news for Italy are not necessarily good news everywhere
A greek scenario with a second round of voting following shortly is still an option, it fixed the extremists problem there. That would be bad since some of the things they propose aren't so bad, I still have some doubts m5s will be able to do anything, many of them cynically say let's vote again we will get even more votes, who cares about the people in need ...
A few week ago there was a spate of strange armed robberies around here, a lone man robbed bars and shops, making <1000€ each time and told the victims every time that he was sorry. When the police finally got him they discovered he was the owner of a small building company full of debts with 3 small children at home and absolutely no criminal record. Yeah here being unemployed is harder than in other parts of the EU, probably having some sort of welfare for people really unemployed and in need could be good for Italian society as a whole. Too bad we depend on Grillo to hope for something like that to happen.
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BoneKracker
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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| juniper wrote: | | Dr.Willy wrote: | | BoneKracker wrote: | | Germans should tell the rest of the EU to fuck off. |
Are you crazy? That's the last thing we could possibly want. |
Germany has an export economy. It generally is bad policy to tell your customers to fuck off. |
Okay, then Germany should ensure they come out of the ongoing and future bailouts owning the first-born children (metaphorically speaking) of PIIGS and friends.
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Dr.Willy
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:12 am Post subject: |
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| BoneKracker wrote: | | Okay, then Germany should ensure they come out of the ongoing and future bailouts owning the first-born children (metaphorically speaking) of PIIGS and friends. |
Hehe, BK you're a bad counselor 
No seriously.
I mean, we are already taking their first-borns. Literally.
Youth-unemployment in Spain is what, 50%? There's job to be had in Germany. Connect the dots.  |
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wildhorse
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:21 am Post subject: |
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| juniper wrote: | | Dr.Willy wrote: | | BoneKracker wrote: | | Germans should tell the rest of the EU to fuck off. |
Are you crazy? That's the last thing we could possibly want. |
Germany has an export economy. It generally is bad policy to tell your customers to fuck off. |
The attitude to tell others to fuck off comes from Nazi states. Of course Germany does not want to do that. But it's an attitude that is still very much alive elsewhere. |
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BoneKracker
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:30 am Post subject: |
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| Dr.Willy wrote: | | BoneKracker wrote: | | Okay, then Germany should ensure they come out of the ongoing and future bailouts owning the first-born children (metaphorically speaking) of PIIGS and friends. |
Hehe, BK you're a bad counselor
No seriously.
I mean, we are already taking their first-borns. Literally.
Youth-unemployment in Spain is what, 50%? There's job to be had in Germany. Connect the dots. |
I read that all the most attractive Spanish women are studying German, then moving to Germany to marry German men. I suppose that's one type of taking of the first-born.
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erm67
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:27 am Post subject: |
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| BoneKracker wrote: | | Dr.Willy wrote: | | BoneKracker wrote: | | Okay, then Germany should ensure they come out of the ongoing and future bailouts owning the first-born children (metaphorically speaking) of PIIGS and friends. |
Hehe, BK you're a bad counselor
No seriously.
I mean, we are already taking their first-borns. Literally.
Youth-unemployment in Spain is what, 50%? There's job to be had in Germany. Connect the dots. |
I read that all the most attractive Spanish women are studying German, then moving to Germany to marry German men. I suppose that's one type of taking of the first-born. |
That is what the ugliest Spanish woman do, the most attractive of them can make enough money at home since prostitution is legal in Spain
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BoneKracker
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:45 am Post subject: |
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There is no faster way to make money than to marry someone who has it. It's the highest form of prostitution.
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erm67
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:04 am Post subject: |
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| BoneKracker wrote: | | There is no faster way to make money than to marry someone who has it. It's the highest form of prostitution. |
Divorce changed a lot things ... it is not so easy as it was to marry someone for the money and actually get the money....
that is exactly the kind of families that were destroyed by divorce laws
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BoneKracker
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:13 am Post subject: |
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| erm67 wrote: | | BoneKracker wrote: | | There is no faster way to make money than to marry someone who has it. It's the highest form of prostitution. |
Divorce changed a lot things ... it is not so easy as it was to marry someone for the money and actually get the money....
that is exactly the kind of families that were destroyed by divorce laws |
A woman can't get all the money, but they can do far better than a whore. Al a woman needs to do is keep a man happy for a few years and she's got him by the financial balls. The general rule is half the assets (or whatever has been agreed in a prenuptial document), plus support "in the style to which she has become accustomed" forever or until she re-marries.
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mcgruff
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:16 am Post subject: Re: Italy To Be Next Greece, Taking Eurozone Down With It |
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| BoneKracker wrote: | | The French are watching this and saying, "See?! We don't need no stinking spending cuts!" Meanwhile Obama has his entire cabinet out peddling the same idea (and that any such discipline will mean the end of the world) |
Austerity stoopid. Look at the UK.
"We must initiate savage austerity measures to keep our AAA rating and reduce the deficit."
What actually happened? Austerity choked off demand, shrunk the economy, increased the deficit and lost the UK its AAA rating.
Oops.
If you want to pay off debts, first you need to earn some money to pay the debts.
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BoneKracker
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:19 am Post subject: |
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Which you earn by going further into debt? 
You sound like exactly like somebody with a gambling addiction: "C'mon, homes. Juss gimme a C-note, dass awl I need; I gots to git my money back! I pay you right afta!"
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mcgruff
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 4:57 am Post subject: |
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I think you need to stop and think how real economies work.
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John-Boy
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 5:10 am Post subject: |
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| BoneKracker wrote: | | You sound like exactly like somebody with a gambling addiction: |
It's typical Labour response, keep spending. When it runs out, mug those who've actually worked
or borrow.
I'm afraid there is no money
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mcgruff
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 5:31 am Post subject: |
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The fact remains that the UK lost its AAA rating and the deficit has increased because of an entirely predictable failure of austerity. If you don't earn any money you can't pay off your debts.
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John-Boy
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 5:42 am Post subject: |
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| mcgruff wrote: | | If you don't earn any money you can't pay off your debts. |
And so the borrowing that Gordon Brown kept pushing would have left us with
even higher debit
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