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Should X 7.1 still be testing only because of closed source drivers (ati/nvidia)?
Yes!
55%
 55%  [ 254 ]
No!
37%
 37%  [ 172 ]
I don't care!
6%
 6%  [ 28 ]
Total Votes : 454

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Gremlin31
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2006 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kensai wrote:
slycordinator wrote:
And I think you misunderstood what I meant: Someone can create a non-gnu OS that is still a linux because it uses the linux kernel. I wasn't meaning that the person would be using a non-gnu linux kernel (as there's no such thing).

Very true. I don't know why people bow to RMS he surely does defend OpenSource and thats good but what he makes other than making a fool out of himself going to an ATI conference and trying to make a riot out of it. So good that a poliece man took him out of there. A riot is never the best option you can't preassure companies that way. Sooner or later those companies will realize if GNU/Linux is of value enough to be paid even more attention.
IMHO I think that will happen with a lot of companies and they are going to be more Linux oriented.


riot? the fsf website tells me something different. he sat in that conference and was asked by a policeman to come with him and he loudly asked whether he would be arrested. after agreeing to the organizers' terms of not interrupting the conference (which he did not violate in the first place) he was allowed to sit back in.

what have you done to prevent closed source kernel modules? wait and hope? at least he does something about it. what's so bad about that?
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2006 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Come on you think being sit there holding something that says "DON'T BUY FROM ATI enemy of your freedom" was asking for a peacefull reaction of ATI and RMS supporting people. Please riots are made sometimes for less than that. What has he done to prevent closed source kernel modules? sit and hope? :wink: Companies does not change their mind because of things like this, we need to show them Linux is about maturity not about RMS trying to get attention in every corner.

On topic, NVIDIA has said the next driver is going to be released soon at least that the conclusion you make after an NVIDIA developer said they are already in the planning and development of the 9xxx series of drivers for Linux which will have a lot of nice features, like adjusting resolution from the nvidia-settings and more nvidia-settings capabilities. 8)
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry if I'm being a bit too anally-retentive about the wording here, but...
Kensai wrote:
RMS he surely does defend OpenSource
RMS could care less about Open Source. He's a Free software advocate; and while the two idealogical movements usually cooperate in practice to develop and maintain lots of cool software, they are based on very different fundamental beliefs. Please see the GNU project's article for more information.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 1:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

codergeek42 wrote:
Sorry if I'm being a bit too anally-retentive about the wording here, but...
Kensai wrote:
RMS he surely does defend OpenSource
RMS could care less about Open Source. He's a Free software advocate; and while the two idealogical movements usually cooperate in practice to develop and maintain lots of cool software, they are based on very different fundamental beliefs. Please see the GNU project's article for more information.

Well I failed to use the right word but thats what I mean so it was a mistake I meant FSF. Strongly agree about he does not care about OpenSource.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 7:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

9xxx drivers?
cool!
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

legine wrote:
9xxx drivers?
cool!

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=958344
This thread speaks about that.
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

:D bookmarked!!! :D
Very good link ty.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2006 6:41 pm    Post subject: Run with the newest stuff! Reply with quote

When you get the ABI modules mismatch (when trying to run X) you just add the tag ignoreABI

you can run the newest nvidia drivers on xorg 7.1 just do this:

Code:
startx -- -ignoreABI


for those of you wanting to do xlg/compiz stuff, you can make a startxgl based off of the gentoo-wiki info. Here's a link: http://gentoo-wiki.com/XGL

Just for those of you who need extra help (like me) here's what I emerged...

Code:
emerge -C xorg-server
ACCEPT_KEYWORDS="~amd64" emerge nvidia-drivers
startx -- -ignoreABI


just a note- nvidia-drivers is masked (i think) so use your architecture to unmask. if you are unsure of your arch, use ACCEPT_KEYWORDS="~x86"

Hope this helps people!
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jwj wrote:
The nvidia 8774 drivers are on the ftp://download.nvidia.com/XFree86/ FTP Server.

Changelog:

Code:

    * Added support for X.Org 7.1.

    * Added support for XVideo with the Composite X extension when
      using X.Org 7.1.

    * Improved interaction with newer Linux kernels.


nvidia drivers released!!
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

YAY!!!! one big hug to nvidia a great driver that supports Xorg 7.1 now to take Xorg 7.1 from /etc/portage/package.mask/
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 9:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kensai wrote:
YAY!!!! one big hug to nvidia a great driver that supports Xorg 7.1 now to take Xorg 7.1 from /etc/portage/package.mask/

So far this driver seems as stable as the previous version so I'm going to unmask the updated xorg-7.1 parts and see how it goes.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Headrush wrote:
Kensai wrote:
YAY!!!! one big hug to nvidia a great driver that supports Xorg 7.1 now to take Xorg 7.1 from /etc/portage/package.mask/

So far this driver seems as stable as the previous version so I'm going to unmask the updated xorg-7.1 parts and see how it goes.

This changes needs to be made upstream though aince Xorg 7.1 still does not have the nvidia use flag as of this writing.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 11:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gr3ml1n wrote:
slycordinator wrote:
gr3ml1n wrote:
i don't understand how people over here can stab richard stallman in the back like this. they really don't understand the philosophy OR history of gnu and should maybe go to windows, mac or bsd and stop whining. linux is gpled and it therefore will always be gpled software. linus knew it when he released it under that license.


This is completely untrue. Just because the kernel is gpl doesn't mean every piece of software is gpl too.

Since you've been focussing on the "GNU/Linux" versus just "Linux" debate... couldn't someone release a NON-GNU Linux? And they could even name it Lindows and later change it to Linspire.

Anything that uses the Linux kernel is a Linux. For instance, if windows stopped using an NT-kernel and used the Linux kernel Windows would be a form of Linux.



omg q-_-p

no, nobody can release a non-gnu linux. since it is under gpl and that license is designed to stay and spread.

but anybody who makes a new kernel can make a non-linux gnu os. besides, linus torvalds holds the trade mark "Linux". and linspire sux.


(Ok, this is old - but I can't resist.)

The "GNU" in "GNU/Linux" is the GNU toolchain - which is copyright by the GNU project. The reason RMS thought this was significant was that the Linux userland depends on the GNU toolchain, and it is his (in the same sense Linux is Linus'). The reason everybody else thought this was silly (except Debian people) was because there is so much more to a Linux distro (eg X.org), and in that case you had better call it X.org/MIT/GNU/Linux/Sun/Mozilla (slightly paraphrasing Alan Cox). So it's not a question of Free/free/non-free - but a question of RMS being childish about not being as equal as Linus (and more so than all other contributors).

Anyway, port BSD userland to the Linux kernel - and you can have a Free non-GNU distro.

Excuse me, but I have a driver to install now. :)
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Guys,

A French proverb wrote:
Tout vient à point à qui sait attendre or All things come to him who can wait.


Morality: while we were all arguing wether good or bad, wether should or shouldn't, wether must or mustn't, wether ethical or political... drivers have come, that finally address the big problem that yielded this discussion. 8)

Implicitly closed to me.

And, yes, there are still ATI's... Soooo?
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kensai wrote:
This changes needs to be made upstream though aince Xorg 7.1 still does not have the nvidia use flag as of this writing.

What does this mean? In other words, does it work or not?


Last edited by batistuta on Fri Aug 25, 2006 12:53 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

VinzC wrote:
And, yes, there are still ATI's... Soooo?
I thought ATI fixed their drivers for 7.1...
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

VinzC wrote:
Implicitly closed to me.

Yeah.... R!tman should mark it as [solved] now :lol:
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

VinzC wrote:
Morality: while we were all arguing wether good or bad, wether should or shouldn't, wether must or mustn't, wether ethical or political... drivers have come, that finally address the big problem that yielded this discussion. 8)

well.. I dare say some of us would argue that the big problem was never so much the closed driver's incompatibility so much as it was the way in which that problem was addressed. But I've no particular wish to re-open that particular debate right now.

By all means, let's consider this one closed
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 3:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

batistuta wrote:
Kensai wrote:
This changes needs to be made upstream though aince Xorg 7.1 still does not have the nvidia use flag as of this writing.

What does this mean? In other words, does it work or not?

No I mean that nvidia ebuild is not yet made and the xorg-server for 7.1 doesn't have the nvidia flag yet again.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 5:10 pm    Post subject: Nice... Reply with quote

Way to encourage the likes of ATI and NVidia to keep using "proprietary IP" as a control measure...good to see it's working as their IP analysts suggest... :x
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 5:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Nice... Reply with quote

Kaboosh wrote:
Way to encourage the likes of ATI and NVidia to keep using "proprietary IP" as a control measure...good to see it's working as their IP analysts suggest... :x


Yeah well, when i'm paying $200+ for a video card, it doesn't make a lot of sense to use an alternate driver that can't even handle 3D acceleration. If you want to do so, that's your choice, but if you have such a problem with these companies, then don't buy their products and send a letter to them explaining why. If you are buying from them, how can you criticize anyone for using their drivers while you continue to support them with your dollars? That just seems overwhelmingly hypocritical and sensationalist.

Many of us are just happy they've decided to support Linux/BSD at all because it means we're not stuck using mid-90's cards at 800x600.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I second filterpunk 100%

Someone can *suggest* me what to use. But please don't *tell* me what to use, that's my choice :roll:
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 10:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Nice... Reply with quote

Kaboosh wrote:
Way to encourage the likes of ATI and NVidia to keep using "proprietary IP" as a control measure...good to see it's working as their IP analysts suggest... :x

As I have stated before, as much as ATI and NVIDIA wants to open source their drivers they can't there are propietary technologies in those drivers that aren't from NVIDIA or ATI. Please go suck on RMS. Another time the LInus Torvalds quote:
Quote:
"Anybody who tells me I can't use a program because it's not open source, go suck on rms. I'm not interested. 99% of that I run tends to be open source, but that's _my_ choice, dammit." (October 26, 2004) -Linus Torvalds

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 10:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kensai wrote:
[the] nvidia ebuild is not yet made and the xorg-server for 7.1 doesn't have the nvidia flag yet again.
The nvidia-drivers (not nvidia-kernel nor nvidia-glx) package is done now. I just --sync-ed and it updated. Now just waiting for the nvidia use flag in Xorg 7.1. I'm really looking forward to this.

---Alex
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 1:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WhiteSpade wrote:
Kensai wrote:
[the] nvidia ebuild is not yet made and the xorg-server for 7.1 doesn't have the nvidia flag yet again.
The nvidia-drivers (not nvidia-kernel nor nvidia-glx) package is done now. I just --sync-ed and it updated. Now just waiting for the nvidia use flag in Xorg 7.1. I'm really looking forward to this.

---Alex

Yeah man this is the only thing thats left to the gentoo devs to do.
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