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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 2:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it's pretty much humane as long s you kill it in the first trimester of the pregnancy. Eating it? That's a matter of personal values. I suppose it's okay as long as a market doesn't develop for abortion shishkabab or something.
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LoTeK
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 2:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I think it's pretty much humane as long s you kill it in the first trimester of the pregnancy
:lol: yes.

Quote:
Eating it? That's a matter of personal values

So for you killing a chicken and eating one are different things?
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 3:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, I'm saying (as a joke) that, according to society, killing and eating a baby are very different things morally, which seems odd since we don't differentiate much between the morality of killing and eating most other things.

Think of the wasted gastronomical opportunities: fetus al dente marinara; fetuskabob; fetus parmagiano sur linguine avec du buerre lemon...
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As a species, we tend to not be cannibalistic, so it seems appropriate that we wouldn't eat ourselves, at any stage of development. If we were, but didn't eat fetus, then you'd have a point.
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LoTeK
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
As a species, we tend to not be cannibalistic, so it seems appropriate that we wouldn't eat ourselves, at any stage of development. If we were, but didn't eat fetus, then you'd have a point.

yes and its good that way, but I think one can feed on other humans. so if a cannibal asks "why should I stop eating babys"? then all you can say is: "because it's fucking sick".

But if the topic is on animal rights everyone expects serious, thoughtful, and sophisticated arguments otherwise one appears as "unscientific".

So I consider the development stage of our society rather low, because there is a lot of "scientific" acting in the sense that one has to justify nearly everything one does and, for example, if someone is in court he will be teared apart if he contradicts himself but the foundations of the society are itself very contradictory.
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But, as we know quite well because it's the moral cornerstone of our "right to choose" (i.e. abortion rights), fetuses are not human beings. So what's the issue?

I personally think we should grant life forms "rights" proportional to their sentience (with additional consideration for our dependence on them). An ape, elephant, whale, dolphin, pig, dog, or horse should be more protected than a rabbit, mouse, chicken, snake, fish, or shrimp, which should be more protected than a jellyfish, krill, sea cucumber, kelp, tree, bush, or algae. But in that context, a fetus ranks somewhere in there between a sea cucumber and a mouse, depending on its stage of development.

So, if we give fetuses no credit for being human based on the fact that, unmolested, they will become human, then I don't see any rationality in avoiding their use as a food source.
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think we have a misunderstanding here:
My post meant actual babys (not fetuses, but those things that cry :) ). But yes, if you meant only fetuses then there is no issue.

Quote:
I personally think we should grant life forms "rights" proportional to their sentience (with additional consideration for our dependence on them). An ape, elephant, whale, dolphin, pig, dog, or horse should be more protected than a rabbit, mouse, chicken, snake, fish, or shrimp, which should be more protected than a jellyfish, krill, sea cucumber, kelp, tree, bush, or algae. But in that context, a fetus ranks somewhere in there between a sea cucumber and a mouse, depending on its stage of development.


On one hand I agree because a human (in the sense like a nice guy/woman, I want to highlight that I don't count "evil" people to the notion "human" :) ) has a higher conscious and therefore he can also feel more pain or he can miss a dead friend etc. A dog has a higher conscious than a chicken (I would put the rabbit to the dogs) etc, but on the other hand its a bit to artificial, very typical for humans in the sense that they must judge and classify everything (which is sometimes good, sometimes bad).

Quote:
So, if we give fetuses no credit for being human based on the fact that, unmolested, they will become human, then I don't see any rationality in avoiding their use as a food source.

I think it would be way better to use them as labor object to get new knowledge that can help people and animals likewise... but eating them? well not me..!
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erm67
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 9:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LoTeK wrote:

Quote:
So, if we give fetuses no credit for being human based on the fact that, unmolested, they will become human, then I don't see any rationality in avoiding their use as a food source.

I think it would be way better to use them as labor object to get new knowledge that can help people and animals likewise... but eating them? well not me..!


1 2 3

So if I understand correctly of those 3 babies 2 are on your kill list and only 1 in your eat list. Is that ranking based on how much you value them?
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Last edited by erm67 on Sun Jan 27, 2013 9:21 pm; edited 1 time in total
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LoTeK
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 9:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

well I don't exactly recognize the first, but it seems to be some beans, so therefore it would be on my eat list. The second and third would neither be on my kill- or eat-list
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 6:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LoTeK wrote:
I think we have a misunderstanding here:
My post meant actual babys (not fetuses, but those things that cry :) ). But yes, if you meant only fetuses then there is no issue.

Okay, so I guess the only remaining questions then are:

a. Would you like your fetus regular or extra crispy?

b. Do you want French fries with that?
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LoTeK
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

don't you call it "freedom fries" these days? :P
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LoTeK wrote:
don't you call it "freedom fries" these days? :P

That only lasted a little while. The French are our friends. They gave us the Statue of Liberty. We just wish they'd use deodorant.
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