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alistair
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 9:58 pm    Post subject: Linux indepth kernel manual Reply with quote

Does anyone know a good manual that goes into a lot of detail as to how the linux kernel works. I need some light reading :)
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[n00b@localhost]
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Operating Systems - Design and Implementation by Andrew Tanenbaum and Albert Woodhull

I have not read this but our university lecturer recommended it to us. It is about minix which is an ancestor of linux and a good (simpler) starting point to understanding the linux kernel.
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Taladar
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 11:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Modern Operating Systems by Andrew Tanenbaum is a nice general one (meaning it introduces the kernel related problem domains without too much OS specific information) too. You should be able to identify the function of most core source code files
after reading that one. From there it is probably best to read the code as the kernel changes too fast for anyone to write a complete documentation about it.
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dsd
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

robert love's "Linux Kernel Development" (2nd ed) is the best resource i've come into contact with, and it is very up-to-date too. it does assume a good knowledge of C (or plenty of patience!) as it dives straight into the structures used internally in the kernel source
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ChristyMcJesus
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 9:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[n00b@localhost] wrote:
Operating Systems - Design and Implementation by Andrew Tanenbaum and Albert Woodhull

I have not read this but our university lecturer recommended it to us. It is about minix which is an ancestor of linux and a good (simpler) starting point to understanding the linux kernel.


Except that minix is totally unrelated and uses a radically different architechture. AST vehemently defends himself whenever anyone suggests Linus ripped off his code. He considers Linux a terrible piece of engineering :lol: If you want to learn about microkernels and message passing though, this book may be of interest.

As for learning about the kernel - in good old Unix tradition "source code is documentation!"
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tecknojunky
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 12:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taladar wrote:
Modern Operating Systems by Andrew Tanenbaum is a nice general one (meaning it introduces the kernel related problem domains without too much OS specific information) too. You should be able to identify the function of most core source code files
after reading that one. From there it is probably best to read the code as the kernel changes too fast for anyone to write a complete documentation about it.
Ditto for Tanenbaum's book. I usualy get rid of University books I bought that I then find irrelevant (ie: 68k assembly), but this one I have kept because it explains well the generalities of all OS basics, like schedulers, file systems, memory managments, ressources deadlocks, ... If you understand everything that is in that book, you're up for a good start to hack any OS afterward.


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Q-collective
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yay, this thread made it into the GWN \o/

I wonder why to be honest.
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butters
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 4:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dsd wrote:
robert love's "Linux Kernel Development" (2nd ed) is the best resource i've come into contact with, and it is very up-to-date too. it does assume a good knowledge of C (or plenty of patience!) as it dives straight into the structures used internally in the kernel source


Looks great. I wish it were free (gratis). Not because I'm a cheapstake (which I am), but because I like instant gratification in my light reading, and this requires a paper copy being shipped to me. I have time and interest to spend reading about the Linux kernel now, but not necessarily in a few days.

Does this make me a bad person, or... (gasp) a communist?
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aidy
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 7:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's nothing wrong with communists, don't be scared! But on topic: of course you're no communist if you think like that...
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ChristyMcJesus
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

IBM have a newbie guide to kernel hacking, but you have to register (free) on their website to get at their stuff.

http://www-128.ibm.com/developerworks/edu/l-dw-linux-kernelhack1-i.html

Part one seems to be just config+compile, which is hardly groundbreaking stuff for any Gentooist. Part two is called "making your first hack" so it's all good.
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DawgG
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

there's a nice book from o`reilly: understanding the linux kernel.
http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/linuxkernel/
too bad it's only about 2.4.
i read a little bit of it; covers a lot of basics but you certainly gotta invest a lot of time.
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matthies
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 10:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another good book (and available online) is Linux Device Drivers, 3rd ed.
Please buy a copy if you enjoy this -- if no one buys these free books then i guess similar books won't be made available freely in the future. It's also much nicer reading a real book than pdf's on screen, imho.
http://lwn.net/Kernel/LDD3/
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tecknojunky
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

matthies wrote:
It's also much nicer reading a real book than pdf's on screen, imho.
I'm sure the trees disagrees with that.
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ChristyMcJesus
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 4:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tecknojunky wrote:
matthies wrote:
It's also much nicer reading a real book than pdf's on screen, imho.
I'm sure the trees disagrees with that.

They can't disagree. They're trees.
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D2T
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChristyMcJesus wrote:
tecknojunky wrote:
matthies wrote:
It's also much nicer reading a real book than pdf's on screen, imho.
I'm sure the trees disagrees with that.

They can't disagree. They're trees.


I guess they'd have to disatree?

*rimshot*
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leo.fontenelle
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:31 am    Post subject: "official" recommendations Reply with quote

Sorry if I'm being obvious here, but /usr/src/linux/Documentation/kernel-docs.txt lists and comments a lot of relevant books, both on-line and printed. Updated versions should be seeked here.
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nephros
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 9:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChristyMcJesus wrote:
tecknojunky wrote:
matthies wrote:
It's also much nicer reading a real book than pdf's on screen, imho.
I'm sure the trees disagrees with that.

They can't disagree. They're trees.

You obvioulsy haven't read The Lord of the Rings. There's a bunch of trees disagreeing quite vehemently in there.
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IvanYosifov
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nephros wrote:
ChristyMcJesus wrote:
tecknojunky wrote:
matthies wrote:
It's also much nicer reading a real book than pdf's on screen, imho.
I'm sure the trees disagrees with that.

They can't disagree. They're trees.

You obvioulsy haven't read The Lord of the Rings. There's a bunch of trees disagreeing quite vehemently in there.

Yeah :) Only that what those trees feel is somewhat improtant to plot-development :)

No, I am not in the go-chop-them-all! camp, but untill I get that nice TFT screen I'll go for printed books.
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ChristyMcJesus
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

IvanYosifov wrote:
You obvioulsy haven't read The Lord of the Rings. There's a bunch of trees disagreeing quite vehemently in there.

Last time I went to visit the family my brother made me play one of the crappy games they made based on LotR. It's kinda funny when a bunch of Ents come running in and punt your orcs over the wall.
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alistair
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 11:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

its nice to see my thread is going so well. thanks to all you guys.
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djsmiley2k
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 1:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hum, i'm now in the process of moving into my new flat and the wireless network isn't up yet due to BT being annoying. So in the meantime i have about 6 weeks of linux time i can spend playing around. However i can't go online at all (well not without a 15min walk to my gfs house).


Anyone care to suggest books which are nice enough to allow a noobie (such as me - installed gentoo for 3months?) to approch them, but maybe give me enough to keep me interested?

Cheers.

As for topics im willing to try anything really, a linux relation would be nice, but just general computer realtion will do fine. Programming is a possibilty as its something i wish to improve upon. Either java or C.

Thanks,
djsmiley2k
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aidy
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try 'Beginning Linux Programming', I bought it on amazon. As for C books: I can only suggest you a C++ book, I never learnt any C techniques other than pointers :D - the book is called 'Thinking in C++' and it is Uberly well written. It is also freely avaiable from the net, google for it.
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eniac
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[n00b@localhost] wrote:
Operating Systems - Design and Implementation by Andrew Tanenbaum and Albert Woodhull

I have not read this but our university lecturer recommended it to us. It is about minix which is an ancestor of linux and a good (simpler) starting point to understanding the linux kernel.


Have you read it , I gues not since it's not about minix it's about Operating systems in _ general _ he talks about unix linux and even windows stuff ..
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eniac
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 11:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LordMyth wrote:
Try 'Beginning Linux Programming', I bought it on amazon. As for C books: I can only suggest you a C++ book, I never learnt any C techniques other than pointers :D - the book is called 'Thinking in C++' and it is Uberly well written. It is also freely avaiable from the net, google for it.


Why do you want to learn C++ while the linux kernel is written in C and ASM ?
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eniac
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Q-collective wrote:
Yay, this thread made it into the GWN \o/

I wonder why to be honest.



I really wonder _why_ ??
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