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Lokheed
Veteran
Joined: 12 Jul 2004
Posts: 1295
Location: /usr/src/linux
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 Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:41 pm Post subject: |
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| psyqil wrote: | | Lokheed wrote: | | You should probably read this entire thread then. You 1337 system is quite the contrary... |
Perhaps you should read up on his flags in the gcc manual?  |
Maybe I should use more smilies in my posts? Though I am anti-smiley...or maybe I just didnt find his post all that funny. Maybe I am not that big a geek <<insert winky smilie>> |
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JoeG
Apprentice
Joined: 30 Jul 2003
Posts: 179
Location: Kentucky, USA
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| Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2005 9:43 am Post subject: |
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| Joelio wrote: | This is my set of flags for a super 1337 system..
| Code: | CFLAGS="-O3 -mcpu=athlon-xp -pipe -fomit-frame-pointer -fnitrous-oxide-inject -fgo-faster-stripes"
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That's just wrong, man. I spewed Dr. Pepper all over my keyboard. 
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falcon_za
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 136
Location: Nara - Japan
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| Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 6:55 am Post subject: |
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I want to know what you guys think about my flags. Not if I should add something, but more like if I shoudl remove something. I use those because I was told it is safe. I just Hope it wasn't a ricer who told me that. I don't give a shit about +0.5% performance. I would be happy without any flags at all, but When I am told this does good without doing bad, then I give it a try. can you confirm that it actualy doesn't do anything bad?
CFLAGS="-march=pentium4 -O2 -pipe -fomit-frame-pointer"
LDFLAGS="-Wl,-O1 -Wl,--enable-new-dtags -Wl,--sort-common -Wl,-S" |
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TrueDFX
Retired Dev
Joined: 02 Jun 2004
Posts: 1348
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| Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 7:18 am Post subject: |
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falcon_za: Your CFLAGS look fine. If I were you I'd remove -Wl,-S from the LDFLAGS, however. portage normally strips already, and when it doesn't that's because stripping causes problems. That, and if you want your system to be well-supported, you shouldn't use LDFLAGS at all, but that's a different story  |
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falcon_za
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 136
Location: Nara - Japan
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| Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 9:17 am Post subject: |
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| TrueDFX wrote: | | That, and if you want your system to be well-supported, you shouldn't use LDFLAGS at all, but that's a different story |
Story I haven't heard of. can you tell me more about this? I understand rather well what is a CFLAG, even though I do not understand well the specific concequences of each individual flag. so with a bit of information on which is stable and which is not, I can quite easily decide what's good for me.
But LDFLALGS is more magical to me, so I got those since I read somewhere (can't recall where) that it was nice. I'll remove the LDFLAG you pointed out, but can you tell me why I should completely quit using LDFLAGs? what's wrong with them? |
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TrueDFX
Retired Dev
Joined: 02 Jun 2004
Posts: 1348
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ciaranm
Retired Dev
Joined: 19 Jul 2003
Posts: 1719
Location: In Hiding
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| Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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| falcon_za wrote: | | But LDFLALGS is more magical to me, so I got those since I read somewhere (can't recall where) that it was nice. I'll remove the LDFLAG you pointed out, but can you tell me why I should completely quit using LDFLAGs? what's wrong with them? |
Hint: if you don't know what something does, don't put it in make.conf.
LDFLAGS affect the linker. Specifying LDFLAGS in make.conf is known to break some apps, can potentially have security issues with s*id apps and doesn't make much of a difference to performance. Right now most developers consider any form of LDFLAGS setting in make.conf to be unsupported. There're vague plans to maybe find and test a sane set of options for global use, but if we do that then we'll probably just stick it in the default make settings anyway so that you don't have to worry about it. |
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duby2291
Guru
Joined: 17 Oct 2004
Posts: 583
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| Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 11:49 pm Post subject: |
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I hate to kick a dead horse, but..........
<<kick>> <<kick>>
| Quote: | | CFLAGS="-O3 -march=athlon64 -mtune=athlon64 -pipe -ftracer -funroll-loops" |
Are these flags considered safe? If not I'll remove the one's that arent. I've been haveing some problems compiling alot of program's from the beginning. Now I'm thinking my CFLAGs are to blame. |
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ciaranm
Retired Dev
Joined: 19 Jul 2003
Posts: 1719
Location: In Hiding
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| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 12:04 am Post subject: |
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| duby2291 wrote: | I hate to kick a dead horse, but..........
<<kick>> <<kick>>
| Quote: | | CFLAGS="-O3 -march=athlon64 -mtune=athlon64 -pipe -ftracer -funroll-loops" |
Are these flags considered safe? If not I'll remove the one's that arent. I've been haveing some problems compiling alot of program's from the beginning. Now I'm thinking my CFLAGs are to blame. |
Drop to -O2 and kill the -funroll-loops and the -ftracer, then rebuild your system from scratch twice. If you're still having problems then it's probably a genuine issue. |
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aethyr
Veteran
Joined: 06 Apr 2003
Posts: 1085
Location: NYC
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| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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| ciaranm wrote: | | LDFLAGS affect the linker. Specifying LDFLAGS in make.conf is known to break some apps |
Which apps would those be? The only one I've seen someone having an issue with is Mac-on-Linux, and I'm not even sure that was a real bug. |
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ciaranm
Retired Dev
Joined: 19 Jul 2003
Posts: 1719
Location: In Hiding
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| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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| aethyr wrote: | | ciaranm wrote: | | LDFLAGS affect the linker. Specifying LDFLAGS in make.conf is known to break some apps |
Which apps would those be? The only one I've seen someone having an issue with is Mac-on-Linux, and I'm not even sure that was a real bug. |
Well, it breaks toolchain for a start. Although, our toolchain people are overly nice and do some filtering for you. |
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vdboor
Guru
Joined: 03 Dec 2003
Posts: 592
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 10:00 pm Post subject: |
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| ciaranm wrote: | | Well, it breaks toolchain for a start. Although, our toolchain people are overly nice and do some filtering for you. |
What do you mean with the "toolchain" exactly?
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spb
Retired Dev
Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Posts: 2135
Location: Cambridge, UK
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| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 10:46 pm Post subject: |
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| vdboor wrote: | | What do you mean with the "toolchain" exactly? |
The toolchain is the set of tools used to build programs. Gcc, binutils, glibc, etc. The thing that you're screwed if you break. |
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truekaiser
l33t
Joined: 05 Mar 2004
Posts: 801
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| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 11:46 pm Post subject: |
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ciaranm i read you cflags perposal. and this is my opnion. you might as well loby the board to remove all user ablity to modify cflags.
a much better option is already in place. just ignore the nuts. |
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ciaranm
Retired Dev
Joined: 19 Jul 2003
Posts: 1719
Location: In Hiding
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| Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 11:53 pm Post subject: |
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| truekaiser wrote: | ciaranm i read you cflags perposal. and this is my opnion. you might as well loby the board to remove all user ablity to modify cflags.
a much better option is already in place. just ignore the nuts. |
Eh, naah, I left the sensible -march/cpu/tune stuff in. That's all that really matters. If I thought it was doable via profile then I'd suggest that instead, but there're way too many mips and x86 subCPUs for that. |
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truekaiser
l33t
Joined: 05 Mar 2004
Posts: 801
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 12:00 am Post subject: |
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the other option is still better. ingore the nuts.
put a nice page before it allows you to submit a bug saying if you have any of the X in you make.conf you are not allowed to submit bug reports.
basicly give support to those who want it and let those who don't do what they will without forceing packages to compile under sane flags just cause your too tired of sorting though the nuts. |
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ciaranm
Retired Dev
Joined: 19 Jul 2003
Posts: 1719
Location: In Hiding
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 12:10 am Post subject: |
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| truekaiser wrote: | the other option is still better. ingore the nuts.
put a nice page before it allows you to submit a bug saying if you have any of the X in you make.conf you are not allowed to submit bug reports.
basicly give support to those who want it and let those who don't do what they will without forceing packages to compile under sane flags just cause your too tired of sorting though the nuts. |
Tried that, didn't work. You can thank LoveChild and OneOfOne for that. |
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truekaiser
l33t
Joined: 05 Mar 2004
Posts: 801
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 12:14 am Post subject: |
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| ciaranm wrote: | | truekaiser wrote: | the other option is still better. ingore the nuts.
put a nice page before it allows you to submit a bug saying if you have any of the X in you make.conf you are not allowed to submit bug reports.
basicly give support to those who want it and let those who don't do what they will without forceing packages to compile under sane flags just cause your too tired of sorting though the nuts. |
Tried that, didn't work. You can thank LoveChild and OneOfOne for that. |
then you might as well replace portage with rpm. |
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spb
Retired Dev
Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Posts: 2135
Location: Cambridge, UK
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 12:17 am Post subject: |
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| truekaiser wrote: | | then you might as well replace portage with rpm. |
OK, now you're just not making sense. |
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ciaranm
Retired Dev
Joined: 19 Jul 2003
Posts: 1719
Location: In Hiding
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 12:17 am Post subject: |
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| truekaiser wrote: | | then you might as well replace portage with rpm. |
Uh, no. We provide you with choice where there is a sane choice to be made. -ffast-math is not a sane choice. |
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truekaiser
l33t
Joined: 05 Mar 2004
Posts: 801
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 12:50 am Post subject: |
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actualy i am.
your limiting choice. they choose to use those cflags, why isn't the point the fact is they can. if you take that ability away you might as well stop the whole point of gentoo. which is you make your own choices and change it to the father knows best distro's like red hat and suse. so to this point i do wonder why you want to limit choice just cause you can't stand a few nuts. ignore them and be done with it, they will eventualy find out they are at fault or move elsewhere. |
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ciaranm
Retired Dev
Joined: 19 Jul 2003
Posts: 1719
Location: In Hiding
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 12:56 am Post subject: |
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| truekaiser wrote: | actualy i am.
your limiting choice. they choose to use those cflags, why isn't the point the fact is they can. if you take that ability away you might as well stop the whole point of gentoo. which is you make your own choices and change it to the father knows best distro's like red hat and suse. so to this point i do wonder why you want to limit choice just cause you can't stand a few nuts. ignore them and be done with it, they will eventualy find out they are at fault or move elsewhere. |
Uh, we provide you with choice where it is sane to do so. |
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rhill
Retired Dev
Joined: 22 Oct 2004
Posts: 1629
Location: sk.ca
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 2:02 am Post subject: |
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bullshit.
freedom of choice is freedom to fuck up our systems if we so choose. please stop trying to protect users from ourselves, dad. just because you've decided something is "sane" doesn't make it law.
flag filtering definitely does have it's place. especially in the toolchain, which should never be build with any C/CXX/LD/ASFLAGS set. but everything else is fair fucking game until it is proven to break. i'm sick of this condescending "save-you-from-your-own-stupidity" attitude. we're not users verses develepers. we're a COMMUNITY, and i think some people need to have that drilled into their head.
feel free to toss away as many bug reports as you like, but force your world-view on the community and i think you'll soon find the community forcing right back.
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truekaiser
l33t
Joined: 05 Mar 2004
Posts: 801
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 3:14 am Post subject: |
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| dirtyepic wrote: | bullshit.
freedom of choice is freedom to fuck up our systems if we so choose. please stop trying to protect users from ourselves, dad. just because you've decided something is "sane" doesn't make it law.
flag filtering definitely does have it's place. especially in the toolchain, which should never be build with any C/CXX/LD/ASFLAGS set. but everything else is fair fucking game until it is proven to break. i'm sick of this condescending "save-you-from-your-own-stupidity" attitude. we're not users verses develepers. we're a COMMUNITY, and i think some people need to have that drilled into their head.
feel free to toss away as many bug reports as you like, but force your world-view on the community and i think you'll soon find the community forcing right back. |
exactly. just because your tired of the nuts here posting bad bug reports due to there own stupidity doesn't give you the right to force what you consider sane on everyone. if you are tired of see those bug reports then take a break from being a dev for awhile.
if i wanted a 'father knows best distro' i would of chosen suse or mandrake. both of which i liked before coming to gentoo and finding i liked the freedom here. |
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Athas
Guru
Joined: 04 Sep 2003
Posts: 394
Location: Brøndby, Denmark
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 8:03 am Post subject: |
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| truekaiser wrote: | | exactly. just because your tired of the nuts here posting bad bug reports due to there own stupidity doesn't give you the right to force what you consider sane on everyone. if you are tired of see those bug reports then take a break from being a dev for awhile. |
Have any of you ever considered that this might be a general emotion among the Gentoo developers, or that valuable developer time is wasted on bogus bug reports? Gentoo is about sensible choice. ciaranm spends a lot more time on these things than we do, therefore I assume that he is correct, when he states that there is a problem.
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