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Major Nugzz
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2003 8:07 pm    Post subject: Linux Certifications Reply with quote

I did search but if i am wrong then feel free to beat me with a noodle;

I was wondering if anyone has opinions on what is the *best* Linux cert to get. I am in a postion where my company might pay for me to get a linux cert but I would want to get the one that would give me the most respect amoung other linux users/admins.

any suggestions?
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AlterEgo
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2003 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You should seek respect from employers :)

I's think the RedHat certification program (RHCE) is the most impressive, because it has an exam that also contains a practical, hands-on test.
You actually need skills instead of reading a book and learning it by heart (ooops flame... :wink: ) But it is not cheap, however you can save a lot of money self-studying.
LPI exams are theoretical, and quite well recognized, and not-so-expensive.
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flickerfly
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2003 7:52 pm    Post subject: LPIC Reply with quote

If AlterEgo was going to get flamed, I suppose I will too but hold on a second...

I'm working twords LPIC. First because it has multiple levels and it's not distro specific (we'll kinda it seems to focus on Debian *apt-get* and RedHat *rpm* a lot). It is also a little out dated, but what good test can keep up with technology? The benefits, a stairway of skills (Lv 1-3). I happen to think an LPIC level 3 (when theiy are done with it) will show much more technical savvy then RHCE. LPI tests can be taken almost anywhere as they use VUE testing centers which are spread throughout the world. They do not have hands-on portions. Compare the prices as well, $100 a test vs. RedHat (I don't recall).

I was seriously going to go with an RHCE myself, but the RedHat centric work really tossed me off and other benefits above remain. I really want to be more flexible than a single distro.

Read all about it like I did and I think you'll be convinced.
http://www.lpi.org

(now you can flame me...)
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AlterEgo
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2003 8:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOL, I'm studying a bit to do LPI myself (so let the flamewars begin 8) ).
I think you're basically right about LPI, flickerfly.
Especially, the UnitedLinux LPI exams could be a really good move (also for fighting the ageing process you so rightly mentioned):
Quote:

The Linux Professional Institute (LPI) (www.lpi.org), the premier professional certification program for the Linux community, and UnitedLinux LLC (www.unitedlinux.com), an industry initiative to streamline Linux development and certification around a global, uniform distribution, have signed a cooperative agreement to market a UnitedLinux professional certification program.

Under the memorandum of understanding, LPI and UnitedLinux will work jointly to create new UnitedLinux specific exams, which, when passed together with the current LPI Levels 1 and 2 exams, will lead to two new UnitedLinux certifications. The new exams are expected to be available during the first quarter of 2003:


LPI's current Level 1 program (101 and 102), with the addition of a 103 UnitedLinux-specific exam, will result in a UnitedLinux Certified Professional (ULCP) certification.
The existing LPI Level 2 program (201 and 202), with the addition of a 203 UnitedLinux-specific exam, will result in a UnitedLinux Certified Expert (ULCE) certification.

Source

(I have yet to see UnitedLinux really take off though...)

But the point I was trying to make is quite simple: if you want to get respect from a (future) employer, RedHat has a big plus, because of the hands-on component in their exams.
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flickerfly
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2003 9:29 pm    Post subject: Corporate Mindset Reply with quote

Yeah, that corporate mindset of looking for a well known cert is probably right.

I can't quite bring myself to learn things just for the purpose of selling myself yet. I'm still young and idealistic. 8)
Give me another 10 years and I'll take "probably" out of my first sentence. :(
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2003 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If a company is going to pay for it, I'd choose whichever I thought was most likely to matter to an employer. After that, I'd consider which I was least likely to do on my own based on time, cost or similar factors. If employers are likely to perceive an RH cert being "better", it is more costly/time consuming, then that would be the route I'd choose.

I have some experience (not extensive) with Novell and Microsoft administration. Neither the CNA or the MCSE has made a difference in helping me find a job. Don't put too much stock into certifications. As for impressing other admins, do that with what you know and your attitude toward what you don't know.
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flickerfly
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2003 1:36 am    Post subject: If a company was paying... Reply with quote

If a company was paying for it, I'd probably go for the RHCE and pick up the LPIC on the side on my own. Get both and I'll pay for the cheaper on ($100) a test. :-)

Or better yet...
Get the company to pay for both at the same time.
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2003 5:27 pm    Post subject: UL + LPI = ULCP Reply with quote

Interesting link found while checking out AlterEgo's UL mentions:

LINUX PROFESSIONAL INSTITUTE AND UNITEDLINUX JOIN FORCES TO CREATE NEW UNITEDLINUX PROFESSIONAL CERTIFICATION PROGRAM
:arrow: http://www.unitedlinux.com/en/press/pr012203a.html

Quote:
LPI and UnitedLinux will work jointly to create new UnitedLinux specific exams, which, when passed together with the current LPI Levels 1 and 2 exams, will lead to two new UnitedLinux certifications.


I wonder if Gentoo could do something like this. It would seem to fit well with the LPI distro-neutral agenda that I so admire, but still allow me to show off skill in Gentoo. AlterEgo could get LPIC, ULCP and GLCP in 4 tests. Any thoughts on what it would take or who should be talked to in order to find out?

:idea:
I like the idea of lots of distro's coming together to do this through LPI. Seems very much like the Linux concept of doing things.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2003 9:27 pm    Post subject: Daniel Robbins and LPIC Reply with quote

According to Daniel Robbin's resume (our Chief Architect) posted here: http://www.gentoo.org/resume.xml he wrote 8 articles on LPI Certification for tests 101 and 102. Do you suppose he is LPIC Certified?

The resume doesn't list certification so it's hard to say if he has any certification at all. Maybe we can lure him in here to comment. (and get some Gentoo - LPI connection going, cause I want an LPIC+G or whatever it would be called.)
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2003 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is Linux Certification Worth It?

An article over at newsfactor.com.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 1:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Linux Certifications Reply with quote

Hi!
Major Nugzz wrote:
I am in a postion where my company might pay for me to get a linux cert but I would want to get the one that would give me the most respect amoung other linux users/admins.


I like the idea of the LPIC. It's a certification which doesn't depend on only one distribution like RHCE and is still well recognised in the linux community. Nevertheless I would not overvalue any certification. Especially in linux nothing beats real experience. IMHO it's only an eye-catcher for personnel manager not to dump your resume right away! Sometimes that makes the difference! :wink:

Best regards,

leemc, LPIC-1
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flickerfly
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

leemc wrote:
leemc, LPIC-1

lol
I had to laugh a bit when noticing your credentials after reading your comments.

I do want to add that a cert is a great way to supplement experience in order to better round out knowledge. That's my purpose in pursueing the LPIC, to find out what areas I'm not getting experience and to learn something. I think there is a balance between the two extremes as there are in most things. :)

zawze wrote:
Is Linux Certification Worth It?

An article over at newsfactor.com.

I had a friend pass that on to me last week I think. It is a good article that I enjoyed. Not many people commented on it though. It did make a good point about how long those things last, I hadn't thought about that, but am glad to see my desired cert did. (LPI) :D
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leemc
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 2:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi!
flickerfly wrote:
leemc wrote:
leemc, LPIC-1

lol
I had to laugh a bit when noticing your credentials after reading your comments.


You noticed the ironic point? :wink:

flickerfly wrote:
I do want to add that a cert is a great way to supplement experience in order to better round out knowledge.


Exactly! During my studying for the LPIC-1 I learned more about concepts and tools which I haven't been aware of. It gives you a structured overview of linux.

flickerfly wrote:
That's my purpose in pursueing the LPIC, to find out what areas I'm not getting experience and to learn something. I think there is a balance between the two extremes as there are in most things. :)


I fully agree with you! That was also my motivation in pursueing the LPIC. The nice side effect is to be certified as well :-)

Best regards,

leemc
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2003 3:41 pm    Post subject: request: LPIC Resources & Suggestions Reply with quote

leemc wrote:
Exactly! During my studying for the LPIC-1 I learned more about concepts and tools which I haven't been aware of. It gives you a structured overview of linux.


I appreciate that confirmation of my theory. I have also found this to be the case in the little I've done so far. (apropos for example)
Since we're on the subject, what tools did you find useful in your drive towards LPIC? I've currently got:

I'm wide open for helpful resources and suggestions you may have.

Any suggestions concerning balancing my relationship with my wife and studying for LPI is also welcome. She is wonderfully supportive of my study, but still misses me when I'm lost in my books. :D
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 21, 2003 2:24 pm    Post subject: Re: request: LPIC Resources & Suggestions Reply with quote

Hi!
flickerfly wrote:


I used the book from Dean for my LPIC-1 preparations. But you won't pass the exams by only studying Dean's book except you already have some experience in the administration of a linux system (well, as a Gentoo user you should have that experience...). It should only be a guide through the exam topics. It's a good idea that you consult other linux books for your exam preparations as well. You must also IMHO have some hands on experience.

flickerfly wrote:

I'm wide open for helpful resources and suggestions you may have.


I would take 101 first because it is easier to pass than 102. I had to learn more and carefully for 102 myself. Time is not really an issue because you have 150 min (only if you take the BETA exams) for about 100 multiple-choice and fill-in-the-blanks questions. Have also a closer look at the most important switches of commands. As for the helpful resources I have a link where you can buy books at a large discount: http://www.bookpool.com (I don't work for them! ;-)) Talking about books: Does anyone know a good book for LPIC-2 exams?

flickerfly wrote:

Any suggestions concerning balancing my relationship with my wife and studying for LPI is also welcome. She is wonderfully supportive of my study, but still misses me when I'm lost in my books. :D


Well, she still misses you - so your balancing management seems to be working very well! :D

Best regards,

leemc
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 21, 2003 10:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMHO (though, as an RHCE, it may be biased)...

Which cert you want to get largely depends on your current skill set, who is paying for what, and why you want certified.

The RHCE is currently the best Linux cert on the market, espically for people looking for a new job (don't believe me? Do a few job searchs w/ RHCE then LPI and see what comes up.).

Depending on current skill set, you might want to go with LPI 1&2 while working up to RHCE. However, another option is the fairly new Redhat RHCT, which is an easier version of the RHCE. You can either take it as a separate test, or if you take the RHCE and don't pass but score high enough, they will credit you for the RHCT. While this is not a cheap way to get the RHCE, it might work for you. Many employers only reemburse for passed certs. If you spend $700 on the RHCE exam and at least come back with *A* cert (RHCT), you might be able to get your HR to pay for it (even though technically you failed the RHCE).

If your employer wants to send you to class, I would not at all recommend the RHCE Rapid Track course. I took the course and thought it was all but worthless. Spent the first two days going over Linux/Redhat basics (e.g. 1/2 a day on rpm switches), and while it did make the multiple choice part easier (for 2k+...for $40 exam cram would have done the same), it helped my little to none on the install and tb-shoot sections.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2003 2:26 am    Post subject: Re: request: LPIC Resources & Suggestions Reply with quote

leemc wrote:
I used the book from Dean for my LPIC-1 preparations. <cut/> It should only be a guide through the exam topics. It's a good idea that you consult other linux books for your exam preparations as well. You must also IMHO have some hands on experience.

I'd heard that elsewhere. That's why I picked up the other one. I'm planning on using it as a refresher before the test, etc.

leemc wrote:
I would take 101 first because it is easier to pass than 102. I had to learn more and carefully for 102 myself. Time is not really an issue because you have 150 min (only if you take the BETA exams) for about 100 multiple-choice and fill-in-the-blanks questions. Have also a closer look at the most important switches of commands. As for the helpful resources I have a link where you can buy books at a large discount: http://www.bookpool.com (I don't work for them! ;-)) Talking about books: Does anyone know a good book for LPIC-2 exams?

That's all good advice. I was wondering about how the time press was and figured I'd take them in numerical order, but hadn't even considered it possible to do the contrary. The book by the Nash's does a great job of putting important switches in an easy to read chart form for study (just in case anyone else was wondering). I didn't noticed many, if any, LPIC-2 books when I was looking for the LPIC-1 books and was wondering about that myself.

leemc wrote:
Well, she still misses you - so your balancing management seems to be working very well! :D


Sounds like wisdom from experience. Thanks.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2003 2:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raccroc wrote:
IMHO (though, as an RHCE, it may be biased)...

:)

Raccroc wrote:
Which cert you want to get largely depends on your current skill set, who is paying for what, and why you want certified.

The RHCE is currently the best Linux cert on the market, espically for people looking for a new job (don't believe me? Do a few job searchs w/ RHCE then LPI and see what comes up.).

That's a good point. RedHat is the premier Linux distro (in the States at least, I understand SUSE is big in Europe).

Raccroc wrote:
<cut/> If you spend $700 on the RHCE exam and at least come back with *A* cert (RHCT), you might be able to get your HR to pay for it (even though technically you failed the RHCE).
Nice insight. Hadn't thought about that.

Raccroc wrote:
If your employer wants to send you to class, I would not at all recommend the RHCE Rapid Track course. I took the course and thought it was all but worthless. Spent the first two days going over Linux/Redhat basics (e.g. 1/2 a day on rpm switches), and while it did make the multiple choice part easier (for 2k+...for $40 exam cram would have done the same), it helped my little to none on the install and tb-shoot sections.
...and after all that, how much of the training and knowledge is RedHat centric? That's my biggest concern. I used to use RedHat and Mandrake. They were better than Windows, but in the end when I moved into the Slackware, Debian, and Gentoo world there was a large percentage of skills that I couldn't take with me and I found that I didn't know as much as I thought I did. If I take an RH Cert will I learn how to do things there way, and not really get what I want (an overall useful rounding of my knowledge).

I know others goals are different, and therefore this track is best for them.

The wonderful world of Linux... Multiple ways to similar places and we get what we wan't (not what someone else wants). In the end we have to think too. (I'm for the forcing of the public to think rather than accept as fed.)
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2003 9:54 am    Post subject: Linux Cert Reply with quote

SAIR linux i think is the best
go to www.linuxcertification.com/
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2003 8:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Linux Cert Reply with quote

yucao89 wrote:
SAIR linux i think is the best
go to www.linuxcertification.com/


That website looks rather impressive, even to the point where I might reconsider my approach to certification. What exactly has your experience been with them?
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