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BonezTheGoon
Bodhisattva
Joined: 14 Jun 2002
Posts: 1376
Location: Albuquerque, NM -- birthplace of Microsoft and Gentoo
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 Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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| pjp wrote: | | The question is, which country's currency is safest from our collapse. I've been hording money, and I'm thinking it might be time to divest myself of a majority of Franklins. |
In a financial collapse any fiat currency is at risk, objects with intrinsic value are the safest "investment" for the kind of times you are talking about.
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| pjp wrote: | | The greater evil is voting for the "lesser evil." |
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erm67
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 01 Nov 2005
Posts: 130
Location: somewhere in Berlusconia.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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| BonezTheGoon wrote: | | pjp wrote: | | The question is, which country's currency is safest from our collapse. I've been hording money, and I'm thinking it might be time to divest myself of a majority of Franklins. |
In a financial collapse any fiat currency is at risk, objects with intrinsic value are the safest "investment" for the kind of times you are talking about. |
Like real estate for example .....
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Dr.Willy
Apprentice
Joined: 15 Jul 2007
Posts: 296
Location: NRW, Germany
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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| erm67 wrote: | | BonezTheGoon wrote: | | pjp wrote: | | The question is, which country's currency is safest from our collapse. I've been hording money, and I'm thinking it might be time to divest myself of a majority of Franklins. |
In a financial collapse any fiat currency is at risk, objects with intrinsic value are the safest "investment" for the kind of times you are talking about. |
Like real estate for example ..... |
Weapons and real estate.
For lesser forms of 'crisis' better options might be available. |
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BoneKracker
Veteran
Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 1499
Location: U.S.A.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:24 pm Post subject: |
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Weapons and ammunition.
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Dr.Willy
Apprentice
Joined: 15 Jul 2007
Posts: 296
Location: NRW, Germany
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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| BoneKracker wrote: | | Weapons and ammunition. |
Pff, Ammunition.
BRING ME MY AXE |
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pjp
Administrator
Joined: 16 Apr 2002
Posts: 16033
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 11:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Dr.Willy wrote: | | BoneKracker wrote: | | Weapons and ammunition. |
Pff, Ammunition.
BRING ME MY AXE |
Axe, or tommahawk? :D
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Ahenobarbi
Developer
Joined: 02 Apr 2009
Posts: 336
Location: Warsaw, PL
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| Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:33 am Post subject: |
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| BonezTheGoon wrote: | | pjp wrote: | | The question is, which country's currency is safest from our collapse. I've been hording money, and I'm thinking it might be time to divest myself of a majority of Franklins. |
In a financial collapse any fiat currency is at risk, objects with intrinsic value are the safest "investment" for the kind of times you are talking about. |
So gold, booze and cigarets? |
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BoneKracker
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Joined: 14 Mar 2006
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Location: U.S.A.
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| Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:55 am Post subject: |
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And canned food. Most valuable of all is an abandoned mine shaft, though. Gotta have a mine shaft.
But without guns and ammo, you're not going to keep any of it.
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BonezTheGoon
Bodhisattva
Joined: 14 Jun 2002
Posts: 1376
Location: Albuquerque, NM -- birthplace of Microsoft and Gentoo
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| Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Ahenobarbi wrote: | | BonezTheGoon wrote: | | pjp wrote: | | The question is, which country's currency is safest from our collapse. I've been hording money, and I'm thinking it might be time to divest myself of a majority of Franklins. |
In a financial collapse any fiat currency is at risk, objects with intrinsic value are the safest "investment" for the kind of times you are talking about. |
So gold, booze and cigarets? |
I'd say booze and cigarettes would outlast gold, as gold really doesn't have as much intrinsic value to the average joe as just about any consumable.
Tools though, the kinds that can get you more food, those ought to hold their value rather well I should think.
Guns too would eventually lose their value as ammunition became scarce. But the ability to reload would hold good value, again while the supplies for that task were still available.
Eventually most things lose all value, if the situation remains the same long enough.
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| pjp wrote: | | The greater evil is voting for the "lesser evil." |
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BonezTheGoon
Bodhisattva
Joined: 14 Jun 2002
Posts: 1376
Location: Albuquerque, NM -- birthplace of Microsoft and Gentoo
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| Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:19 pm Post subject: |
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| BoneKracker wrote: | And canned food. Most valuable of all is an abandoned mine shaft, though. Gotta have a mine shaft.
But without guns and ammo, you're not going to keep any of it. |
Related.
Also, note the original run date.
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| pjp wrote: | | The greater evil is voting for the "lesser evil." |
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Dr.Willy
Apprentice
Joined: 15 Jul 2007
Posts: 296
Location: NRW, Germany
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| Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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| BonezTheGoon wrote: | | I'd say booze and cigarettes would outlast gold, as gold really doesn't have as much intrinsic value to the average joe as just about any consumable. |
Seriously? |
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Prenj
n00b
Joined: 20 Nov 2011
Posts: 8
Location: Mostar, BiH
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| Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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Facit from balkan wars:
- tobacco, coffee are luxury items, and for some reason, they become more valuable in crisis, since having a cup of cofee and a smoke amidst total chaos gives some psychological rest that not everything is upside down. Even if you don't smoke, it's a good currency. During the bosnian-croat conflict in Mostar, 93-95, croats had plenty of tobacco, since they weren't cut off. Bosnian side grew marijuana, since there was no "laws and police". They would take mortar rounds, empty them, stuff them with marijuana and fire it across the front line. The other side would fire mortar rounds with tobacco. They would have a smoke, and resume shooting at each other. True story. 
good things to have:
- antibiotics
- multivitamin/multimineral pills
- toothbrushes
- make up, shampoo, etc for women (they like to look pretty and smell nice even when grenades are falling down)
- rechargable batteries
- solar chargers for batteries / phones / etc
- radio (even if there are no stations, people still listen, just in case)
- woolen socks, woolen underwear, etc (or synthethic variants that have same "wet" performance, cotton is bad)
- hiking shoes
- rainproof clothing, sleeping bags
- tools, think carpentry and stuff
guns and ammo, but:
- you need to build up local community, with armed watches, proper order and common law (republic or something, democracy doesn't work well, due to people not being rational during distress).
- you need to tie networks between local communities, for mutual cooperation and protection
Building a shelter with lots of supplies and one gun is not gonna work in the long run, because the main danger will be single men age 16-50 with guns, who band up and go raiding, pillaging, raping, etc. For douchebags, ganging up and getting some guns is way to food and goods with least amount of effort, so rest of the population (think families) have to band together. Once you have local community going on, with some local militia, with enough brains and land to take care of housing, food and health, you can thrive.
Having practical skills is great, being a stock broker I guess will be like a death sentence. |
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BonezTheGoon
Bodhisattva
Joined: 14 Jun 2002
Posts: 1376
Location: Albuquerque, NM -- birthplace of Microsoft and Gentoo
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| Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Dr.Willy wrote: | | BonezTheGoon wrote: | | I'd say booze and cigarettes would outlast gold, as gold really doesn't have as much intrinsic value to the average joe as just about any consumable. |
Seriously? |
Yes, seriously. When you are on the verge of starvation gold isn't really all that comforting, especially if the only people you can barter or trade with are in roughly the same condition you are in.
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| pjp wrote: | | The greater evil is voting for the "lesser evil." |
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pjp
Administrator
Joined: 16 Apr 2002
Posts: 16033
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 12:27 am Post subject: |
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| BonezTheGoon wrote: | | Guns too would eventually lose their value as ammunition became scarce. But the ability to reload would hold good value, again while the supplies for that task were still available. |
What, you don't include black powder in your arsenal for when ammo becomes scarce? Claymore-type devices could similarly be made "easily." I think your main problem is having to cushy a life style :P
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BoneKracker
Veteran
Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 1499
Location: U.S.A.
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 1:45 am Post subject: |
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| Prenj wrote: | | Facit from balkan wars: ... |
Sounds like all good advice, especially the antibiotics.
Polypropylene is a good alternative to wool. Cotton underwear and socks just add to hygiene problems and start to rot off your body or fall apart.
I'd probably add "portable, reusable water purification apparatus" and "water purification tablets" to the list. Water can be boiled (thoroughly), but sometimes you don't have that luxury.
Also good to have: a couple of bales (bale = a thousand) of empty sandbags. They are cheap, light, last in storage forever, and are of enormous value in many emergencies (especially the kind where people are shooting at you).
Most important tools of all: dirt shovels and axes. For one's survival kit, an collapsable military "entrenching tool" serves both purposes.
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Oldthinkers unbellyfeel INGSOC.
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BonezTheGoon
Bodhisattva
Joined: 14 Jun 2002
Posts: 1376
Location: Albuquerque, NM -- birthplace of Microsoft and Gentoo
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 3:49 pm Post subject: |
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| pjp wrote: | | BonezTheGoon wrote: | | Guns too would eventually lose their value as ammunition became scarce. But the ability to reload would hold good value, again while the supplies for that task were still available. |
What, you don't include black powder in your arsenal for when ammo becomes scarce? Claymore-type devices could similarly be made "easily." I think your main problem is having to cushy a life style  |
I didn't explicitly name black powder, but I'd be surprised if you argued it wasn't implied when I sayd "the supplies for [reloading]."
I can assure you I've never lived a cushy lifestyle. The conditions in this thread might even be considered an improvement over some stages of my life.
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| pjp wrote: | | The greater evil is voting for the "lesser evil." |
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BonezTheGoon
Bodhisattva
Joined: 14 Jun 2002
Posts: 1376
Location: Albuquerque, NM -- birthplace of Microsoft and Gentoo
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 3:56 pm Post subject: |
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| BoneKracker wrote: | | Prenj wrote: | | Facit from balkan wars: ... |
Sounds like all good advice, especially the antibiotics.
Polypropylene is a good alternative to wool. Cotton underwear and socks just add to hygiene problems and start to rot off your body or fall apart.
I'd probably add "portable, reusable water purification apparatus" and "water purification tablets" to the list. Water can be boiled (thoroughly), but sometimes you don't have that luxury.
Also good to have: a couple of bales (bale = a thousand) of empty sandbags. They are cheap, light, last in storage forever, and are of enormous value in many emergencies (especially the kind where people are shooting at you).
Most important tools of all: dirt shovels and axes. For one's survival kit, an collapsable military "entrenching tool" serves both purposes. |
Good idea about the sandbags.
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| pjp wrote: | | The greater evil is voting for the "lesser evil." |
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pjp
Administrator
Joined: 16 Apr 2002
Posts: 16033
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:03 pm Post subject: |
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| BonezTheGoon wrote: | | I didn't explicitly name black powder, but I'd be surprised if you argued it wasn't implied when I sayd "the supplies for [reloading]." |
Musket balls are a bit easier to make, so the scarcity issue shouldn't be as much of a risk.
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In Loving Memory
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BoneKracker
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Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 1499
Location: U.S.A.
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| Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:10 pm Post subject: |
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I'm learning flint-knapping, just to be safe.
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