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kernelOfTruth
Watchman
Joined: 20 Dec 2005
Posts: 6111
Location: Vienna, Austria; Germany; hello world :)
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 Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 10:31 am Post subject: no Gentoo 2007.0 livecd release? |
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Hi there,
this shouldn't be a thread about when the 2007.0 livecd release will get out,
isn't this a little strange that the Gentoo Linux distro / project doesn't have a own cd right now which supports newer to newest hardware
in order to support its old / new users with their efforts to get it to run on their rig? (if 2007.0 at all will be released, 2007.1 will
be release on August as far as I know)
it's ok to refer to other livecds, e.g. ubuntu, but isn't this kind of ... I don't know which words to choose: 'bad service' 
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anello
Guru
Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 557
Location: EU -> DE -> Stuttgart
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 10:38 am Post subject: Re: no Gentoo 2007.0 livecd release? |
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| kernelOfTruth wrote: | | it's ok to refer to other livecds, e.g. ubuntu, but isn't this kind of ... I don't know which words to choose: 'bad service' |
Indeed!
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Jaglover
Watchman
Joined: 29 May 2005
Posts: 8291
Location: Saint Amant, Acadiana
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 12:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | it's ok to refer to other livecds, e.g. ubuntu, but isn't this kind of ... I don't know which words to choose: 'bad service' |
Frankly, I do not think so. Try to think "outside of box". A distro like Ubuntu without install CD would be a dead cow indeed. But Gentoo is not Ubuntu. It can be installed from any Linux CD which has a recent kernel. On the contrary, I do not understand why Gentoo developers are wasting manpower on these install CD's at all. There are excellent, dedicated LiveCD's, developed to boot on as different h/w as possible.
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Naib
Watchman
Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 6051
Location: Removed by Neddy
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 12:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Jaglover wrote: | | Quote: | | it's ok to refer to other livecds, e.g. ubuntu, but isn't this kind of ... I don't know which words to choose: 'bad service' |
Frankly, I do not think so. Try to think "outside of box". A distro like Ubuntu without install CD would be a dead cow indeed. But Gentoo is not Ubuntu. It can be installed from any Linux CD which has a recent kernel. On the contrary, I do not understand why Gentoo developers are wasting manpower on these install CD's at all. There are excellent, dedicated LiveCD's, developed to boot on as different h/w as possible. |
because it is their time to waste.
Yes any liveCD and be used to gain a linux prompt with hardware support (all that is needed). The Gentoo LiveCD's tend to be handy cause they are small 80meg!!!
If a dev/s want to do it GREAT!!
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Jaglover
Watchman
Joined: 29 May 2005
Posts: 8291
Location: Saint Amant, Acadiana
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 12:30 pm Post subject: |
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I see you did not get my point.
Let me rephrase it.
Why waste manpower on producing mediocre install CD's? Once you have decided to do it, do it good! Yes, minimal install CD is small. I tried to install Gentoo with it on my (not newest) laptop - none of my NIC's was recognized. Knoppix activated both without any hassle. I find this 80 MB download was a waste of bandwidth.
So my point is - if you can't do it good don't do it at all. Considering it is not necessary for installing Gentoo.
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ichbinsisyphos
Guru
Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 547
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 1:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Jaglover wrote: | I see you did not get my point.
Let me rephrase it.
Why waste manpower on producing mediocre install CD's? Once you have decided to do it, do it good! Yes, minimal install CD is small. I tried to install Gentoo with it on my (not newest) laptop - none of my NIC's was recognized. Knoppix activated both without any hassle. I find this 80 MB download was a waste of bandwidth.
So my point is - if you can't do it good don't do it at all. Considering it is not necessary for installing Gentoo. |
if its not possible to create a working livecd and keep it updated so it works with current hardware, this distribution should have the balls to include the knoppix-method in their official install documentation. but ... you know ... that would look ... a little ... ...
now its hard for noobs to get gentoo up and running. once you have experience with this distribution any way to get to an chrooted environment is good enough. get an internet connection running and youre almost finished.
but as a beginner the live cd helped a lot. i had a basic system up in no time, had then high resolution, several terminals parallel, easy access to the forums/wiki to help with my problems and multimedia to pass time while compiling. |
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Paapaa
l33t
Joined: 14 Aug 2005
Posts: 955
Location: Finland
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 4:39 pm Post subject: |
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I think the biggest problem this time was all the C2D systems which could not be booted with Gentoo 2006.1 using the damn JMicron controller. Dunno, maybe there should be a way to release a quick fix (only adding certain device driver) when big number of new systems don't work with official install media?
Edit: 599 posts... yikes!  |
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i92guboj
Bodhisattva
Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 10315
Location: Córdoba (Spain)
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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Im bored of this discussions.
First, Gentoo is not a distro, it is just the infrastructure to make your own. AKA "metadistro". So, I would stop comparisons.
Second, a Gentoo livecd does not give any benefit over any other livecd. I can't understand why people want to throw out time from the devs (when it is much needed in other places) just to have a nice cd with a gentoo label on it. Almost any cd can do the same.
I can't understand why there's a need to replicate a work that's already done when the Gentoo devs lack the time to do so. |
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Paapaa
l33t
Joined: 14 Aug 2005
Posts: 955
Location: Finland
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 5:18 pm Post subject: |
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| 6thpink wrote: | | I can't understand why there's a need to replicate a work that's already done when the Gentoo devs lack the time to do so. |
I disagree. In my opinion Gentoo should have a working and sufficiently up to date install media. I don't think Gentoo needs GUI installer or anything fancy. But I do think Gentoo should always have minimal install CD/DVD which works on most mainstream machines out there - and this usually is the case. The only exception is C2D systems as I already mentioned.
And If Gentoo doesn't have the manpower to update CDs that often, there should be an easy way to roll your own install CD with a desired kernel version.
600...ahhh  |
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i92guboj
Bodhisattva
Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 10315
Location: Córdoba (Spain)
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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There are plenty. And all of them work ok.
Yes, it would be nice, yes. But there simply aren't enough resources to put in every place at a given time. There are most important things that needs to be done than to please those that think that using a knoppix cd is bad for installing gentoo. And I bet that those recurrent threads are becoming irritating for many people.
I can't understand either why people keep publishing one and another thread with the same title when they all go to the dupes section again and again and again. |
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shaumux
Veteran
Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 1009
Location: Hong Kong
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 8:19 pm Post subject: |
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Having a gentoo install cd is nice but i think it shouldn't be given that much priorirty.
Also why waste your bandwidth downloading a cd when you can get ubuntu cd shipped to your home for free.
Using another live cd works graet then why shouldn't it be utilized to the advantage?
I don't see any reason for that.
But a media refresh for the stage tarballs would be good
Users who need to install new can usually use a tarball with newer content. |
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kernelOfTruth
Watchman
Joined: 20 Dec 2005
Posts: 6111
Location: Vienna, Austria; Germany; hello world :)
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| Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 8:26 pm Post subject: |
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points that definitely should be 'fixed':
- documentation with a nice working howto for livecd-creation with catalyst
- working unionfs support in genkernel
- perhaps a livecd do-it-yourself sceleton for download
- gentoo handbook / documentation should point to alternative installation ways and/or include additional steps differing from gentoo minimal livecd
... ok I'll come up with more later, that's all for the moment I can think of 
-> this should help people do their own livecd's more easier 
have I already said that I LOVE Gentoo ? 
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