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Do you have a dread or hatred of Islam and therefore, a fear and dislike of all Muslims
Yes
9%
 9%  [ 2 ]
No
90%
 90%  [ 19 ]
Total Votes : 21

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Darth Marley
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidanjt wrote:
Darth Marley wrote:
I have been aware of that site and its mission for quite a while.
That they link to official documents just demonstrates that they link to official documents.

Nothing you said there disputes the facts of the official numbers they cited from government research.


No, I don't.

I don't take the 99.9% literally. It is an exaggeration.Hyperbole.

Loonwatch is still an apologist for savages.

Looking at the FBI report to which they link, I can understand that a bunch of ELF asshats burning some SUVs might count as environmental terrorism.
Compare terrorist incidents with a body count, and let me know what percentage of the same reported terrorist incidents (no prevented incidents) caused death rather than vandalism.

A simple question for you; do you support jihad, or oppose it?
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energyman76b
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I pretty much hate everybody. Which option do I have to click?
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidanjt wrote:
Muso wrote:
While not all Muslims are terrorists, nearly (and I mean 99.9%) all terrorists are Muslim.

Or not.

According to that article, only acts of terror on U.S. and European soil are actual "terrorism". All the rest, throughout the rest of the world, and unsuccessful attempt too, don't count.

I'd say that's pretty much bullshit. It doesn't matter whether the numbers are "official" or not; it's a blatant misrepresentation. Terrorism counts, whether it's on our own soil or not, and attempts count too.
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pjp
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidanjt wrote:
Darth Marley wrote:
"Loonwatch" is transparently apologetic to every act of jihad terror.

They link to official documents to back up their claims. If you'd bother to read it at all you'd have seen them.
I haven't checked their sources, or tried to understand their data just yet. But assuming it is reasonably correct, WTF is wrong with France & Spain? 8O 8O 8O

On a related note, are not some of France's domestic terrorist issues related to the "disenfranchised" Muslim immigrants?
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

More to the point, why limit an analysis of terrorism to the Europe and the U.S., when practically all of it is happening elsewhere?

Oh, wait; I know -- because you want to mislead people.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was trying to ignore the elephant in the room. :mrgreen:
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
More to the point, why limit an analysis of terrorism to the Europe and the U.S., when practically all of it is happening elsewhere?

Oh, wait; I know -- because you want to mislead people.
This entire thread is predicated on misleading people.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't see how it is misleading.

"a dread or hatred of Islam and therefore, to the fear and dislike of all Muslims"
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 1:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pjp wrote:
I don't see how it is misleading.

"a dread or hatred of Islam and therefore, to the fear and dislike of all Muslims"
I'm referring to the improper use of 'phobia' or 'islamophobe' and the fact that the definition sugar provided is incompatible with the actual definition of a phobia.
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Bones McCracker
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 1:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

2 + 2 = 5
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Dear Media, Accurately Portraying Muslim Rage as Muslim Rage is not Islamophobic

This week we learned what really gets the liberal media in a ... well ... rage. It isn't the act of perpetrating violence upon the innocent. No, it's calling out that rage for everyone to see. In Liberal Land, words speak louder than actions.

Quote:
Rather than focusing on the real issues here, the liberal media is doing everything in its power to avoid pointing the finger at radical Islamists. They point it at Mitt Romney for his statements, they point it at Newsweek, at the author, Ayaan Ali Hirsi, and they point it at an obscure film heretofore unknown to the general public.

None of these are justification for the scene currently spreading throughout the Middle East. And most assuredly, the rage is not a response to an anti-Mohammad film, despite what the White House would have you believe.

The rage has been consistent and perpetual, and it has long been evident prior to any version of any anti-Mohammad film. During the Iran hostage crisis in 1979. At the World Trade Center bombing in 1993. At the embassy bombings in Kenya and Tanzania in 1998. With the USS Cole bombing in 2000. At the Fort Hood massacre in 2009. And of course, September 11th.

This to name a few.

The rage is tangible, and it is very closely associated with radical Islam.

Giving terrorists built-in excuses such as an obscure film only serves to add fuel to their fire. Appeasement does not work.

Quote:
What the left clearly needs are more people of reason, more people like Kirsten Powers who wrote:

"... our leaders shouldn't let our enemies know that when they kill our people and attack our embassies that the US Government will act like a battered wife making excuses for her psychotic husband. Wake up: we weren't attacked because of a movie made by an American. We were attacked because there are crazy religious fanatics who hate the United States. We didn't ask for it."
Say it along with her - Crazy. Religious. Fanatics.

Muslim rage.

... more

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BoneKracker wrote:
aidanjt wrote:
Muso wrote:
While not all Muslims are terrorists, nearly (and I mean 99.9%) all terrorists are Muslim.

Or not.

According to that article, only acts of terror on U.S. and European soil are actual "terrorism". All the rest, throughout the rest of the world, and unsuccessful attempt too, don't count.

I'd say that's pretty much bullshit. It doesn't matter whether the numbers are "official" or not; it's a blatant misrepresentation. Terrorism counts, whether it's on our own soil or not, and attempts count too.


it must also depend on what the definition of terrorism is, no? i.e. does bombing the shit out of a country count?
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
aidanjt wrote:
Muso wrote:
While not all Muslims are terrorists, nearly (and I mean 99.9%) all terrorists are Muslim.

Or not.

According to that article, only acts of terror on U.S. and European soil are actual "terrorism". All the rest, throughout the rest of the world, and unsuccessful attempt too, don't count.

I'd say that's pretty much bullshit. It doesn't matter whether the numbers are "official" or not; it's a blatant misrepresentation. Terrorism counts, whether it's on our own soil or not, and attempts count too.


it must also depend on what the definition of terrorism is, no? i.e. does bombing the shit out of a country count?


You do not differentiate between a military engaging with another military and having some fuzzy faced fanatic blowing up a school bus full of kids?
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tylerwylie
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
aidanjt wrote:
Muso wrote:
While not all Muslims are terrorists, nearly (and I mean 99.9%) all terrorists are Muslim.

Or not.

According to that article, only acts of terror on U.S. and European soil are actual "terrorism". All the rest, throughout the rest of the world, and unsuccessful attempt too, don't count.

I'd say that's pretty much bullshit. It doesn't matter whether the numbers are "official" or not; it's a blatant misrepresentation. Terrorism counts, whether it's on our own soil or not, and attempts count too.


it must also depend on what the definition of terrorism is, no? i.e. does bombing the shit out of a country count?


You do not differentiate between a military engaging with another military and having some fuzzy faced fanatic blowing up a school bus full of kids?
I'd say US foreign policy fits the definition of terrorism overseas. We only deal with criminals and we give them two options, get bribed or bombed. Civilian casualties will be under reported and more 'terrorists' will be bred.

In the words of someone who got drone bombed by Obama:

Anwar Al-awlaki wrote:
“Our position needs to be reiterated, and needs to be very clear. The fact that the U.S. has administered the death and homicide of over 1 million civilians in Iraq; the fact that the U.S. is supporting the deaths and killing of thousands of Palestinians, does not justify the killing of 1 U.S. civilian in New York City or Washington D.C. And the deaths of 6,000 civilians in New York and Washington D.C. does not justify the death of 1 civilian in Afghanistan.”


Oh his son got drone bombed too, they were both US citizens.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For you, all government action is illegitimate... so I know where you stand. Juniper is a statist, so he actually thinks that government brutality is allowed under certain circumstances. I'm trying to find out what those parameters are.
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juniper
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
juniper wrote:
BoneKracker wrote:
aidanjt wrote:
Muso wrote:
While not all Muslims are terrorists, nearly (and I mean 99.9%) all terrorists are Muslim.

Or not.

According to that article, only acts of terror on U.S. and European soil are actual "terrorism". All the rest, throughout the rest of the world, and unsuccessful attempt too, don't count.

I'd say that's pretty much bullshit. It doesn't matter whether the numbers are "official" or not; it's a blatant misrepresentation. Terrorism counts, whether it's on our own soil or not, and attempts count too.


it must also depend on what the definition of terrorism is, no? i.e. does bombing the shit out of a country count?


You do not differentiate between a military engaging with another military and having some fuzzy faced fanatic blowing up a school bus full of kids?


sure. They are different. But let's not sugar coat it. the americans and iraqi army didn't really "engage each other". America has basically been bombing the shit out of iraq for much of the 90s, then the iraq war, which led to the ensuing craziness. that's gotta count for a little terror, no? fuzzy faced fanatics are bad. really bad. so is bombing the crap out of a country for years.

Muso wrote:

For you, all government action is illegitimate... so I know where you stand. Juniper is a statist, so he actually thinks that government brutality is allowed under certain circumstances. I'm trying to find out what those parameters are.


precisely what govt brutality do I condone? tax collection? :lol:

you are right, it isn't all black and white to me. Call me bat shit insane, but I don't think it is inconsistent to have universal health care AND not bomb the shit of countries. I'm just nutty that way.
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Muso
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
Muso wrote:

For you, all government action is illegitimate... so I know where you stand. Juniper is a statist, so he actually thinks that government brutality is allowed under certain circumstances. I'm trying to find out what those parameters are.


precisely what govt brutality do I condone? tax collection? :lol:

you are right, it isn't all black and white to me. Call me bat shit insane, but I don't think it is inconsistent to have universal health care AND not bomb the shit of countries. I'm just nutty that way.


I see that you have gone into the strawman constructing industry. :lol:
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
juniper wrote:
Muso wrote:

For you, all government action is illegitimate... so I know where you stand. Juniper is a statist, so he actually thinks that government brutality is allowed under certain circumstances. I'm trying to find out what those parameters are.


precisely what govt brutality do I condone? tax collection? :lol:

you are right, it isn't all black and white to me. Call me bat shit insane, but I don't think it is inconsistent to have universal health care AND not bomb the shit of countries. I'm just nutty that way.


I see that you have gone into the strawman constructing industry. :lol:


well, I was directly responding to your statement that I condone government brutality in certain circumstances. Just wondering what those circumstances would be.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

juniper wrote:
well, I was directly responding to your statement that I condone government brutality in certain circumstances. Just wondering what those circumstances would be.


You think that government should have a monopoly on violence, as you are opposed to individuals owning guns. If I am mistaken about this, please let me know... but as long as I've known you, you have been a proponent of gun control.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 10:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muso wrote:
juniper wrote:
well, I was directly responding to your statement that I condone government brutality in certain circumstances. Just wondering what those circumstances would be.


You think that government should have a monopoly on violence, as you are opposed to individuals owning guns. If I am mistaken about this, please let me know... but as long as I've known you, you have been a proponent of gun control.


You are right. I also advocate that the govt should have minimal arms as well. I certainly don't support an arms race between a govt and its citizens.

that is not enough to support your charge. I would say that being a proponent of gun control and supporting state brutality are less similar than state bombings and terrorism.
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energyman76b
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the state MUST have the monopoly on violence.

Or we are back to medieval feuds. See also: Landfrieden
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

energyman76b wrote:
the state MUST have the monopoly on violence.


The "State" is not some mythological deity that is wise beyond measure, but a collection of individuals with agenda, priviledges and power.

To assume that the "state" knows better is to demote yourself and idolize those in power. Just because those in power did their job properly in certain countries and within certain time-frame, does not mean that "the state" is somehow magical.

It's just socialist speak for "God".
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am glad that history has proven you wrong.
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AidanJT wrote:

Libertardian denial of reality is wholly unimpressive and unconvincing, and simply serves to demonstrate what a bunch of delusional fools they all are.

Satan's got perfectly toned abs and rocks a c-cup.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

energyman76b wrote:
I am glad that history has proven you wrong.


I't aint over until it's over. I too used to think of "war" as something that happens in fucked up countries. Or in black & white documentaries.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Prenj wrote:
energyman76b wrote:
I am glad that history has proven you wrong.


I't aint over until it's over. I too used to think of "war" as something that happens in fucked up countries. Or in black & white documentaries.


fucked up like the Balkans?
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Libertardian denial of reality is wholly unimpressive and unconvincing, and simply serves to demonstrate what a bunch of delusional fools they all are.

Satan's got perfectly toned abs and rocks a c-cup.
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