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mako
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PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2002 7:48 am    Post subject: Japanese ebuild. Reply with quote

I'm making Japanese ebuild.
I want to modify ebuild which portage tree has already had.
And I want to use 'use japanese'.
Is this the strange method ?

I'm sorry in poor English.
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klieber
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PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2002 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As far as I know, Gentoo does not support foreign languages yet. There also doesn't appear to be a "japanese" USE flag. (it's not listed in /usr/portage/profiles/use.desc)

--kurt
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PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2002 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gentoo can do foreign languages, just do export LC_ALL=ja_JP and it will be in Japanese. I assume the original poster wants to add ebuilds for things like a Japanese XIM, and was asking for a new use flag to be added.
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lk42pro
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PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2002 3:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anonymous wrote:
Gentoo can do foreign languages, just do export LC_ALL=ja_JP and it will be in Japanese. I assume the original poster wants to add ebuilds for things like a Japanese XIM, and was asking for a new use flag to be added.

what about Chinese?
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tsuru
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PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2002 3:53 pm    Post subject: nan no japanese ebuild Reply with quote

kanji to kana inputto ebuild desu ka. application no naka de kanji to kana display ga hoshii desu ka. mou Gentoo wa display wo dekimasu ga inputto wa dekimasen. watashi mo kanji-kana inputto ga hoshii desu ga watashi no nihongo no yomikata wa chotto.... :)

demo maka-san no package wo tsukuta toki minna ni "japanese is available for USE=" ni itte to omoimasu. minna wa package wo tsuru toki ebuild no naka de "DEPEND= "japanese? (<koko ni mako-san no package wo kaku>)"

nihongo ga jouzu ja nai gomen. :)

jaa, eigo:

For those that don't speak japanese :) I suggested (at least I hope, my japanese is not very good yet) that mako make his package and then let everyone know that they can use "japanese" as a USE= variable for both package dependencies and shell environment. With my understanding of Gentoo thus far, that seems like the right way.
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klieber
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PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2002 4:14 pm    Post subject: Re: nan no japanese ebuild Reply with quote

tsuru wrote:
For those that don't speak japanese :) I suggested (at least I hope, my japanese is not very good yet) that mako make his package and then let everyone know that they can use "japanese" as a USE= variable for both package dependencies and shell environment. With my understanding of Gentoo thus far, that seems like the right way.


I'm pretty sure that support for a specific USE variable has to be built into the portage system. (meaning you can't arbitrarily set your own USE variables and have them work correctly.) Could be wrong, though.

The thing is, if it's used as a USE variable, then it really should work everywhere meaning that, in addition to the one application, all other applications should also install w/ support for Japanese.

If some packages work with certain USE variables and others don't, then that makes the system as a whole unreliable. Not sure that's such a good idea.

However, I imagine that the Gentoo development team would be very interested in hearing from folks who wanted to contribute to an internationalization effort.

--kurt
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mako
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PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2002 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for replies.

I know 'LC_ALL=ja_JP '.
But there is the software which can't use Japanese only with this.
For example 'less'.
Therefore, I want to modify 'less ebuild' for Japanese patch.

Code:

if [ "`use japanese`" ]; then
     gzip -d ${DISTDIR}/${P}-iso254.patch.gz | patch -p1
fi


I think that there is one more method.
A japanese directory is made, and the ebuild is put with another name (for example, jless) in that.
That is being done so with FreeBSD ports.

But,I will be happy when it is only specified with 'Use japanese' at /etc/make.conf and 'less' for Japanese is installed automatically.
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tsuru
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PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2002 7:23 pm    Post subject: Re: nan no japanese ebuild Reply with quote

klieber wrote:

The thing is, if it's used as a USE variable, then it really should work everywhere meaning that, in addition to the one application, all other applications should also install w/ support for Japanese.

If some packages work with certain USE variables and others don't, then that makes the system as a whole unreliable. Not sure that's such a good idea.

However, I imagine that the Gentoo development team would be very interested in hearing from folks who wanted to contribute to an internationalization effort.

--kurt


I agree that having a USE variable that would add japanese support everywhere needed would be optimal. I emphasize needed because not all programs need to handle foreign language input and/or processing. Now what mako is asking for seems to be a japanese equivalent to the nls USE option. For me that raises the question(s): Is nls only for adding display support for other languages in GUI applications? Regardless it does seem that some major engineering of some sort needs to be performed. I'm sure we can look to other distributions/*nixes, like Debian or FreeBSD, that have done a lot of work in this area already to get inspiration. In true Gentoo fashion, it would be awesome for whatever system is built from said engineering be able to handle other languages beyond japanese as well.

mako-san I would encourage you to get on irc.openprojects.net and see what drobbins thinks. If you are dedicated to getting this done, I would think drobbins would be receptive to the idea of getting some non-roman alphabet internationalization support going in gentoo. I can't say that I'm any sort of developer but I am an extremely interested user who would like to help out in any way possible.

--charlie
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neko
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PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2002 4:04 am    Post subject: Japanese Support Reply with quote

I am also very interested in Japnaese language support under gentoo and linux in general....
I have never quite figured out all the details of how it is handled under linux and Japanese language support is the main thing that keeps me from getting rid of my windows partition entirely (win2k has very nice/clean Japanese support)
There are a few main uses that are most important to me and if I was able to figure out how to get Japanese working for these purposes, I would be very happy :D :
* msn messenger: I would like to be able to use Japanese in GAIM's msn messenger plugin
* writing email: mozilla seems to display foreign languages beautifully by default, but I would like to be able to compose messages as well
* looking up kanji: when writing Japanese compositions I normally use Word to look up kanji as I am writing, some sort of equivalent way under linux would be nice (although word brings up a very nice list of defintions as well as the kanji)

Any information about suggess using Japanese under linux in general, or specifically gentoo would be greatly appreciated...
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PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2002 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a beta version of the Japanese ebuild made by Einar K a few months ago, but I don't think he is working on it anymore...

If anyone would like it to try it out, send me an email and I will forward it to you. It is ok, but kanna is not working and it only supports input in emacs at the moment, which I really don't like.

Ideally, an ebuild incorporating canna, ktern and kinput would suit the needs of most, giving them the basis on which to use and install other Japanese apps. I would love to put this all together myself, however the whole ebuild process seems a little cryptic to me :oops: .

Let me know if I can help out with testing or in any other way, as I am one of the anxious ones awaiting a working English/Japanese environment, and would like to contribute where I can.
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Einar Karttunen
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PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2002 12:26 pm    Post subject: The state of japan-test ebuilds & use variables for japa Reply with quote

Hello

I have not worked on the japan-test ebuilds for a while
because other projects have taken too much time.
You can get the most recent version from:
http://www.helsinki.fi/~ekarttun/japan-test-latest.tar.gz
Currently I need someone to look at post install canna
configuration. kinput2 is on my todo list.

There was a discussion on the use of use variables
in a gentoo-dev thread:
http://lists.gentoo.org/pipermail/gentoo-dev/2002-May/011838.html
no definite conclusion was reached, but I think the
best solution would be to adopt standardized country
codes as use variables even if most of them will remain
unused.

If you want to chat with me join #gentoo.ja@OPN or
send a message to gentoo-dev/user.

- Einar Karttunen
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mihochan
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2002 2:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was working towards ebuilds for canna and kinput2 but got stumped right at the beginning.
I wasn't able to get 'canna' to compile properly at all. 'Canna' uses something called 'imake' to configure the Makefile and that seemed to be at fault.
Unfortunately, I don't know anything about 'imake' to even begin to look into it.
Anyone else had experience here?

Tom
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BillyD
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2002 3:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mihochan, imake resides in /etc/X11R6/bin, and is invoked via the command xmkmf, also in /etc/X11R6/bin - you will either need to specify the absolute path or add it to your profile. I am using the ebuild of canna and kinput2, provided by Einar Karttunen. They both install fine (error free) however the configuration still needs work. I have managed to get kinput2 to connect to the cannaserver, however am stuck there at the moment.

See further up in this thread for the address where he has hosted the ebuilds and try them out if you like.
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mihochan
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2002 3:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It complains that canna is not found.
How do I alter the package mask to enable it?

Tom
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mihochan
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2002 3:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I tried compiling 'canna' with 'ebuild' but this fails saying,

make: *** No rule to make target `cleandir'. Stop.

!!! ERROR: The ebuild did not complete successfully.
!!! Function src_compile, Line 4, Exitcode 2
!!! (no error message)
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BillyD
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2002 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As these packages are not in the "official" mask - you need to install it with the following command:

$ebuild canna.x.x.x merge

You need to specify the path to where you extracted the files - eg: ebuild /home/mihochan/japan-test/canna/canna.x.x.x merge.

Easier to just cd to the directory where the ebuild files are.

Good luck - Einar (the creator of the ebuilds) has an IRC channel on Open Projects set up - #gentoo.ja - you may be able to catch him there if you have any questions.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2002 11:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see that this post is almost a month old. Don't know how many of you know it, but there is now an unofficial canna and kinput2 ebuild.

There are problems with the kinput2 ebuild, or there were a week or so ago (I'm in an Internet cafe in Hiroshima, and have only had occasional Internet access--so I have not kept up with it.)

Interested parties can go to my page at
http://home.nyc.rr.com/computertaijutsu/jpninpt.html and look at the bottom section which covers Gentoo and has links to the ebuild--although Ryan's canna ebuild was made official, the kinput2 one that I have looks for canna in app-misc, rather than where the official ebuild puts it--there are more details on my page, including the problems--basically, if you install the two ebuilds right after installing X, you shouldn't run into difficulties, however

Scott
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BillyD
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 3:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the heads up Scott - I installed the kinput2 ebuild and now have Japanese input working well (in KDE). I do have a problem with gnome applications though - but I think it is possible because I do not have the locales-ja package installed for glibc...I can only find rpm's for it.
I don't suppose anyone is aware of where the source files for the locales can be located?
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rac
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 3:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BillyD wrote:
I don't suppose anyone is aware of where the source files for the locales can be located?

If USE nls is defined, all the locales should be built when you compile glibc, so you should have them. I don't use GNOME, so I can't speak for it, but I am using XEmacs + canna quite happily under E.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 4:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks rac, I will have to check it out once I get home. I don't use gnome too much either, but there are a few programs I would like to get running (gjiten being the main one) with Japanese input support. So far, it works fine in KDE.
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scottro
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 4:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A few further developments here--they're covered on my page as I'm informed about them, but Ryan's gotten so busy, he doesn't always keep me up to date.

Both kinput2 and canna are now in the ebuilds. The only way I've gotten it working after installing KDE was uninstalling X
Code:

emerge -C xfree

Then, removing /usr/X11R6
Code:

rm -rf /usr/X11R6


As I use fluxbox, which puts things other places, this hasn't caused any problems for me, however, it would, of course, if you had your KDE set up nicely.

Another coder is also looking at it and has some ideas--it can also be emerged specifying Freewnn rather than canna now (details also on my page) but as I haven't used Freewnn I've been sticking with canna.

Anyway, even if it's not perfect, I think Ryan's done a great job. FWIW, if I use that langx script I mention on my page, I can easily input Japanese in things like xchat--my wife's even able to use Mozilla for her email now, which is handy, since, as her laptop got stolen, every time she wanted to do email, I had to reboot into Windows.

Scott

Scott
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BillyD
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 6:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I merged the kinput2 and canna ebuilds after X and KDE and it worked fine. I was a little worried that it wouldn't work after reading on your page that is caused problems, but so far, so good. I am not able to input Japanese into Xchat however, it crashes X everytime once I hit space after choosing which kanji I want..
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scottro
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 6:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's good to hear. I wonder if Ryan's done some work on it. I haven't
had any trouble with xchat. I'll drop him a line and see if he's made
some alterations. I'm not going to add your success to my page yet,
though, it might be that you just got lucky. :)


Thanks

Scott
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scottro
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good news folks--the qt or kde or whatever problem it was seems to have been resolved as of early July. Got an email from Ryan tellling me that another gentleman had worked on it as well (the name escapes me at this iinstant, but the name is listed in the canna ebuild's changelog.)

So, first make sure you have a fresh ebuild
Code:

emerge --clean rsync

Then, (assuming you're going to use canna, just emerge it
Code:

emerge kinput2

This will, as a default, also install canna--you can specify FreeWnn if you prefer, with USE, see my page for the exact details.

As for the xchat problem...I tested this last night, taking a fresh install and putting in KDE then kinput--I didn't have any trouble with xchat, so perhaps that's just one of those oddball glitches.

Scott
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BillyD
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2002 1:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Heya Scott,

Just thought I would let you know (if you are interested), the problems I was having with xchat and other gnome apps was not due to a glitch, but human error :oops: .

With KDE apps, I get the text displayed after hitting enter once I have chosen which characters to use, but with gnome apps I found that I actually need to click with the mouse in the text area after selecting kanji to get it to display.

I didn't realise I needed to exit kinput2 with shift-space after inputting text, I was closing it with the mouse (on the "x"), which caused KDE to crash with gnome apps.

Now that I have figured all this out, it is working perfectly in KDE with both gnome and KDE based apps.
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