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Should we remove FEATURES="candy"
yes
58%
 58%  [ 251 ]
no
41%
 41%  [ 179 ]
Total Votes : 430

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brims
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ferdinando wrote:
Wait: most posts were to get rid of it if it was a problem in terms of performance and/or code simplicity, and I agree with that. But you wrote that very few use it, and I disagree: if you search for "features candy" you'll get 5 pages of topics.


Ya, but did you look at what kind of threads come up? Talking about glibc, modular X, stage 1/3 installation support, the list goes on, and searching for "features candy" as far as I know will match either word within the posts.

Ferdinando wrote:
I wouldn't mind if it were to change in a better spinner, cute, coloured and funny, but I feel that losing this feature completely would be sad.
I've chosen this distribution a long time ago because it gave me the opportunity to find my own compromise between performance and beauty, and I still want to be free to decide.


Changing the spinner to a colorful spinner would be a better idea for the "candy" than a sentence you can't read and it would tend to go along with the rest of the Gentoo tools, with almost every Gentoo specific tool having some sort of color in the output.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pjp wrote:
If removing it helps maintain useful code, then I say remove it. If it is popular enough, maybe modularize it, so it's off in a dark corner by itself.


I second that :)
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kesara
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I didn't knew about such thing.
But its kind of cool and now I'm using it. :D
BTW I'm totally agree with pjp's idea.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 3:56 pm    Post subject: Re: FEATURES="candy" Reply with quote

antarus wrote:
We have a silly feature for emerge that changes the output spinner from a -\|/- repeating type deal, to a random string of characters that form a sentence. However it's rather old and I don't think it's very useful and it's rather large in terms of code. I'm wondering if anyone actually uses it or cares about it. Otherwise I was planning on just taking it out. It doesn't really affect emerge at all ( it's merely cosmetic ), so either way isn't a big deal. Mostly looking to cut out crufty code.


Pros: It's Cool and creative
Cons: I never knew it existed, it's probably not needed and I think it's hard to read, I will not use it in the future either
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,
please keep it, it makes waiting for emerge -au world returning results a little less boring.

Hm, I never had problems reading the sentences (yes, there are several ones), and my machine is not slow - maybe some people's eyes are ;)
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 5:26 pm    Post subject: Looking to be a moot point now... Reply with quote

Votes seem to be for removing the feature.

But I say leave it if its not hurting anything. I'm a sucker for tweaks like this. I also can't be left alone with a ball of yarn either.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 5:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've always liked such easter eggs (and i don't say it just because it easter today :) ). I can only second a lot of people opinion. If it's not a problem in terms of code eficiency or maintainability then keep it.
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born
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really like it!

It would be a pity if you would remove this nice feature ;)
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 12:02 am    Post subject: Pleeeease don't Reply with quote

Please dont remove it. I have ever since used it, since I discovered it.
I have a fast machine and it is funny to try to decipher messages like
"Phasers locked on target, Captain." or so.

I have read many things in this forum, but now it's time to register, save FEATURES="candy"

It really makes waiting for emerge -NuDav world better...
I already thougt about making such thing for emerge --sync either. But times to less for this...
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 12:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like it. Not sure if that's a good enough reason to keep it. But I like deciphering cryptic messages a heck of a lot more than I like seeing a spinning line.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 1:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sponge wrote:
All in all, 29 lines. That doesn't seem like much, even in python.


And just think! If we rewrote portage in Perl, it would be only one line, and unreadable even on the slowest machine!

(i jest because i love!)
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you should keep it in if it doesn't influence the performance of Portage. And as far as I know, even if it does, you wouldn't notice it, because the time the spinner is visible is very short compared to the accually compile en and install time.

I didn't know of this feature (I'm just starting to discover the feature-settings) and I allready love it. To bad my TFT-screen from my laptop doesn't glow... makes reading the sentences a lot harder...
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 5:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There clearly are people here, who use this feature, even more now when this has been made to a topic. So unless there are really heavy reasons for removing, let the candy stay. However, I do agree that colorful spinner would be nice :)
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 5:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My vote: Keep it.

I just learned about it after viewing this forum and it is a nifty little feature.
It runs way too fast on my machine though, I looked at the code and tried changing the coefficient on line 70 from 100 to a smaller number, that definately did not fix the problem. Humm...
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My vote: Kick it.

Same for `emerge moo`. It's just silly.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This feature definitely should be removed, because:

1. Portage is the crucial component of Gentoo. It is definitely not the program to include "fun factor" features. (I see so many comments of Portage having bloated spaghetti code which doesn't break apart just because of good luck...)
2. It should be the basic principle to make the code footprint as small as possible.
3. Removing (useless) code usually helps to maintain the code better. Less time needed to figure out what the hell is this code for. Devs should always aim for good maintenability.
4. Candy doesn't seem to work properly with fast machines.

And maybe you should redesign the default spinner to look slighly better and give more information on the progress?
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naaaa...
/usr/bin/emerge is the perfect place for easter eggs like moo and candy... After all, it is the heart of gentoo and gentoo is really based around a community of humans! So, do not remove these little touches of personality from my daily system updates! We don't want gentoo to become a cold, heartless operating system without cows and the funny pacman-like logo, do we? I've been using candy since day one and I say keep it! I also propose to have the quotes on a separate file (I'm all for customization)!

Just my two cents!
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anello
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Didn't know of the existence of that feature. But now that I do I don't bother either.

So go ahead and remove it.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Keep Candy!
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll agree with a whole bunch of people and say "if it's not INHIBITING portage in any way, keep it." If it doesn't do anything bad to the code or confuse devs, then it's a nifty little feature! same with emerge -pv moo.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ian! wrote:
My vote: Kick it.

Same for `emerge moo`. It's just silly.

I didn't know we weren't allowed to have fun in Gentoo.

Keep it! It's a very few lines of easily maintainable code right at the top of /usr/bin/emerge. It's a nice touch of Gentoo uniqueness.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 6:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ian! wrote:
My vote: Kick it.

Same for `emerge moo`. It's just silly.


I agree. People might think a few lines here and there is no big issue at all. I for one think this is fit for a bugreport.
Quote:
We try not to force you onto anything you don't like. If you feel like we do, please bugreport it.


forcing me to download a bunch of code I never wanted and will never use without even telling me is not the idea I had about gentoo.

I suggest you remove them, and make a patch that re-applies them. then I can USE="candy" if I want them, and everyone will be happy (except me, since I think it's just a waste of (a few kb)*(hundreads of thousands of users)*(each new release of portage) amount of bandwidth. It's puny small numbers, I know, but as these easter-egg kindof things grow and become bigger, I'm forced to spend my time on downloading it even though I actively don't want it.

I repeat: I actively don't want that crap. I came running to linux/gentoo in order to get a clean and efficient system.
This is just as bad as the hidden games in Ms Office 97. (except it's smaller, which makes me tolerate it if now people just have to have it.)
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brims
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 6:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flamie wrote:
I suggest you remove them, and make a patch that re-applies them. then I can USE="candy" if I want them


Now there's an idea, we have the use flags for a reason, don't we? If printing is optional, or java support for OOo is optional (though needed to do anything), why not the "candy"?
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 7:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flamie wrote:
This is just as bad as the hidden games in Ms Office 97.

You know, there's a hidden game in OpenOffice2 too: if you open oocalc2 and put in a cell =game("StarWars") you can play a variant of the old "Space Invaders" (in german though). Anyway, that game probably is coded in less than a kb (as was the old game), and candy isn't that much once bzipped (maybe ten bytes).
Anyway, I vote for the idea to make it optional, and many already suggested to put that code in a module (if it's imported between try and catch you can decide not to have it).

Bye
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 7:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ferdinando wrote:
Flamie wrote:
This is just as bad as the hidden games in Ms Office 97.

You know, there's a hidden game in OpenOffice2 too: if you open oocalc2 and put in a cell =game("StarWars") you can play a variant of the old "Space Invaders" (in german though). Anyway, that game probably is coded in less than a kb (as was the old game), and candy isn't that much once bzipped (maybe ten bytes).
Anyway, I vote for the idea to make it optional, and many already suggested to put that code in a module (if it's imported between try and catch you can decide not to have it).

Bye

In the case of OOo it's a principle matter though: The devs apperently have more priority making games then optimizing, modularizing and unbloating the OOo code.
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