| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
jimbo62
n00b
Joined: 13 Jun 2005
Posts: 37
Location: Utah
|
 Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2005 7:48 am Post subject: Gentoo - A Beginner's Perspective |
 |
|
I am a Gentoo beginner and a Linux noob. I have installed several Live CD distros, Knoppix, Mepis, PCLinuxOS, Peanut, Slax, DSLinux and Puppy. And I have installed Mandriva 10.1, Debian Sarge and Gentoo r9. IMHO, Gentoo, far and away, has the most complete and detailed documentation, the most active forum and the most helpful forum. I have yet to see a call for help answered with a patronizing "RTFM". Installation of Mandriva was simpler, a lot was configured to defaults that worked on my system. I used the "net install" option for both Debian and Gentoo. Gentoo took longer and required more configuration. As a result, I learned more about Linux than I did from all of the other distro installations combined. Who would have thought that I could sucessfully compile a kernel? Or recompile the kernel later to add support for the ntfs file system? The portage package manager makes software installation and updates painless. My only concern is the time it takes to install the larger applications. It took between 9 and 12 hours to completely install KDE. I gave up and went to bed after 9 hours. I woke up 3 hours later and installation was complete. I suppose installation from a CD would speed things up some. I guess that is the price you pay for all of the flexibility. Anyway, just some thoughts from a Gentoo beginner.
Thanks Gentoo, jimbo |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ansient
Guru
Joined: 22 Jan 2005
Posts: 445
Location: Argentina
|
| Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2005 7:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
Free tip: press enter more often. It makes posts easier to read 
To make emerges painless:
So you can:
| Code: | screen -xR <name> # suggest using "emerge" for the <name>
nice emerge <flags> <packages> # (the "nice" gives the process a lower priority,
# so you can run other programs without a slowdown)
CTRL+A, then press D |
Now from any terminal when you want to check the progress of this emerge, simply:
| Code: | | screen -xR # (or -xR <name>, if you have more than one screen running) |
And to go back:
| Code: | | CTRL+A, then press D |
Cool huh? screen is very useful for other things as well... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jlpence
n00b
Joined: 21 May 2005
Posts: 50
Location: Kansas, USA
|
| Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2005 8:02 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | My only concern is the time it takes to install the larger applications. It took between 9 and 12 hours to completely install KDE. |
Another free tip: Next time grab the packages CD. I can go from beginning of install to playing around in KDE in about an hour using it. Takes a _LOT_ of pain out of the install.
Hell, third free tip: Enjoy the learning experience. Two years ago I was just tired of Windows and wanted something new. Today I'm tossing together a live CD custom tailored to my system. GNU/Linux is like the most awesome video game ever - there's always something new to explore, something new to learn. Keep an open mind and you will have much fun. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jimbo62
n00b
Joined: 13 Jun 2005
Posts: 37
Location: Utah
|
| Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2005 2:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks for the tips.
jimbo |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Carlo
Developer
Joined: 12 Aug 2002
Posts: 3356
|
| Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2005 4:59 pm Post subject: Re: Gentoo - A Beginner's Perspective |
|
|
| jimbo62 wrote: | | I have yet to see a call for help answered with a patronizing "RTFM". |
Since you seem to have missed it: RTFM. The doc herd puts a lot of work into it and it's worth reading. 
_________________
Please make sure that you have searched for an answer to a question after reading all the relevant docs. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Lokheed
Veteran
Joined: 12 Jul 2004
Posts: 1295
Location: /usr/src/linux
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 18, 2005 12:23 am Post subject: Re: Gentoo - A Beginner's Perspective |
|
|
| jimbo62 wrote: | | I suppose installation from a CD would speed things up some. |
No it wouldnt. Installing a binary would speed things up. Compiling from source takes time since you are creating the binaries as apposed to having them ready for you and merely putting them in the right places (which is what installation is). Gentoo is a "from source" distro, meaning you compile everything. There are some benefits to this of course but there are also benefits to taking 3 min. to install OOo instead of 9 hours.
The faster your machine, the less wait in compiling.
_________________
You're not afraid of the dark are you? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jimbo62
n00b
Joined: 13 Jun 2005
Posts: 37
Location: Utah
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 18, 2005 2:05 am Post subject: Re: Gentoo - A Beginner's Perspective |
|
|
| Carlo wrote: | | jimbo62 wrote: | | I have yet to see a call for help answered with a patronizing "RTFM". |
Since you seem to have missed it: RTFM. The doc herd puts a lot of work into it and it's worth reading. |
No, I haven't missed it. Gentoo has IMHO the most complete and most detailed documentation of any distro that I have tried. My point was that the Gentoo forum folks seem to have more patience with noob questions than other forums.
jimbo |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
edudlive
Guru
Joined: 06 Jan 2004
Posts: 557
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 18, 2005 9:32 am Post subject: Re: Gentoo - A Beginner's Perspective |
|
|
| jimbo62 wrote: | I am a Gentoo beginner and a Linux noob. I have installed several Live CD distros, Knoppix, Mepis, PCLinuxOS, Peanut, Slax, DSLinux and Puppy. And I have installed Mandriva 10.1, Debian Sarge and Gentoo r9. IMHO, Gentoo, far and away, has the most complete and detailed documentation, the most active forum and the most helpful forum. I have yet to see a call for help answered with a patronizing "RTFM". Installation of Mandriva was simpler, a lot was configured to defaults that worked on my system. I used the "net install" option for both Debian and Gentoo. Gentoo took longer and required more configuration. As a result, I learned more about Linux than I did from all of the other distro installations combined. Who would have thought that I could sucessfully compile a kernel? Or recompile the kernel later to add support for the ntfs file system? The portage package manager makes software installation and updates painless. My only concern is the time it takes to install the larger applications. It took between 9 and 12 hours to completely install KDE. I gave up and went to bed after 9 hours. I woke up 3 hours later and installation was complete. I suppose installation from a CD would speed things up some. I guess that is the price you pay for all of the flexibility. Anyway, just some thoughts from a Gentoo beginner.
Thanks Gentoo, jimbo |
RTFM n00b! 
Sorry, had to. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
HomerSimpson
l33t
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
Posts: 869
Location: Ohio, USA
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 18, 2005 11:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
Welcome to Gentoo.
_________________
The strong must protect the Sweet. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
oracleofmist
Apprentice
Joined: 19 Jun 2004
Posts: 235
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 18, 2005 12:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
[quote="jlpence"] | Quote: |
Hell, third free tip: Enjoy the learning experience. Two years ago I was just tired of Windows and wanted something new. Today I'm tossing together a live CD custom tailored to my system. GNU/Linux is like the most awesome video game ever - there's always something new to explore, something new to learn. Keep an open mind and you will have much fun. |
I'm getting ready to level up my Desktop
_________________
Segmentation Fault |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Carlo
Developer
Joined: 12 Aug 2002
Posts: 3356
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 18, 2005 1:00 pm Post subject: Re: Gentoo - A Beginner's Perspective |
|
|
| jimbo62 wrote: | | No, I haven't missed it. |
I meant the rtfm, not the docs. Have fun with Gentoo.
_________________
Please make sure that you have searched for an answer to a question after reading all the relevant docs. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
plumboy
n00b
Joined: 09 Mar 2005
Posts: 12
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 18, 2005 1:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
i can't disagree more than your tips.
gentoo has the most readable doc.
but the compilation is long......................................................................................................much longer than these dots...............................................................................................
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
djs
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 13 Dec 2002
Posts: 96
Location: CA
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 18, 2005 5:39 pm Post subject: forget 'nice emerge' |
|
|
just set PORTAGE_NICENESS=19 in /etc/make.conf
I'm a huge fan of screen though. I use it to log into my machine from work and start an emerge of something big like a new Gnome version detach and then logout. By the time I get home, it's done.
/djs |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
flupke
n00b
Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Posts: 11
Location: Belgium
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 18, 2005 9:08 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | just set PORTAGE_NICENESS=19 in /etc/make.conf
|
Great tip, thanks!
Maybe a bit OT, but for yall screen users, here is something to put in the screenrc :
| Code: | hardstatus alwayslastline "%D %M %d - %c -- %w"
caption always "%h"
|
Personally, it has enlightened my screen experience...
HTH
Flupke
_________________
<< There's no place like ~! >> |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
IvanYosifov
l33t
Joined: 15 Oct 2004
Posts: 778
Location: Bulgaria
|
| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 2:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
just set PORTAGE_NICENESS=19 in /etc/make.conf
|
What for ? Make it even slower !? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ansient
Guru
Joined: 22 Jan 2005
Posts: 445
Location: Argentina
|
| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 2:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| IvanYosifov wrote: | | Quote: |
just set PORTAGE_NICENESS=19 in /etc/make.conf
|
What for ? Make it even slower !? |
No. Give it a lower priority. man nice for details |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
IvanYosifov
l33t
Joined: 15 Oct 2004
Posts: 778
Location: Bulgaria
|
| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 2:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
Give it a lower priority.
|
Exactly. Make long compiles longer. This should be done only on slow machines where compiling noticeably decreases responsiveness. I this thread I see complains about compile-time, not responsiveness. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ansient
Guru
Joined: 22 Jan 2005
Posts: 445
Location: Argentina
|
| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 2:49 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| IvanYosifov wrote: | | Quote: |
Give it a lower priority.
|
Exactly. Make long compiles longer. |
It does not make compiles take longer unless the machine is being used for other things.
If the machine is being used for other things, those things are probably a higher priority. Niceness is how you tell the kernel this. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
IvanYosifov
l33t
Joined: 15 Oct 2004
Posts: 778
Location: Bulgaria
|
| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 3:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
The idea I am trying to comunicate is:
The default nice ( 0 ) should not be altered unless you are noticing click-responce-lag or some other ill effect. Setting portage nice to 19 will give everything else a higher priority, which you may not always want. You can always lower the nice of an inportant job. This seems like a better approach to me. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ansient
Guru
Joined: 22 Jan 2005
Posts: 445
Location: Argentina
|
| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 3:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| IvanYosifov wrote: | The idea I am trying to comunicate is:
The default nice ( 0 ) should not be altered unless you are noticing click-responce-lag or some other ill effect. Setting portage nice to 19 will give everything else a higher priority, which you may not always want. You can always lower the nice of an inportant job. This seems like a better approach to me. |
I think the best approach is to use "nice" from the command line, when desired. Perhaps we are actually in agreement? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
IvanYosifov
l33t
Joined: 15 Oct 2004
Posts: 778
Location: Bulgaria
|
| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 5:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
I think the best approach is to use "nice" from the command line, when desired. Perhaps we are actually in agreement?
|
Seems so.  We shouldn't let this spoil the controversy, though. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
statmobile
Apprentice
Joined: 16 Jul 2004
Posts: 286
Location: Chapel Hill, NC
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 2:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
| jlpence wrote: | | Another free tip: Next time grab the packages CD. I can go from beginning of install to playing around in KDE in about an hour using it. Takes a _LOT_ of pain out of the install. |
You know, I tried that recently, and while I was up and running on KDE in no time. I later wanted to tweak my system, like I expected to be able to do, based upon all my other Stage 1 installations. Yet the tweaking broke the system, although it even says in the manual that my tweaks probably would after going through a Stage 3 installation. It just seems to me that being restricted while running a gentoo machine contradicts this distro. Choose whatever it is you need or want, and forget the rest. With a little reading on the gentoo website, and a few searches in the gentoo forum, lastly submitting a few questions in the forum, you undestand so much more than a simple binary installation. I'll sacrifice that for a few hours of my computer doing the brunt work, and me just `complaining' that it takes too long
My only complaint is having to always completely understand everything in the /etc directory. Yet in reality, is that a bad thing?!!! I find myself explaining a lot of stuff to administrators as a user/casual hacker, and that's all I really want to be.
_________________
Comp Specs:
Asus A7V(rev1.02)|AMDXP2100+@1.7GHz|Creative SB128PCI|32MB NVIDIA/TNT2AGP|512MBPC-133 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cokey
Advocate
Joined: 23 Apr 2004
Posts: 3355
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 8:16 am Post subject: |
|
|
if you are getting the package cd, learn how to use the emerge -k first
_________________
https://otw20.com/ OTW20 The new place for off the wall chat |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
Gentoo Chat
