Gentoo Forums
Gentoo Forums
Gentoo Forums
Quick Search: in
emerge -pv output style
View unanswered posts
View posts from last 24 hours

Goto page 1, 2  Next  
Reply to topic    Gentoo Forums Forum Index Gentoo Chat
View previous topic :: View next topic  

Which style do you prefer, and why?
old style
30%
 30%  [ 50 ]
new style
58%
 58%  [ 94 ]
mix of both (please explain)
11%
 11%  [ 18 ]
Total Votes : 162

Author Message
Genone
Retired Dev
Retired Dev


Joined: 14 Mar 2003
Posts: 8690
Location: beyond the rim

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 4:50 pm    Post subject: emerge -pv output style Reply with quote

For portage-2.1_pre there is a new output style for showing use flags and other variables. While the display of these additional vars (like LINGUAS or VIDEO_CARDS) is generally accepted some other changes are currently discussed/reconsidered:

  • changing the sort order from strictly alphabetic to a separation of activated and deactivated flags
  • display of new/changed flags even without -v (can be disabled -q)
  • removing the + prefix from activated flags
  • prefixing the list of USE flags with USE=""

As this might not be very clear here are examples for both the old and new style (sorry, no colors):

New style
Code:
 $ emerge -pv wine
[ebuild   R   ] app-emulation/wine-0.9.5  USE="X alsa cups gif jpeg ldap ncurses opengl truetype xml2 -arts -debug -esd -glut -jack -lcms -nas -oss -scanner" 0 kB

$ USE=-opengl emerge -pv wine
[ebuild   R   ] app-emulation/wine-0.9.5  USE="X alsa cups gif jpeg ldap ncurses truetype xml2 -arts -debug -esd -glut -jack -lcms -nas -opengl* -oss -scanner" 0 kB

$ USE=-opengl emerge -p wine
[ebuild   R   ] app-emulation/wine-0.9.5  USE="-opengl*"


Old style
Code:

$ emerge -pv wine
[ebuild   R   ] app-emulation/wine-0.9.5  +X +alsa -arts +cups -debug -esd +gif -glut -jack +jpeg -lcms +ldap -nas +ncurses +opengl -oss -scanner +truetype +xml2 0 kB

$ USE=-opengl emerge -pv wine
[ebuild   R   ] app-emulation/wine-0.9.5  +X +alsa -arts +cups -debug -esd +gif -glut -jack +jpeg -lcms +ldap -nas +ncurses -opengl* -oss -scanner +truetype +xml2 0 kB

$ USE=-opengl emerge -p wine
[ebuild   R   ] app-emulation/wine-0.9.5


So to get a bit more feedback on the issue I'd like to know which style do you prefer? And maybe even more important, why.


Last edited by Genone on Tue Jan 24, 2006 4:04 pm; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jamesdick628
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 14 Oct 2004
Posts: 158
Location: Worcester, MA

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like the new style better. The separation makes it easier to see which flags are enabled/disabled, and putting USE= in front seems to make it look less cluttered.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ph03n1x
l33t
l33t


Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Posts: 756

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like the new style better. But one could get rid of the USE=" which is just using up console space. I think it's clear that the following stuff are useflags.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
pablo_supertux
Advocate
Advocate


Joined: 25 Jan 2004
Posts: 2552
Location: Somewhere between reality and Middle-Earth and in Freiburg (Germany)

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jamesdick628 wrote:
I like the new style better. The separation makes it easier to see which flags are enabled/disabled


Yes, I agree.
_________________
A! Elbereth Gilthoniel!
silivren penna míriel
o menel aglar elenath,
Gilthoniel, A! Elbereth!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
amne
Bodhisattva
Bodhisattva


Joined: 17 Nov 2002
Posts: 6377
Location: Graz / EU

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: emerge -pv output style Reply with quote

Genone wrote:

  • changing the sort order from strictly alphabetic to a separation of activated and deactivated flags

No big opinion about it, in doubt go with new style.

Genone wrote:

  • display of new/changed flags even without -v

Great idea, haven't even noticed it as i use -v all the time.

Genone wrote:

  • removing the + prefix from activated flags


Good idea as USE doesn't accept + anyway.

Genone wrote:

  • prefixing the list of USE flags with USE=""


No big opinion about it.

So summing it up, i really like the new style portage. Even though only a small amount of things was slightly changed it really feels much better.
_________________
Dinosaur week! (Ok, this thread is so last week)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Maedhros
Bodhisattva
Bodhisattva


Joined: 14 Apr 2004
Posts: 5511
Location: Durham, UK

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm going to be the first voice of dissent here then.

I don't like the new-style sorting - I find it easier to find USE flags if they're in strict alphabetical sorting; the colours are enough to differentiate them IMO. I also don't like the fact that enabling or disabling a flag changes its position in the list. I don't like displaying the USE flags without the -v option set either - I can use it when I want to see which USE flags are enabled, but there are times when I just want a list of packages to be installed. WIth some packages, e.g. PHP, there are so many USE flags that it gets in the way of what I want to see sometimes.

I don't really mind either way about prefixing enabled flags with a +, and while I think the display was slightly cleaner without the USE="" part, it makes sense if we're going to be able to see the other variables that can be enabled as well.
_________________
No-one's more important than the earthworm.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
j-m
Retired Dev
Retired Dev


Joined: 31 Oct 2004
Posts: 975

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maedhros wrote:

I don't like the new-style sorting - I find it easier to find USE flags if they're in strict alphabetical sorting; the colours are enough to differentiate them IMO. I also don't like the fact that enabling or disabling a flag changes its position in the list. I don't like displaying the USE flags without the -v option set either - I can use it when I want to see which USE flags are enabled, but there are times when I just want a list of packages to be installed. WIth some packages, e.g. PHP, there are so many USE flags that it gets in the way of what I want to see sometimes.


+1

New style makes me mad... :roll: :x
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
amne
Bodhisattva
Bodhisattva


Joined: 17 Nov 2002
Posts: 6377
Location: Graz / EU

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maedhros wrote:
I'm going to be the first voice of dissent here then.

Hah, let's burn him on a stake!

Maedhros wrote:

I don't like the new-style sorting - I find it easier to find USE flags if they're in strict alphabetical sorting; the colours are enough to differentiate them IMO. I also don't like the fact that enabling or disabling a flag changes its position in the list.

You may have a point here.

Maedhros wrote:
I don't like displaying the USE flags without the -v option set either - I can use it when I want to see which USE flags are enabled, but there are times when I just want a list of packages to be installed. WIth some packages, e.g. PHP, there are so many USE flags that it gets in the way of what I want to see sometimes.

As far i understand it without -v it would only show new/changed USE-Flags, not all.
_________________
Dinosaur week! (Ok, this thread is so last week)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
omp
Retired Dev
Retired Dev


Joined: 10 Sep 2005
Posts: 1018
Location: Los Angeles, California

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 12:19 am    Post subject: Re: emerge -pv output style Reply with quote

Genone wrote:
changing the sort order from strictly alphabetic to a separation of activated and deactivated flags

Like it a lot.

Genone wrote:
display of new/changed flags even without -v

Don't care.

Genone wrote:
removing the + prefix from activated flags

Like it. Less clutter.

Genone wrote:
prefixing the list of USE flags with USE=""

Dislike it.
_________________
http://omp.am/ - my new domain
http://twitter.com/ompskees - oh noes! twitter :o
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
StringCheesian
l33t
l33t


Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Posts: 887

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 1:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Same as omp.

"display of new/changed flags even without -v" sounds useful, but I'd probably keep using -v anyway to see flags I might want to change.

I'd like to be able to suppress USE="" in the output.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ecatmur
Advocate
Advocate


Joined: 20 Oct 2003
Posts: 3595
Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 7:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

separating active/inactive: :( (alphabetical is good)
removing + from active: :)
prefixing USE="": :)
showing with -v: :)
_________________
No more cruft
dep: Revdeps that work
Using command-line ACCEPT_KEYWORDS?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Etal
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 15 Jul 2005
Posts: 1580

PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't like the USE="" and I actually like the +signs...
But otherwise I like it!
_________________
“And even in authoritarian countries, information networks are helping people discover new facts and making governments more accountable.”– Hillary Clinton, Jan. 21, 2010
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Reikinio
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 14 Aug 2005
Posts: 203
Location: Uruguay

PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I prefer the old style,
Maedhros wrote:

I'm going to be the first voice of dissent here then.

I don't like the new-style sorting - I find it easier to find USE flags if they're in strict alphabetical sorting; the colours are enough to differentiate them IMO. I also don't like the fact that enabling or disabling a flag changes its position in the list. I don't like displaying the USE flags without the -v option set either - I can use it when I want to see which USE flags are enabled, but there are times when I just want a list of packages to be installed. WIth some packages, e.g. PHP, there are so many USE flags that it gets in the way of what I want to see sometimes.

I don't really mind either way about prefixing enabled flags with a +, and while I think the display was slightly cleaner without the USE="" part, it makes sense if we're going to be able to see the other variables that can be enabled as well.

++
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
gentoo_lan
l33t
l33t


Joined: 08 Sep 2004
Posts: 887
Location: Osan AB, South Korea

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 3:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like the idea of removing the + signs and adding the USE=. However I don't think it is necessary to show changed use flags in pretend mode they should only be shown in verbose mode. As long as changed use flags have a different color than I don't care if they are in alphabetical order or not.
_________________
Registered Linux user# 375038.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Bad Penguin
Guru
Guru


Joined: 18 Aug 2004
Posts: 507

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maedhros wrote:
I don't like the new-style sorting - I find it easier to find USE flags if they're in strict alphabetical sorting; the colours are enough to differentiate them IMO. I also don't like the fact that enabling or disabling a flag changes its position in the list. I don't like displaying the USE flags without the -v option set either - I can use it when I want to see which USE flags are enabled, but there are times when I just want a list of packages to be installed. WIth some packages, e.g. PHP, there are so many USE flags that it gets in the way of what I want to see sometimes.


++

Ain't broke, don't fix it :)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Raftysworld
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 27 Feb 2005
Posts: 236
Location: Snohomish, WA

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Honestly, I like every improvement a bit better than the old style. Good work :)
_________________
emerge --info
Portage 2.1.4 (default-linux/x86/dev/2007.1, gcc-4.2.2, glibc-2.7-r1, 2.6.24-gentoo i686)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
loki99
Advocate
Advocate


Joined: 10 Oct 2003
Posts: 2056
Location: Vienna, €urope

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 10:27 pm    Post subject: Re: emerge -pv output style Reply with quote

Genone wrote:


  • changing the sort order from strictly alphabetic to a separation of activated and deactivated flags
  • display of new/changed flags even without -v
  • removing the + prefix from activated flags
  • prefixing the list of USE flags with USE=""



a) :evil: Colours are enough to differentiate plus from minus

b) :D Good idea!

c) :D Less cluttering.

d) :evil: Don't know why, but I hate it.

And BTW: Thanx for asking! 8)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Marlo
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 26 Jul 2003
Posts: 1077

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 11:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The new Style is very good and clear, congratulation to the idea.
One needs only habituation time for use and learn-time to read it.
In the doubt I prefer the old style because I got accustomed with this.

Ma
_________________
The Indian Shankar Drum Ganesh Machine
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
omp
Retired Dev
Retired Dev


Joined: 10 Sep 2005
Posts: 1018
Location: Los Angeles, California

PostPosted: Sat Jan 21, 2006 12:13 am    Post subject: Re: emerge -pv output style Reply with quote

loki99 wrote:
Colours are enough to differentiate plus from minus


Not always do you get colors. An example of this is piping emerge through less.
_________________
http://omp.am/ - my new domain
http://twitter.com/ompskees - oh noes! twitter :o
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
loki99
Advocate
Advocate


Joined: 10 Oct 2003
Posts: 2056
Location: Vienna, €urope

PostPosted: Sat Jan 21, 2006 1:12 am    Post subject: Re: emerge -pv output style Reply with quote

omp wrote:

Not always do you get colors. An example of this is piping emerge through less.


True! Even though, you'd still have the minus to tell which is which.

But giving it a second thought, seperating them would be fine with me, too. :)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SirYes
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 282
Location: Lodz, Poland

PostPosted: Sat Jan 21, 2006 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

New style. It's fun! :D

This change, in contrast to the recent forums change, seems very healthy.
_________________
Here to be: A new signature for 2008
My blog: In search for ultimate programming language
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jstubbs
Retired Dev
Retired Dev


Joined: 05 Jul 2003
Posts: 126
Location: Tokyo

PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2006 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unwittingly, I have created a poll on pretty much the same topic over at http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-426033.html
My goal is more to get hard numbers specifically on the ordering change though so if you'd like to (re)cast your vote there as well as here I'd be much obliged.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
AllenJB
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 02 Sep 2005
Posts: 1282
Location: Ashford, Kent

PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2006 3:27 pm    Post subject: Re: emerge -pv output style Reply with quote

Genone wrote:
For portage-2.1_pre there is a new output style for showing use flags and other variables. While the display of these additional vars (like LINGUAS or VIDEO_CARDS) is generally accepted some other changes are currently discussed/reconsidered:

  • changing the sort order from strictly alphabetic to a separation of activated and deactivated flags
  • display of new/changed flags even without -v
  • removing the + prefix from activated flags
  • prefixing the list of USE flags with USE=""


1) I prefer alphabetical. Perhaps this could be a switch?

2) No opinion - I always use verbose mode.

3) Like it - less cluttered.

4) Don't like it. More clutter. Also, IMO this could encourage use of `USE="<flags>" emerge <package>`, which is bad, particularly for new users who often don't realise the use flags will only apply once.

Allen
_________________
http://gentoo-wiki.com :: http://lug.org.uk :: http://www.linux.org/groups/ :: User Blogs
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ausmusj1
Tux's lil' helper
Tux's lil' helper


Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Posts: 121

PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 12:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I definitely like the new (_pre3) style best - I was a bit surprised when I first saw the output, but I am really loving it. I tend to be a bit of a feature pig - I tend to look more to the disabled list to see if there's any cool or useful functionality that isn't going to be built in that I want - I'm less interested in what I've flagged previously to be enabled.

Another benefit to the new style - if you're on a terminal connection with no color capability, physically separating the enabled from the disabled allows the two groups to be seen more instinctively, once you know what you're looking for.

-James
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
chutz
n00b
n00b


Joined: 03 Feb 2003
Posts: 25
Location: Sapporo

PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 12:51 am    Post subject: Re: emerge -pv output style Reply with quote

Genone wrote:
  • changing the sort order from strictly alphabetic to a separation of activated and deactivated flags
  • display of new/changed flags even without -v
  • removing the + prefix from activated flags
  • prefixing the list of USE flags with USE=""
Voted "mixed", so here is the explanation.

Everything about the new style is better except for the alphabetical sorting part. So,
  • Hate it
  • Don't really care, but it is a nice idea
  • Don't really care, but it is a nice idea
  • Useful when other variables come in time
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Gentoo Forums Forum Index Gentoo Chat All times are GMT
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum