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[SOLVED] Gnome-3.11: can't logout, sliders don't work, etc.
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NP_complete
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 9:52 am    Post subject: [SOLVED] Gnome-3.11: can't logout, sliders don't work, etc. Reply with quote

This is my first time installing Gnome 3 and Gentoo on a laptop. Gnome starts fine, but I cannot logout: clicking User -> Logout produces nothing. (No window pop up, the way it normally does this). That panel normally has two sliders - for sound level and screen brightness - but in my case, it has THREE, though none work, and I'm not even sure what the third slider is for. No Wifi expander either, so no way to choose a network. Btw, the Gnome does *not* freeze or visibly malfunction when I try to logout or move a slider, and I cannot really see any error message. Perhaps I'm not looking in the right places.

I initially emerged gnome-light but then unmerged it. I wonder if I'm inadvertently using some of its functionality. But the funny thing is: it was actually working better than the full version.

Many thanks in advance.


Last edited by NP_complete on Sun Oct 19, 2014 11:15 am; edited 1 time in total
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epsilon72
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you booting with systemd instead of openrc?

GNOME 3.12 requires systemd, and Gentoo will boot with openrc by default. Make sure you choose the GNOME systemd profile with eselect, and follow the wiki's systemd guide here:
http://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Systemd
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NP_complete
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 4:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NOW I'm feeling like a hillbilly. Since this is my first attempt at setting up Gnome 3 on Gentoo, I ended up mixing OpenRC and Systemd. No wonder things got hairy. Two follow up questions I have at this point are:

1. Can I still compile the kernel manually or must rely on genkernel-next?

2. Is it ok to disable OpenRC in the kernel?

Many thanks.
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snum
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 8:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not now. I use GNOME 3.12 without systemd.
epsilon72 wrote:
Are you booting with systemd instead of openrc?

GNOME 3.12 requires systemd, and Gentoo will boot with openrc by default. Make sure you choose the GNOME systemd profile with eselect, and follow the wiki's systemd guide here:
http://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Systemd
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snum
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 8:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NP_complete wrote:
NOW I'm feeling like a hillbilly. Since this is my first attempt at setting up Gnome 3 on Gentoo, I ended up mixing OpenRC and Systemd. No wonder things got hairy. Two follow up questions I have at this point are:

1. Can I still compile the kernel manually or must rely on genkernel-next?

2. Is it ok to disable OpenRC in the kernel?

Many thanks.


Hi!

Let me know the following information:
1. Your profile (run eselect profile list)
2. what gnome packages are installed?
3. Can you login in system by console
run Ctrl+Alt+F1 and type login and password (hark back - ctrl+Alt+F7)
4. ACCEPT_KEYWORDS USE settings in make.conf
Thanks.
P.s.: all works for me (gnome 3.12, sistemd, openrc on the stable branch)
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NP_complete
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 9:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Snum,

Thanks for help. Since I've probably made a lot of mess by accidentally mixing OpenRC and Systemd (per the original post), I will wipe everything clean and start from scratch. I will post it here if I'm still having problems. Two questions I have for you, though, are:

1. Is there a manual you are following to get Gnome-3.12 working without Systemd? If not, this may be a big request but perhaps you could write one up and post it some place for everyone to see?

2. Your response "Not now" refers to (1) or (2), or both?

Many thanks.
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snum
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NP_complete wrote:
Snum,

Thanks for help. Since I've probably made a lot of mess by accidentally mixing OpenRC and Systemd (per the original post), I will wipe everything clean and start from scratch. I will post it here if I'm still having problems. Two questions I have for you, though, are:

1. Is there a manual you are following to get Gnome-3.12 working without Systemd? If not, this may be a big request but perhaps you could write one up and post it some place for everyone to see?

2. Your response "Not now" refers to (1) or (2), or both?

Many thanks.


in earlier gnome versions we used openrc, then we used only sistemd,now you can use sistemd or openrc.
Yours system can have sistemd and openrc installed package at the same time
Sistemd does not work very well, so I use openrc again. The choice is yours.

For openrc you must have:
1. change profile (run 'eselect profile list' in terminal)
default/linux/amd64/13.0/desktop/gnome *

2. update make.conf('/etc' location for old stage or 'etc/profile' for new)
USE="... -systemd openrc ..."

3. use mask
In '/etc/portage/profile/package.use.mask' file add

'gnome-base/gnome-settings-daemon -openrc-force
gnome-base/gnome-shell -openrc-force'

4. check kernel(must be)
Gentoo Linux --->
Support for init systems, system and service managers --->
[] systemd
5. rebuild world.
6. reboot system.
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NP_complete
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2014 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Snum, can you please elaborate on the number 3? package.use.mask is nowhere to be found, not even the directory that supposedly contains it: /etc/portage/profile/ Should I maybe create them?

Also, openrc-force is a USE flag. Correct me if I'm wrong: by saying

gnome-base/gnome-settings-daemon -openrc-force
gnome-base/gnome-shell -openrc-force

we *disable* rather than enable it. Should it instead be

gnome-base/gnome-settings-daemon openrc-force
gnome-base/gnome-shell openrc-force

?

Many thanks.
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epsilon72
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your package.use.mask location is
Code:
/etc/portage/profile/package.use.mask

The profile directory and package.use.mask file aren't automatically created when you install gentoo/portage, so yes, you will have to create them.

Also, -openrc-force is correct. What you are doing is telling portage to mask the disabling (-) of that particular use flag, meaning that it should be enabled for that package all of the time despite what files in /usr/portage/profiles say. It seems like a backwards way of forcing a use flag but that's the way portage wants you to do it :wink:
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NP_complete
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

epsilon72,

So it *is*, in fact, possible to run a fully functional Gnome-3.12 with OpenRC? In your previous post, you were suggesting that Systemd is mandatory. I guess, "Gnome-3.12 requires systemd" is ambiguous. Requires as a portage dependency? Yes. Requires to function properly? No. Did I get this right?

PS Being able to run Gnome-3 without Systemd would be very nice. With Systemd, I can't get wireless (which I depend on for installation) to start on boot, and get a bunch of kernel log messages on console.
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epsilon72
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NP_complete wrote:
epsilon72,

So it *is*, in fact, possible to run a fully functional Gnome-3.12 with OpenRC? In your previous post, you were suggesting that Systemd is mandatory. I guess, "Gnome-3.12 requires systemd" is ambiguous. Requires as a portage dependency? Yes. Requires to function properly? No. Did I get this right?

PS Being able to run Gnome-3 without Systemd would be very nice. With Systemd, I can't get wireless (which I depend on for installation) to start on boot, and get a bunch of kernel log messages on console.


You're right, it is possible to run gnome without systemd. When I posted previously I had forgotten about the 'openrc-force' flag. I don't personally use it so I can't comment much on it. I looked at the ebuild for gnome-settings-daemon and it shows this ewarn if you enable the flag:
Code:
You are enabling 'openrc-force' USE flag to skip systemd requirement,
this can lead to unexpected problems and is not supported neither by
upstream neither by Gnome Gentoo maintainers. If you suffer any problem,
you will need to disable this USE flag system wide and retest before
opening any bug report.

Now, that doesn't mean it won't work if you use openrc - it just means that you're using gnome 3 in a way the upstream devs didn't intend.
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NP_complete
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, in a nutshell, it's a use-at-your-own-risk kind of thing. It sounds like the thing to do at this day and age is go down the systemd route, which is poorly documented and gives me nothing but trouble :( http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-998728.html?sid=791780b13d03ca3ade7bd9a859131f35
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snum
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NP_complete wrote:
So, in a nutshell, it's a use-at-your-own-risk kind of thing. It sounds like the thing to do at this day and age is go down the systemd route, which is poorly documented and gives me nothing but trouble :( http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-998728.html?sid=791780b13d03ca3ade7bd9a859131f35

Hi!
Sorry for the late reply. epsilon72 ​​said I wanted to answer. Thanks to him.
Each person has the right to make choices. I made ​​my choice.
Thanks.
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Leio
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 6:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

While you may get most things working with OpenRC, we do not test it.
Running GNOME-3.12 with OpenRC is not fully functioning. E.g, because we do not have a logind interface outside systemd yet, stuff like suspend from gnome-shell menu in all likelyhood won't work. Logout might not either, but not sure. I guess it can be an issue if you mix up systemd support in some gnome packages and running openrc; or running openrc without USE=openrc-force.
GNOME running on Wayland (upcoming 3.14 and onwards) will hard require logind, so currently systemd; but running on xorg-server will be kept for a while too.
There is some work ongoing on providing logind outside systemd by the BSD folks iirc. The linux systemd haters seem to just talk and spread FUD instead of doing such work long ago, as a certain subset of logind is really useful for desktops in fixing real issues that existed with consolekit. I believe that logind provider might be universal enough to use with OpenRC on linux too with minimal effort.
GNOME also to some degree requires since long time ago hostnamed, datetimed and localed interfaces which systemd provides, but for those we have openrc-settingsd, which provide those interface on top of OpenRC.

Though if you are not an unreasonable systemd hater, I don't see any reason to not use systemd. I believe Gentoo official wiki has numerous articles on how to migrate from OpenRC and so on. LennartP has also written over 14 blog articles on how to manage systemd in an advanced way, if you need fancy stuff.
_________________
GNOME team lead; GStreamer
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NP_complete
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Leio,

Of course I don't inexplicably hate systemd. In fact, I've gotten GNOME3 working. Most of it anyway. Still, this was a bit of a shocker in the beginning. Since this has all been resolved, I am marking the thread SOLVED.
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