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nixnut
Administrator
Joined: 09 Apr 2004
Posts: 10951
Location: the dutch mountains
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 Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 6:16 pm Post subject: Re: Where is the FREEDOM of Gentoo services??? |
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| DremK wrote: | I use a FREE SYSTEM for its freedoms but i'm indignant in which several services of a free system are limiting OUR FREDOM.
#gentoo channel is the only one that forces tor users to need request voice, and isn't possible post a message and these forums. Simply because people were using Tor to abuse the forums.
I think that it's always possible to be taken other alternatives but sure that was the easiest way (doesn't let tor users)
i.e. developing a plugin so that forum users can indicate if a message is a spam. To the 5 indications the administator would be notified for to checking it.
If you think it's not just about spam, it's also about tracking people who have been banned. I say you that you will not be able to tracking to users with a dynamic ip.
There are a lot of countries and mega-corporations that they want to control everything what we do or to say.
In Spain, France, and i think that it'll be in all countries of E.U. , all communications through Internet will be logged (if its not already done  ). Aside from which systems like carnivore or echelon exist.
So Gentoo is letting that all my communication is being to logged like minimum for my country. |
So? You are blaming us for the fact that your country logs your traffic?
Sorry, but that's just plain silly.
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DremK
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 08 Jun 2004
Posts: 83
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| Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:39 pm Post subject: Re: Where is the FREEDOM of Gentoo services??? |
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| nixnut wrote: | So? You are blaming us for the fact that your country logs your traffic?
Sorry, but that's just plain silly. |
Of course that no! I simply give a very good reason for which many users to use TOR
But you're limiting the freedom of many users, actual tor users and future tor users.
And that happens this in several services (forum and irc channel) based on a free operating system is very contradictory.
It raises when another solution could be looked for like which I already said in my previous post. But for you it's easier to limit the freedom of users.
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amne
Bodhisattva
Joined: 17 Nov 2002
Posts: 6377
Location: Graz / EU
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| Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:55 pm Post subject: Re: Where is the FREEDOM of Gentoo services??? |
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| DremK wrote: |
It raises when another solution could be looked for like which I already said in my previous post. But for you it's easier to limit the freedom of users. |
But it's ok for the tor users to limit our freedom by demanding us to do as they say (either allow tor or code something so they can get their threads rated or whatever)? We already implemented r/o acces for tor users and there are lots of things affecting non-tor users as well such as subforums, switching to UTF-8 etc. These things are more important.
Things aren't that simple all the time and simply repeating TOR=FREEDOM, BANNING TOR = NOT FREEDOM just doesn't describe reality.
We banned tor for a reason and we currently don't have interest in spending more time taking care of people who abused tor and the forums. Please complain to those guys, not us.
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DremK
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 08 Jun 2004
Posts: 83
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| Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:31 pm Post subject: I don't use a system which is limiting OUR FREDOM |
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I'm impressed when I see the use of free software to reduce the users freedom.
#gentoo channel is the only one that forces tor users to need request voice, and isn't possible post a message and these forums. Simply because people were using Tor to abuse the forums.
I LET TO USE GENTOO!
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Archangel_Lock
n00b
Joined: 08 Dec 2005
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2005 7:41 am Post subject: Admin and Moderator Behavior |
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I came across this site quite by accident, and was completely amazed by the content of this thread and the hostility therein.
The Admins and Moderators that have posted here are rude and certainly didn't give me a welcoming feeling.
Both pilla and nixnut come across as smart-mouthed jackasses that should have their mouths bricked shut. Pilla just takes the cake for rudeness. I mean really.
No wonder this forum has been spammed and flamed by anonymous Tor users, you clowns ask for it with every ridiculing and smartassed stupid comment you make. You seem to think you're all so clever with all your little put-down replies to everyone. Well, you ain't so clever. You come across very poorly, like little children insulting each other. Shame on you.
You really do need an admin's admin to act like an adult and ban the numbskull admins here. The only one who comes across decently is ian!.
I only created this ID and logged in to post this opinion, so that's it, I'm off, never to return to this insipid site.
Idiots. |
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pilla
Administrator
Joined: 07 Aug 2002
Posts: 7184
Location: Pelotas, BR
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| Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2005 7:08 pm Post subject: Re: Admin and Moderator Behavior |
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| Archangel_Lock wrote: |
Both pilla and nixnut come across as smart-mouthed jackasses that should have their mouths bricked shut. Pilla just takes the cake for rudeness. I mean really.
...
I only created this ID and logged in to post this opinion, so that's it, I'm off, never to return to this insipid site.
Idiots. |
Goodbye.
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schmutzfinger
Veteran
Joined: 26 Oct 2003
Posts: 1287
Location: Dresden/Germany
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 12:23 pm Post subject: |
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There have been many arguments why admins and mods might want to block tor users. Imho tor access should not be blocked at all, no matter what problems it might cause. There has to be another way to deal with these problems.
If one wants to abuse the forums it can be done anyway. And I believe it can be done with any other anon proxy or public proxy+tor, because you probably dont block all of them. Blocking tor can not protect the forums from abuse it only pisses regular tor users. |
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amne
Bodhisattva
Joined: 17 Nov 2002
Posts: 6377
Location: Graz / EU
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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| schmutzfinger wrote: | | There have been many arguments why admins and mods might want to block tor users. Imho tor access should not be blocked at all, no matter what problems it might cause. There has to be another way to deal with these problems. |
I find it really funny you want something "no matter what problems it might cause" - probably because you are not the one who will have to deal with cleaning up whatever mess it causes. Of course there may be other ways to solve this, e.g. each staff member getting paid 2500 Euros for moderating the forums all the time instead of their current job.
In reality we are all volunteers who have limited time resources to moderate these forums - and hence little interest to waste a big amount of it on certain tor users.
| schmutzfinger wrote: | | If one wants to abuse the forums it can be done anyway. And I believe it can be done with any other anon proxy or public proxy+tor, because you probably dont block all of them. Blocking tor can not protect the forums from abuse it only pisses regular tor users. |
Of course there other proxies or possibilities to be abusive on our forums, but banning tor cut down our workload.
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Ateo
Advocate
Joined: 02 Jun 2003
Posts: 2019
Location: https://reno.envy.us
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2006 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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perhaps the mods can explain it to me like I'm a 4 year old.
Why, exactly, are Tor users banned from READING posts? I am curious to know just exactly how READING the forums is abuse. Why a user uses Tor should be of absolutely NO concern to any of the Mods/Admins. It's READING, not posting.
I think it's totally unfair to ban Tor users from READING the forums. I concur from a previous post that either someone is too lazy to change the phpBB code to allow READ ONLY rights for Tor users OR a PHP programmer with the ability to do this just doesn't exist here.
I can understand why you wouldn't let Tor users post, but to read? Give me a break. That's utterly ridiculous and seems like a power trip to me.
Again, why someone chooses to use Tor should be of no importance in answering why someone wants to READ these forums using Tor. It's simply none of your business.
ps. I am unbiased. I do not use Tor. |
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amne
Bodhisattva
Joined: 17 Nov 2002
Posts: 6377
Location: Graz / EU
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2006 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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Tor users aren't banned from reading posts. 
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Ateo
Advocate
Joined: 02 Jun 2003
Posts: 2019
Location: https://reno.envy.us
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2006 7:04 pm Post subject: |
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| amne wrote: | | Tor users aren't banned from reading posts. |
wait wait. what? I thought that what everyone was bitching about? I must have missed that little fine print then... =O |
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amne
Bodhisattva
Joined: 17 Nov 2002
Posts: 6377
Location: Graz / EU
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2006 7:10 pm Post subject: |
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Our first approach completely banned tor users (because it was easier to implement at that time), but we sometimes even listen to people's complained and once tomk got to making the necessary modifications a read-only mode for tor users was introduced.
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tomk
Administrator
Joined: 23 Sep 2003
Posts: 6793
Location: Sat in front of my computer
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2006 7:16 pm Post subject: |
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When it was originally implemented reading wasn't permitted, but once we found a reliable way of allowing read-only access we added that functionality. Basically if you're using Tor you'll get the same rights as if you were not logged in (except you cannot register a new account).
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