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Dylan27
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Joined: 22 Feb 2013
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 Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:43 am Post subject: What to do to reduce unemployemnt? |
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| The world unemployment rates rises day by day what you thing which factor that our government control to overcome on unemployment.Even though the government adding new jobs but still the unemployment rates are high. |
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John-Boy
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:48 am Post subject: |
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Enforced work camps for long term unemployed.
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notageek
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:53 am Post subject: |
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| John-Boy wrote: | | Enforced work camps for long term unemployed. |
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aidanjt
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 8:58 am Post subject: |
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| notageek wrote: | | John-Boy wrote: | | Enforced work camps for long term unemployed. |
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You laugh, but it's actually not far off from the right wing sentiment in England. They already have workfare programmes.
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| juniper wrote: | | you experience political reality dilation when travelling at american political speeds. it's in einstein's formulas. it's not their fault. |
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Muso
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Location: The Holy city of Honolulu
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:15 am Post subject: |
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| aidanjt wrote: | | notageek wrote: | | John-Boy wrote: | | Enforced work camps for long term unemployed. |
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You laugh, but it's actually not far off from the right wing sentiment in England. They already have workfare programmes. |
Let's examine this for a second. For the welfare leaches to continue to suckle from the government teat, they would have to actually provide some sort of work. What's wrong with that? The condition on receiving money stolen from others by force is to do a little bit to repay them.
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juniper
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Joined: 22 Oct 2004
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:36 am Post subject: |
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| Muso wrote: | | aidanjt wrote: | | notageek wrote: | | John-Boy wrote: | | Enforced work camps for long term unemployed. |
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You laugh, but it's actually not far off from the right wing sentiment in England. They already have workfare programmes. |
Let's examine this for a second. For the welfare leaches to continue to suckle from the government teat, they would have to actually provide some sort of work. What's wrong with that? The condition on receiving money stolen from others by force is to do a little bit to repay them. |
Since you asked...
1) if they are forced to work, they can't look for work.
2) how will it work? Given that welfare isn't generous (say below minimum wage), should they get a top up to minimum wage? Otherwise, isn't it really close to exploitation?
3) if the job needs to be done, the govt should hire people to do it (not use prison labour).
4) do you really want the govt to have an incentive to put people in prison (so they have a cheap source of labour?)?
the list goes on and on... As you are well aware, many people on welfare are just victims of a bad economy. Witness the sharp rise of people on dole since the economic downturn. Previously, those people had jobs.
If you want people off welfare rolls, you probably want to do other things, like make it profitable to work, but a time limit on collecting benefits (it is supposed to be a stop gap measure, not a long term lifestyle. After a certain period, they should be required to retrain). etc etc. |
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aidanjt
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:42 am Post subject: |
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| Muso wrote: | | Let's examine this for a second. For the welfare leaches to continue to suckle from the government teat, they would have to actually provide some sort of work. What's wrong with that? The condition on receiving money stolen from others by force is to do a little bit to repay them. |
Thanks for proving my point. If there's work to be done then there's an employment opportunity, eliminating employment opportunities with free government-coerced labour is economically ruinous. Consumption of the very well funded national insurance pool we can deal with, unemployment going through the roof, we can't.
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| juniper wrote: | | you experience political reality dilation when travelling at american political speeds. it's in einstein's formulas. it's not their fault. |
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energyman76b
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:48 am Post subject: |
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forced work has not worked in the past - why should it work now?
answer: it doesn't - but it is another way for the top 1% to make money of the poor.
What does work?
Easy: increase taxes for the rich, make it impossible for corporations to dodge taxes, lower taxes for small and medium incomes.
This increases the mass purchasing power, which leads automatically to a higher demand and such to more jobs.
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| AidanJT wrote: |
Libertardian denial of reality is wholly unimpressive and unconvincing, and simply serves to demonstrate what a bunch of delusional fools they all are.
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juniper
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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| aidanjt wrote: | | Muso wrote: | | Let's examine this for a second. For the welfare leaches to continue to suckle from the government teat, they would have to actually provide some sort of work. What's wrong with that? The condition on receiving money stolen from others by force is to do a little bit to repay them. |
Thanks for proving my point. If there's work to be done then there's an employment opportunity, eliminating employment opportunities with free government-coerced labour is economically ruinous. Consumption of the very well funded national insurance pool we can deal with, unemployment going through the roof, we can't. |
the right is more interested in punishing a lot of people, hoping to hit all the free loaders, than come up with a meaningful economic policy. |
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mcgruff
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Joined: 28 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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It's a sexual thing. Nothing to do with economics. Punishing "scum", and executing "scum", makes them hard.
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John-Boy
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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| juniper wrote: | | 1) if they are forced to work, they can't look for work. |
That is possible, plenty of people manage it.
| juniper wrote: | | Otherwise, isn't it really close to exploitation? |
No it's making the long term unemployed realise that it's a safety net and not a meal ticket.
| juniper wrote: | | if the job needs to be done, the govt should hire people to do it |
Yes - the long term unemployed. They should welcome the chance to work - it looks
good on the CV, gets you back into the habit of working and offers a chance to reskill.
It's not sing-song.
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Muso
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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| energyman76b wrote: | | forced work has not worked in the past - why should it work now? |
Nobody is forcing them to act like leaches.
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juniper
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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| John-Boy wrote: | | juniper wrote: | | 1) if they are forced to work, they can't look for work. |
That is possible, plenty of people manage it.
| juniper wrote: | | Otherwise, isn't it really close to exploitation? |
No it's making the long term unemployed realise that it's a safety net and not a meal ticket.
| juniper wrote: | | if the job needs to be done, the govt should hire people to do it |
Yes - the long term unemployed. They should welcome the chance to work - it looks
good on the CV, gets you back into the habit of working and offers a chance to reskill.
It's not sing-song. |
curious. If the state needs those jobs done, why not advertise them and get the best applicants? |
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jonnevers
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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| producing soylent green could reduce unemployment. |
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John-Boy
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:06 pm Post subject: |
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| juniper wrote: | | curious. If the state needs those jobs done, why not advertise them and get the best applicants? |
There's a plentiful resource available, use it.
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juniper
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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To rephrase, you are suggesting that the state take advantage of the high unemployment and pay people the low wages afforded by benefits for work?
Perhaps the state should enforce policies that raise unemployment then?
I don't understand what you have against retraining. Say, after time X, people are asked to retrain to keep benefits. |
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John-Boy
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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| juniper wrote: | | To rephrase, you are suggesting that the state take advantage of the high unemployment and pay people the low wages afforded by benefits for work? |
No, I'm suggesting that people work for receipt of long term benefits.
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mcgruff
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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That could be an excellent idea: a guaranteed, minimum-wage (or higher) job for everyone who has been unemployed for a certain amount of time - provided there is still an element of choice of different types of jobs to suit different people's skills and needs.
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Muso
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:39 pm Post subject: |
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Streets can always be cleaned.
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energyman76b
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Muso wrote: | | energyman76b wrote: | | forced work has not worked in the past - why should it work now? |
Nobody is forcing them to act like leaches. |
are you talking about the top 1%?
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| AidanJT wrote: |
Libertardian denial of reality is wholly unimpressive and unconvincing, and simply serves to demonstrate what a bunch of delusional fools they all are.
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Satan's got perfectly toned abs and rocks a c-cup. |
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juniper
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Muso wrote: | | Streets can always be cleaned. |
then people should be hired to do that. |
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aidanjt
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Muso wrote: | | Streets can always be cleaned. |
If the streets need cleaned then the local council authority should employ workers to do so, that's precisely what they're paid state budget stipends and local household/business tax rates for.
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| juniper wrote: | | you experience political reality dilation when travelling at american political speeds. it's in einstein's formulas. it's not their fault. |
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mcgruff
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:48 pm Post subject: |
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Paying them a fair wage is not sufficiently arousing. There must be an element of punishment. We want to see real suffering and wails of despair as their spirits are crushed.
Ohhh uuuhh yeah.
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Muso
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:53 pm Post subject: |
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| aidanjt wrote: | | Muso wrote: | | Streets can always be cleaned. |
If the streets need cleaned then the local council authority should employ workers to do so |
They're already paying the leaches. Make them earn it like everyone else.
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aidanjt
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| Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:55 pm Post subject: |
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| John-Boy wrote: | | juniper wrote: | | To rephrase, you are suggesting that the state take advantage of the high unemployment and pay people the low wages afforded by benefits for work? |
No, I'm suggesting that people work for receipt of long term benefits. |
We already have a system in place for that, it's called employment. We should be encouraging employment, not assaulting the poor with ridiculous, defamatory and dangerous nonsense for the crime of being born unprivileged in an economy still being run by the same privileged imbeciles who trashed it almost a decade ago.
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| juniper wrote: | | you experience political reality dilation when travelling at american political speeds. it's in einstein's formulas. it's not their fault. |
Last edited by aidanjt on Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:59 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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