desktop / window manager - what's the diff?

[thekillerbean]

i'm quite new to the linux desktop/window management stuff and i'm a little confused as to what each does - is a desktop manager the same thing as a window manager? if not, what are the main differences?

if the explanation is a long one and someone here knows of a really good newbie friendly site that explains all the differences, i'd be glad to go do some reading. however, if the explanation is a short one, then please post right here.

much obliged!

[Dolio]

If you want a brief description...

A window manager generally handles less stuff than a desktop manager does. For example, I use the enlightenment window manager. It draws the borders around the windows, and handles stuff like minimizing, maximizing and resizing the windows. It also handles switching between virtual desktops (you have 4 of them by default in most of the window managers I've tried).

Desktop managers do a lot more. Take Gnome for example (I'm more experienced with it, although I don't actually use it). Gnome includes Nautilus, which draws stuff on the "desktop", like icons and stuff. Enlightenment doesn't do that (currently). Nautilus is also a graphical file manager, so you can do stuff to files (like in Windows explorer). Gnome also integrates GTK+, which is a whole graphical toolkit. Gnome has tools for customizing all sorts of aspects of how your programs behave (like how all the little widgets look, rather than just the widgets on the toolbar).

So, I guess to compare it to Windows, a window manager would be the part of Windows that helps to draw and position the actual windows on the screen, while a desktop manager would be more like windows explorer + IE + the help system + Media Player + ...

Hope that helps. I may not be explaining it as well as you'd like. If not, hopefully someone else will.
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[thekillerbean]

so, do i need both of them to have a fully functioning gui or can i use one or the other? for instance, if i install the gnome desktop manager, do i then have to turn around and install a window manager like enlightenment?

[mksoft]

I think X Window System Architecture Overview HOWTO will give an intersteing reading.

Explains Window Managers, Desktop Environments, toolkits and more.
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[thekillerbean]

this calls for some hot cup'a tea and a soft sofa - i'll be reading a while.

thanks.

[edit]
that was a mighty good read - it now makes sense. okay, let me see if i learnt anything:
i can choose to either have a window manager like enlightenment without a desktop environment, in which case, i may end up without a task bar at the bottom of the screen, right? or, i may opt to load gnome and have enlightenment run on top of gnome which gives me some additional functionality like a task bar - am i right? hope so!
[/edit]

[citizen428]

If you want some further reading this is IMHO a nice site covering the various WM and DE.

http://xwinman.org/

[thekillerbean]

thanks all those provided for excellent reading and learning. now i have emerge'd enlightenment. however, i'm still getting that ugly intial window manager (twm). what files do i need to edit to make this so!

thanks.

[line72]

all desktops will use a window manager. Gnome uses metacity, sawfish or enlightenment, and kde uses kdm. You can use a window manager by itself though

/Line72

[abhishek]

Just do echo exec enlightenment>~/.xinitrc If u wanted to use flux(the best IMO) thatd be exec fluxbox, For balckbox itd b exec blackbox.... Gnomewould be gnome-session and kde would be startkde.

[mksoft]

[Nebajoth]

You don't have to use any graphical frontend to Linux at all, you know.

( )

You're already at the console, the most powerful interface to the inner workings of your computer - why pollute that?

That said, I use a window manager. ( )

I very much enjoy all the *box windowmanagers. Fluxbox is the one I'm using now, however. It's a nice, clean, non-bloated interface that just happens to have a clock on a task-bar-like thinger on the bottom. Just enough like Windows to be comfortable, but cleaner than my winky on a day that my girlfriend is coming over and I might get some play.



You could also opt for a completely bohemian/minimalist WM, and emerge EVILWM! Evilwm is very very very sparse. It adds a one-pixel wide border to your windows and... well, that's it. No close, no minimize widgets - those functions are all carried out with keyboard commands. It's also got a neat little CTRL-ALT-# switcheroo function between virtual desktops, which makes for good interfacing with GUI programs (like Galeon, which you can FINALLY run fullscreen). I opted against it in the end, despite my absolute love for maximized browser windows, because it was too difficult (for MY limited brain, anyhow) to keep track of what program was on what virtual desktop, and thus had to scroll through each. Gr.. When someone makes an Evilwm offshoot that has transparency effects which allows you to see the virtual desktop "below" the one you're working on, I'll switch back.

Anyhow, why not just emerge a few and try them out?
Gnome2 is very pretty, as is KDE3.
Enlightenment 0.17 is going to be crazy! Rasterman is God!
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[thekillerbean]

[masseya]

echo simply takes the next set of characters and repeats it to the screen. The '>' symbol redirects this to the file that follows. In this case, ~/.xinitrc. You could simply use a text editor (I recommend vim.) to add this line to the end of the file yourself, but since it's only one line some people will use echo. The idea behind adding this line to your ~/.xinitrc file is so that when you login and type startx it will start the window manager that you specified. (i.e. fluxbox, blackbox, etc..)
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[Naan Yaar]

You may have missed out the "echo" part. This would try to exec enlightenment in your console session and, as a result, terminate the currently running shell session.

The final thing that an .xinitrc file should do is to exec, i.e., replace the shell with the program to be run, some application which will stay alive for the duration of the X session. When this program exits, startx will kill the X server and clean up.

[[UK]Superdude]

Also if that is just too painful I beleive that when u emerge enlightenment there is a script called enlightenment.install that will set E up as your default window manager.

Or you could open .xinitrc and look for the line with twm and instead replace it with enlightenment.

[thekillerbean]

[vash]

Alrite, I'm new here.

I emerge'd Gnome2 yesterday and prefer it a bit over KDE, although KDE feels a bit more polished. How can I determine which window manager I am using for Gnome? Am I running metacity, sawfish, etc? I've emerged both metacity and sawfish, modded my .bashrc reloaded gdm -- they look exact the same (either that, or I'm missing something completely).

vash

[mksoft]

grep the output of ps aux while logged in gnome to see which one is running, e.g:

[vash]

[mksoft]

Changing GNOME2 WMs has been discussed before in the forums.
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