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ciaranm
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Joined: 19 Jul 2003
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 Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2005 5:35 am Post subject: |
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| iTux wrote: | Gentoo installed libdvdcss (which might be illegal in some countries) as a dep. Now this has been fixed I think.
Gentoo once had erotic WindowMaker theme (yes, it was done by mistake but the dev should check themes and ask other developers if can be added or not). This again might be illegal in some countries. |
Uhm, we don't ship libdvdcss or windowmaker. We just supply you with some scripts for compiling them. |
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asiobob
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 9:53 am Post subject: |
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A a piece of paper and a pencil, draw a straight horizontal line.
On one end is RMS, and on the other end is Bill Gates and co. What we have here is 2 extremes. I want to stay on RMS' half of the line, but not to close to the end.
Basically we have to realise somethings that will be a major part in linux acceptance (on the desktop at least) won't be free. ie Nvidia drivers. They won't be free even if Nvidia wanted them to be free (patents, NDA etc..). |
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Q-collective
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Joined: 22 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 10:31 am Post subject: |
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| ciaranm wrote: | | iTux wrote: | Gentoo installed libdvdcss (which might be illegal in some countries) as a dep. Now this has been fixed I think.
Gentoo once had erotic WindowMaker theme (yes, it was done by mistake but the dev should check themes and ask other developers if can be added or not). This again might be illegal in some countries. |
Uhm, we don't ship libdvdcss or windowmaker. We just supply you with some scripts for compiling them. |
They are on the portage mirrors, right?  |
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ciaranm
Retired Dev
Joined: 19 Jul 2003
Posts: 1719
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| Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2005 10:59 am Post subject: |
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| Q-collective wrote: | | ciaranm wrote: | | iTux wrote: | Gentoo installed libdvdcss (which might be illegal in some countries) as a dep. Now this has been fixed I think.
Gentoo once had erotic WindowMaker theme (yes, it was done by mistake but the dev should check themes and ask other developers if can be added or not). This again might be illegal in some countries. |
Uhm, we don't ship libdvdcss or windowmaker. We just supply you with some scripts for compiling them. |
They are on the portage mirrors, right? |
Yeah, neither are marked fetch restrict. AFAIK, though, source code and mathematical formulae aren't themselves illegal (except in France, and then only for crypto stuff). |
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azp
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Joined: 16 Nov 2003
Posts: 298
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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| moocha wrote: | | If someone had the chance to change history back in 1914 by killing a certain Adolf, I'd say that would be ok, even though I'm not pro murder, or even pro death penalties. |
This was written a while ago, but I still have to respond. Now, I don't want to get all mushy and left-winged (in sweden it would be called left-wing, I don't know about other contries. Some would also call it humane and proactive (non destructive) measurements.) on you, but wouldn't it be better to travel back in history and change the life of a certain Adolf instead? To examine what in the world could bring a person to do such deeds he would commit later in his life, and in every way possible try to make a human being out of him?
Just a thought...
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eltino
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Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 44
Location: Martinique
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| Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 2:02 am Post subject: |
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| azp wrote: | | moocha wrote: | | If someone had the chance to change history back in 1914 by killing a certain Adolf, I'd say that would be ok, even though I'm not pro murder, or even pro death penalties. |
This was written a while ago, but I still have to respond. Now, I don't want to get all mushy and left-winged (in sweden it would be called left-wing, I don't know about other contries. Some would also call it humane and proactive (non destructive) measurements.) on you, but wouldn't it be better to travel back in history and change the life of a certain Adolf instead? To examine what in the world could bring a person to do such deeds he would commit later in his life, and in every way possible try to make a human being out of him?
Just a thought... |
Man, this is what I call useless and futile left-wingism... Outright ridiculous
Cheers.... |
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Aynjell
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| Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 2:18 am Post subject: |
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I have similar ideals to Stallman in regards to software. I can't morally release or even suggest closed code, as it hinders progress. One can't take his software from platform to platform when it's closed as easily as one can when it's open. Furthermore, software develops quicker and more appreciably when open. I will always beleive closed code will be inferior to open code.
The reason I don't use windows and other closed software on the other hand, is Digital Rights Management, which is usually only feasable in closed software, another reason I hate closed code. Stallman's okay in my book, and I'd love to have the oppurtunity to dig into his melon and grasp more of his ideals, because I'm sure he has more reasons past this for what he beleives.
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psyqil
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EzInKy
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Joined: 11 Oct 2002
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Location: Kentucky
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| Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:12 am Post subject: |
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| Aynjell wrote: | I have similar ideals to Stallman in regards to software. I can't morally release or even suggest closed code, as it hinders progress. One can't take his software from platform to platform when it's closed as easily as one can when it's open. Furthermore, software develops quicker and more appreciably when open. I will always beleive closed code will be inferior to open code.
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I can think of one good reason to use closed source...reverse engineering. How would anyone know if it is worth the bother to reimplement programs if they have never used them?
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cokehabit
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| Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 12:20 pm Post subject: |
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Stallman is out of touch, his intentions were good but he decided to take them too far.
But I do agree with the ability to be able to say you dont want certain packages on your system |
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freelight
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| Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Stallman was out of touch from day one. His ideals about software (and the world in general) were unrealistic and impractical. He made them work anyway. He actually managed to get some people together and write GNU. Stallman proved that any ideal, regardless of how utopian or out of touch with reality, can be made into a workable idea and solid plan. It's good that after all we've achieved, he's still staying on the fringes and pushing forward. We need our idealists. |
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Aynjell
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| Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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| freelight wrote: | | Stallman was out of touch from day one. His ideals about software (and the world in general) were unrealistic and impractical. He made them work anyway. He actually managed to get some people together and write GNU. Stallman proved that any ideal, regardless of how utopian or out of touch with reality, can be made into a workable idea and solid plan. It's good that after all we've achieved, he's still staying on the fringes and pushing forward. We need our idealists. |
That is a very good point. Stallman doesnt' want to face the facts, and after all, he shouldn't. Unlike the rest of the world, he wants what's best, not what works.
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groovin
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| Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 9:01 pm Post subject: |
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are you sure he didnt say "Ututo" instead of "Ubuntu"?? i read an interview he did and he said he gives ututo the thumbs up because everythign in that distribution is GPL and completely (or nearly) free. if you look on the ututo homepage, https://www.ututo.org/xp/modules/news/ you will see stallman's pictures with the ututo guys.
(sorry if someone else pointed this out, i didnt read every post.) |
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Shadow Skill
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Joined: 04 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 9:27 pm Post subject: |
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| freelight wrote: | | Stallman was out of touch from day one. His ideals about software (and the world in general) were unrealistic and impractical. He made them work anyway. He actually managed to get some people together and write GNU. Stallman proved that any ideal, regardless of how utopian or out of touch with reality, can be made into a workable idea and solid plan. It's good that after all we've achieved, he's still staying on the fringes and pushing forward. We need our idealists. |
Out of touch with reality..you mean like the various control systems where the people at the top of the pyramid actually get progressively less intelligent than those at the bottom? [What passes for human social structure.] Or systems that value illusory concepts like money and consciously hinder themselves based on the lack of an entirely non existant resource [money] instead of something based on actual resources available...The world is so practical riiiiiggghtt.
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psyqil
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| Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:02 pm Post subject: |
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| groovin wrote: | | (sorry if someone else pointed this out, i didnt read every post.) |
 12 hours ago, five posts above yours. Including links...  |
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freelight
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Joined: 12 Jun 2004
Posts: 295
Location: NYC, NY, USA
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| Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Shadow Skill wrote: | | freelight wrote: | | Stallman was out of touch from day one. His ideals about software (and the world in general) were unrealistic and impractical. He made them work anyway. He actually managed to get some people together and write GNU. Stallman proved that any ideal, regardless of how utopian or out of touch with reality, can be made into a workable idea and solid plan. It's good that after all we've achieved, he's still staying on the fringes and pushing forward. We need our idealists. |
Out of touch with reality..you mean like the various control systems where the people at the top of the pyramid actually get progressively less intelligent than those at the bottom? [What passes for human social structure.] Or systems that value illusory concepts like money and consciously hinder themselves based on the lack of an entirely non existant resource [money] instead of something based on actual resources available...The world is so practical riiiiiggghtt. |
I'm aware of everything you've mentioned and more. That's why people like Stallman are around in the first place. However, on a small scale, it would have been more practical for him to cave and give into compromises, abandon idealism like most people do when they "grow up", and get with the program. What Stallman did was a good idea in the long term, but in the eyes of short-sighted capitalist society, is very much impractical. "Looking out for #1" and all that. |
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Aynjell
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| Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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| freelight wrote: | | Shadow Skill wrote: | | freelight wrote: | | Stallman was out of touch from day one. His ideals about software (and the world in general) were unrealistic and impractical. He made them work anyway. He actually managed to get some people together and write GNU. Stallman proved that any ideal, regardless of how utopian or out of touch with reality, can be made into a workable idea and solid plan. It's good that after all we've achieved, he's still staying on the fringes and pushing forward. We need our idealists. |
Out of touch with reality..you mean like the various control systems where the people at the top of the pyramid actually get progressively less intelligent than those at the bottom? [What passes for human social structure.] Or systems that value illusory concepts like money and consciously hinder themselves based on the lack of an entirely non existant resource [money] instead of something based on actual resources available...The world is so practical riiiiiggghtt. |
I'm aware of everything you've mentioned and more. That's why people like Stallman are around in the first place. However, on a small scale, it would have been more practical for him to cave and give into compromises, abandon idealism like most people do when they "grow up", and get with the program. What Stallman did was a good idea in the long term, but in the eyes of short-sighted capitalist society, is very much impractical. "Looking out for #1" and all that. |
I'm with this guy.
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vipernicus
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bubbl07
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| Posted: Sun Oct 29, 2006 2:29 am Post subject: |
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| senectus wrote: | | RMS is a powerhouse of philosophical brilliance.. I just think that he's come too early |
That's something we call "premature communication" .
| ASIO_BOB wrote: | A a piece of paper and a pencil, draw a straight horizontal line.
On one end is RMS, and on the other end is Bill Gates and co. What we have here is 2 extremes. I want to stay on RMS' half of the line, but not to close to the end. |
I don't think that's a fair statement to make. Sure they may be on completely opposing ends of a given spectrum, but there are also many values that both camps hold that are similar within a given scope (i.e. some of the arguments that pjp has made). |
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