Gentoo Forums
Gentoo Forums
Gentoo Forums
Quick Search: in
What should we do to these soldiers?
View unanswered posts
View posts from last 24 hours

Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.    Gentoo Forums Forum Index Off the Wall
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
LD
Guru
Guru


Joined: 23 Dec 2003
Posts: 336
Location: Middle of No-Where Granbury, Tx

PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 7:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If by learnt from them you mean capitulate never.

You folk keep screaming about invasion of a soverign country when you talk about Iraq, but the first chance you get to surrender your rights of sovereignty whn it relates to the rights of your soldiers and you are all too willing. Talk about sovereignty about going to war to prevent something bad as an argument against it, but say you can't have your soveriegnty when it comes to going against the UN, does anyone else see the hypocrasy here?
_________________
[Owner/Operator: Dhampir Dreams]
Last.fm profile
Netflix Profile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Naib
Advocate
Advocate


Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 4186
Location: Removed by Neddy

PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 7:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LD wrote:
does anyone else see the hypocrasy here?


Yer I agree. Why invade a country because the ruler has commited war crimes IF you are just going to commit war-crimes yrself

I must admit Americans do have a special kind of stupid
_________________
A free press is the unsleeping guardian of every other right that free men prize; it is the most dangerous foe of tyranny. Where men have the habit of liberty, the Press will continue to be the vigilant guardian of the rights of the ordinary citizen.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
LD
Guru
Guru


Joined: 23 Dec 2003
Posts: 336
Location: Middle of No-Where Granbury, Tx

PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naib wrote:
LD wrote:
does anyone else see the hypocrasy here?


Yer I agree. Why invade a country because the ruler has commited war crimes IF you are just going to commit war-crimes yrself

I must admit Americans do have a special kind of stupid


And Euros seem a special type of coward.
_________________
[Owner/Operator: Dhampir Dreams]
Last.fm profile
Netflix Profile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Naib
Advocate
Advocate


Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 4186
Location: Removed by Neddy

PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LD wrote:


And Euros seem a special type of coward.


Oh I am sorry what country provided 10% of GND troops in Iraq
What country supplied 1/3 of a mech in Iraq
what country supplied all of the beach-landing in Iraq
_________________
A free press is the unsleeping guardian of every other right that free men prize; it is the most dangerous foe of tyranny. Where men have the habit of liberty, the Press will continue to be the vigilant guardian of the rights of the ordinary citizen.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
tchak
Tux's lil' helper
Tux's lil' helper


Joined: 19 Aug 2003
Posts: 124
Location: France/Russia

PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LD wrote:
tchak wrote:
A good solder is deserting (if some one one day will force me to do some army service this is what I will do) or dead solder.
All military are more animals then humans, they have no rights. They just deserves to die because this is what they are signed for.

This kind of behavior (rape, murdering) do not surprise me then it came up to solders. This is the only thing they are capable of...


I find this the mosst insulting and cowardly thing you can say about anyone willing to risk their lives for other people. Absolutly no respect for people who should a lot more courage and and honor in most everyday life then the general public is willing to sacrifice for anyone else.


Go and kill some peoples this what you call curage? Well, we do not use the same definition. Running around with a gun an shutting peoples is not what I call honour. All the guys who volunteered to go do war are or morons or freelance killers (I have more respect for the second ones, they do they job no problems with it). The ones who understud they error ones in on the battle field and do not have courage to desert, they are cowards.
All this kids enrolled in front of they school it is just disgusting. USA sacrifice they own children to the god of war, a country like this can not ask me to respect it.
_________________
maybe this world is another planet's hell...
Athlon64 | ATI Mobility Radeon 9700 | Netgear (Prism54) + ASUS (USB2 ZD1211)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TheWhiteKnight
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 08 Nov 2003
Posts: 180
Location: West Virginia, Ohio, Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tchak wrote:


Go and kill some peoples this what you call curage? Well, we do not use the same definition. Running around with a gun an shutting peoples is not what I call honour. All the guys who volunteered to go do war are or morons or freelance killers (I have more respect for the second ones, they do they job no problems with it). The ones who understud they error ones in on the battle field and do not have courage to desert, they are cowards.
All this kids enrolled in front of they school it is just disgusting. USA sacrifice they own children to the god of war, a country like this can not ask me to respect it.


I for one would gladly risk my life again to help another country out across the world and protect it's people from people like SoDamn Insane and Osama Bin Screwloose, than to sit back and do nothing. I think sitting back and doing nothing and allowing genocide to happen is more of a crime than ANY rape, murder, or anything else. Who is more at fault, the person who commits the attrocity, or the person who sees it and turns their back and does nothing?
_________________
It's interesting how much you learn, you really DON'T know about computers, when you don't have an operating system that configures everything for you.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dresb
n00b
n00b


Joined: 16 Sep 2004
Posts: 62

PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheWhiteKnight wrote:
I for one would gladly risk my life again to help another country out across the world and protect it's people from people like SoDamn Insane and Osama Bin Screwloose, than to sit back and do nothing. I think sitting back and doing nothing and allowing genocide to happen is more of a crime than ANY rape, murder, or anything else. Who is more at fault, the person who commits the attrocity, or the person who sees it and turns their back and does nothing?

That's a really noble thought and I certainly respect that.
The thing is, you think you are going to protect people from the bad guys, when in reality, you are just swapping bad guys for your country's rich people convenience.
Don't you remember? Not too long ago "SoDamn Insane" and "Osama Bin Screwloose" used to be America's best friends.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NeddySeagoon
Administrator
Administrator


Joined: 05 Jul 2003
Posts: 32338
Location: 56N 3W

PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The invaders went into Iraq with a short term aim to win a war, which they did.
They had no idea, and still don't have a clue, how to win the peace afterwards.

The problem is compounded becase Iraq is not a 'real' country. It was created by politicans after the first world war.
None of the three major population groups feel Iraqi. Its much the same Yugoslavia was before it broke up.

I don'r suppose anyone is surprised by the alleged atrocities by the Americans. Remember Vietnam anyone ?
Go and read about it if you don't.

If this thread contines to be a flamewar, the war will be settled by a benovolent dictator. I'll lock it.
_________________
Regards,

NeddySeagoon

Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TheWhiteKnight
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 08 Nov 2003
Posts: 180
Location: West Virginia, Ohio, Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 11:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zencoder wrote:
TheWhiteKnight wrote:
I for one would gladly risk my life again to help another country out across the world and protect it's people from people like SoDamn Insane and Osama Bin Screwloose, than to sit back and do nothing. I think sitting back and doing nothing and allowing genocide to happen is more of a crime than ANY rape, murder, or anything else. Who is more at fault, the person who commits the attrocity, or the person who sees it and turns their back and does nothing?

That's a really noble thought and I certainly respect that.
The thing is, you think you are going to protect people from the bad guys, when in reality, you are just swapping bad guys for your country's rich people convenience.
Don't you remember? Not too long ago "SoDamn Insane" and "Osama Bin Screwloose" used to be America's best friends.


Ah yes, bureacracy. I'm 28. I NEVER agreed with SoDamn and Goosama being our bestest buds. I'm not going to lie. I was against it from the get-go, but who was I? Some dumb kid, not even a teenager. I have a plan, but it would ultimately involve MY assassination. If I was put in charge, I would start some internal house cleaning. Unions, Lobbyists, Justice System, Crooked Polititions Law Enforcement, Welfare, the Patriot Act, the whole 9 yards. I would start cleaning and piss so many people off, I would have to move someplace that no one would find me ad run the country remotly through an SSH ;)

I guess it comes down to this. I will stand behind my country right or wrong, through the face of any adversery, and against all enemies both foreign and domestic. :) While I have toured Europe / Asia, I have to say, there is only one thing that would get me to leave the USA.
_________________
It's interesting how much you learn, you really DON'T know about computers, when you don't have an operating system that configures everything for you.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
LD
Guru
Guru


Joined: 23 Dec 2003
Posts: 336
Location: Middle of No-Where Granbury, Tx

PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tchak wrote:
LD wrote:
tchak wrote:
A good solder is deserting (if some one one day will force me to do some army service this is what I will do) or dead solder.
All military are more animals then humans, they have no rights. They just deserves to die because this is what they are signed for.

This kind of behavior (rape, murdering) do not surprise me then it came up to solders. This is the only thing they are capable of...


I find this the mosst insulting and cowardly thing you can say about anyone willing to risk their lives for other people. Absolutly no respect for people who should a lot more courage and and honor in most everyday life then the general public is willing to sacrifice for anyone else.


Go and kill some peoples this what you call curage? Well, we do not use the same definition. Running around with a gun an shutting peoples is not what I call honour. All the guys who volunteered to go do war are or morons or freelance killers (I have more respect for the second ones, they do they job no problems with it). The ones who understud they error ones in on the battle field and do not have courage to desert, they are cowards.
All this kids enrolled in front of they school it is just disgusting. USA sacrifice they own children to the god of war, a country like this can not ask me to respect it.


I can't even begin to answer this without falling into the realm of personal attack. You are basicallly saying that it's better to just let bad things happen, and think that being willing to stand and serve in battle to defend the lives and freedom of others is tantamount o genocide.

I've called out fellow conservatives for being a bit nutty, I'm not unwilling to say some conservative ideas are stupid. Granted I'm more willing and likely to say that about left wing stuff but I like to think most folk are squarely in the middle, not to ideologically blinded by either side to be able to listen to reason.

And just so you know, I'm military, now former military, and I am not a cold killer nor do I concider myself a moron. That's like me calling you nothing more then a dirty jobless leech cause your French. I've done the generalization thing before, but usually to answer such generalizations myself.
_________________
[Owner/Operator: Dhampir Dreams]
Last.fm profile
Netflix Profile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TheWhiteKnight
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 08 Nov 2003
Posts: 180
Location: West Virginia, Ohio, Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LD wrote:


I can't even begin to answer this without falling into the realm of personal attack. You are basicallly saying that it's better to just let bad things happen, and think that being willing to stand and serve in battle to defend the lives and freedom of others is tantamount o genocide.

I've called out fellow conservatives for being a bit nutty, I'm not unwilling to say some conservative ideas are stupid. Granted I'm more willing and likely to say that about left wing stuff but I like to think most folk are squarely in the middle, not to ideologically blinded by either side to be able to listen to reason.

And just so you know, I'm military, now former military, and I am not a cold killer nor do I concider myself a moron. That's like me calling you nothing more then a dirty jobless leech cause your French. I've done the generalization thing before, but usually to answer such generalizations myself.


Easy bud, don't get the thread locked, as much as I 100% side with you, he is entitled to his opinion.
_________________
It's interesting how much you learn, you really DON'T know about computers, when you don't have an operating system that configures everything for you.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jmbsvicetto
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 4730
Location: Angra do Heroísmo (PT)

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 4:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gentoo_lan wrote:
I am in the military and this is a military matter. The soldiers are bound under the UCMJ, if they commited this crime they will be punished according to the UCMJ. There isn't a need for a long-winded discussion about what should happen to them because I am pretty sure the military can handle the matter itself.

Well, I'm sorry but I disagree with you.
The question of military justice inside one's country is questionable on itself. The notion that a crime accusation against a soldier on a foreign country is something that concerns only the military and should/must be dealt with internally is shocking. As others have asked, what about the victims, his/her family and the other country's legal system? Has Iraq become the 51st state of the US? Why did the US put Saddam Hussein to trial in Iraq?
I find it very disturbing and revealing that the US leadership wants to subject everyone else on the world to their rule (Guantanamo is an extreme proof) and does everything to prevent justice from being applied to its citizens, in particular its soldiers. The US refusal to accept the rule of the International Justice Court is just another instance of the "winners justice". Those who win or can force their will over others are heroes; all those that lose or can't oppose oppresion are "terrorists", "criminals" or "rebels".

[edit]PS - I just want to clarify that I only noticed this thread was locked after I replied.[/edit]

======= edit by NeddySeagoon ============

I read the posts after mine above, locked the thread then made an edit to say it was locked ... and phpbb put me in page 1 of the thread
So I editied the wrong post. My apologies to all participents.

War over - thread locked
_________________
Jorge.

Your twisted, but hopefully friendly daemon.
AMD64 / x86 / Sparc Gentoo
Help answer || emwrap.sh
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.    Gentoo Forums Forum Index Off the Wall All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4
Page 4 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum