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ichbinsisyphos
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:18 pm    Post subject: 1% threatens to fire employees that don't vote for Mittens Reply with quote

http://gawker.com/5950189/the-ceo-who-built-himself-americas-largest-house-just-threatened-to-fire-his-employees-if-obamas-elected

Quote:
The CEO Who Built Himself America’s Largest House Just Threatened to Fire His Employees if Obama’s Elected

David Siegel is the founder and CEO of Westgate Resorts, a huge national timeshare company and one of the largest resort developers in the world. In 2007 he was a billionaire, although he may be only a hundred-millionaire now. He and his wife Jackie were the subjects of the recent documentary "The Queen of Versailles," about their ongoing quest to build the largest house in America, a 90,000 square foot monument to excess. And yesterday, David Siegel sent an email to all of his thousands of employees, in which he—in a veiled way—insinuated that they would be fired if Barack Obama is reelected.

...
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petrjanda
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hope all those employees will take him to court and he will do time for blackmail.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
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you experience political reality dilation when travelling at american political speeds. it's in einstein's formulas. it's not their fault.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Misleading. He didn't threaten to fire anyone based upon who they voted for.... he simply laid out the economic reality that another Obama term would have. If Obama wins, he'll let his employees go.

And good for him. Why support failure?
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 12:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What ever happened to taking personal responsibility? Or does personal responsibility only apply to us little people? That the pervertedly rich should be given special privilege?
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you experience political reality dilation when travelling at american political speeds. it's in einstein's formulas. it's not their fault.
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 1:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a natural consequence of Obama's class warfare rhetoric.
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wswartzendruber
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 1:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The thread title is untruthful and dishonest. It defines his course of action based on the actions of his employees, and this is not at all the case.
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McGruff
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 2:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Capitalists (and sex offenders) like Mr Siegheil do not drive the economy. A big, fat, healthy middle drives the economy. Mr Siegfail's role is efficiently to satisfy the demand which they generate. However, if people have no money to spend there is no demand and little potential for business growth.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 2:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcgruff wrote:
Capitalists like Mr Siegheil do not drive the economy.


<<< Genuinely curious on the lineage of your economic knowledge to have come to make such a convoluted statement such as this. It's like you have this anti-capitalist mentality, but then make an odd qualifying statement on how a market works. You have simultaneously made Karl Marx and F.A. Hayek facepalm. Good job.
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ichbinsisyphos
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 2:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There was a movie made about dude's family and probably released just recently. I'm not going to watch it, but some of these user reviews are among the greatest stuff I've read on imdb, ever:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2125666/reviews
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McGruff
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 2:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NYCosmos wrote:
It's like you have this anti-capitalist mentality, but then make an odd qualifying statement on how a market works.


I'm pretty sure a market won't work if people don't have money to spend in it.
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NYCosmos
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 3:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcgruff wrote:
NYCosmos wrote:
It's like you have this anti-capitalist mentality, but then make an odd qualifying statement on how a market works.


I'm pretty sure a market won't work if people don't have money to spend in it.


By the definition of the word "Capitalist" you have just contradicted yourself. You can't say, "capitalists don't drive the economy" and then say "a market won't work if people don't have money to spend in it". It is either that capitalists do not drive the economy and people do not privately invest in goods/services in the market, or they do.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 7:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NYCosmos wrote:
By the definition of the word "Capitalist" you have just contradicted yourself. You can't say, "capitalists don't drive the economy" and then say "a market won't work if people don't have money to spend in it". It is either that capitalists do not drive the economy and people do not privately invest in goods/services in the market, or they do.

Quote:
cap·i·tal·ist/ˈkapətlist/
Noun:
A wealthy person who uses money to invest in trade and industry for profit in accordance with the principles of capitalism.

Quote:
con·sum·er/kənˈso͞omər/
Noun:
A person who purchases goods and services for personal use

Without the latter, the former would have no basis for making profit. While the latter doesn't need capitalists, they can economically interact with any actor. Including each other, which they do all the time.

So, yes, capitalists do not drive the economy, a cash-flush middle-class does, hence squeezing the middle-class dry is brain damaged, narrow-minded, short-sighted selfish folly.
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you experience political reality dilation when travelling at american political speeds. it's in einstein's formulas. it's not their fault.
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NYCosmos
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 8:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidanjt wrote:
NYCosmos wrote:
By the definition of the word "Capitalist" you have just contradicted yourself. You can't say, "capitalists don't drive the economy" and then say "a market won't work if people don't have money to spend in it". It is either that capitalists do not drive the economy and people do not privately invest in goods/services in the market, or they do.

Quote:
cap·i·tal·ist/ˈkapətlist/
Noun:
A wealthy person who uses money to invest in trade and industry for profit in accordance with the principles of capitalism.

Quote:
con·sum·er/kənˈso͞omər/
Noun:
A person who purchases goods and services for personal use

Without the latter, the former would have no basis for making profit. While the latter doesn't need capitalists, they can economically interact with any actor. Including each other, which they do all the time.

So, yes, capitalists do not drive the economy, a cash-flush middle-class does, hence squeezing the middle-class dry is brain damaged, narrow-minded, short-sighted selfish folly.


Your definition of capitalist is bullshit, frankly. The fact that it has qualifiers like "wealthy" and "for profit" and then uses capitalism in its own definition is idiotic. Capitalism refers to the private ownership of property in a market as opposed to state-owned or shared property. A capitalist can and often is also a consumer.
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wildhorse
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Westgate of no return in Ouidah.
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aidanjt
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 8:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NYCosmos wrote:
Your definition of capitalist is bullshit, frankly. The fact that it has qualifiers like "wealthy" and "for profit" and then uses capitalism in its own definition is idiotic. Capitalism refers to the private ownership of property in a market as opposed to state-owned or shared property. A capitalist can and often is also a consumer.

My definition of capitalist is dictionary. Please don't get into this libertardian redefinition of reality bullshit. It instantly renders any serious discussion impossible.
Quote:
cap·i·tal·ism/ˈkapətlˌizəm/
Noun:
An economic and political system in which a country's trade and industry are controlled by private owners for profit.

Your redefinition is made up nonsense.
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juniper wrote:
you experience political reality dilation when travelling at american political speeds. it's in einstein's formulas. it's not their fault.
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Prenj
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 9:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cheap merchants.
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big dave
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 12:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

here's an intro lesson to corporate finance 101. let's see if liberals can keep up.

under obama, employing a person costs O. under romney, employing a person costs R. O - R = G. if G exceeds a certain number, it's fiscally irresponsible to not downsize. if G is really excessive, it's imperative to automate or offshore. that's right folks, the size of G (or Government) causes downsizing, automation, and offshoring.

he's simply stating facts. if obama is elected, it doesn't make financial sense to keep all those employees.
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McGruff
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

By restricting the terms of your equation, you have just made an argument for slavery. Why employ people at all if profit is the only goal?

Unfortunately, those slaves won't be able to buy any products. Quite apart from the moral failure, there's a simple failure of arithmetic here. You have not considered the balance between income and costs, only the costs. Guess what: the more money being spent in the market by consumers, the more you can afford to pay in wages. Money spent on education, health, and infrastructure - ie big G - allows these markets to develop. It is an enabler, not a drain.

The kind of blinkered capitalism you espouse is simply a race to the bottom. It's better for everyone if wealth is shared out more evenly. That's not to say that people shouldn't be allowed to work hard and do well, just that we need balance.
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aidanjt
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 1:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big dave wrote:
here's an intro lesson to corporate finance 101. let's see if liberals can keep up.

under obama, employing a person costs O. under romney, employing a person costs R. O - R = G. if G exceeds a certain number, it's fiscally irresponsible to not downsize. if G is really excessive, it's imperative to automate or offshore. that's right folks, the size of G (or Government) causes downsizing, automation, and offshoring.

he's simply stating facts. if obama is elected, it doesn't make financial sense to keep all those employees.

Obama has already been elected. He means re-elected. What he doesn't know is what Romney's policies will actually be. He simply expects Romney to squeeze the middle class and run up the deficit so Romney can hand him soft money from the public purse, because Romney is a fellow psychopathic plebeian abuser. What he hasn't been able to (or even bothered to) calculate is loss of business which results from an imploding economy caused by a cash-starved population. He doesn't care, if the economy implodes all he needs to do is close up shop. All he cares about is *his* direct, personal kickbacks he'll get from Romney.

The whole 'woe is me, for I have to sign for budgets and shit, I'm so hard done by' bollocks just makes his petty little selfish tantrum worse and exemplifies just how utterly divorced from reality he really is.

The population wit large is suffering and struggling and scraping to make ends meet, while a large amount of companies are making fantastic profits increasing the wealth of the already fantastically wealthy. Hell, a whole bunch of rich cocksuckers had the gall to moan about Apple NOT INCREASING THEIR PROFITS ENOUGH. Seriously, if you're increasing your worth at all, you're already much better off than ~80% of the population and you should be fucking grateful.

The fact is, the rich have had their free ride for the last 3 decades and they need to pull their weight. Otherwise they will kill the goose which laid the golden egg. While that isn't a big deal for them, since they can always go to other countries and harvest golden eggs from there. It in no way helps the US public stay afloat.

Selfish, greedy, short-sighted self-interest isn't a virtue, it's just evil.
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you experience political reality dilation when travelling at american political speeds. it's in einstein's formulas. it's not their fault.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcgruff wrote:
...

these are all merely your desires and intentions that make you feel happy. this is not reality. either it's affordable within desired profit margins, or it isn't. those profit margins are further bounded by profit margins that can be achieved elsewhere.... that's how competition in a market works. if he's not making enough money employing these people, he'll take money out of his business (firing people) and put it elsewhere. this is reality.

you can't force him to invest his money elsewhere. if you think you should be able to, you truly are a communist.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big dave wrote:
that's how competition in a market works


But markets do not work without controls and frequent interventions. For example, it would make perfect business sense to cut costs by doing away with employees altogether and buying slaves.

A free market only "works" if your definition of "work" is "maximum short-term gain for the few with power in the market". In every other way they will fail. You cannot understand or run a human society using the narrow dogma of market forces. They've got a part to play, sure, and you can let them off the leash to a certain extent to create rapid growth when there are plentiful resources and labour. That's not really true any more, and the farther we travel into the twenty-first century, the worse it will get.

big dave wrote:
you can't force him to invest his money elsewhere. if you think you should be able to, you truly are a communist.


Wait a minute let me check my watch to see if it's still the 1950's.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidanjt wrote:
What ever happened to taking personal responsibility? Or does personal responsibility only apply to us little people? That the pervertedly rich should be given special privilege?
Are you referring to the refusal to admit the Ben Gazi screw-up, or what?
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidanjt wrote:
The fact is, the rich have had their free ride for the last 3 decades and they need to pull their weight.


:lol: :lol: :lol:

I hope you are simply trolling, because the so called "rich" (business owners etc) are the driving force behind job & wealth creation. They not only 'pull their weight', they also pull other people's weight.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2012 1:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NEWSFLASH: Many medium-sized businesses file taxes as an individual.
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