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Pappy's Kernel Seeds Part V
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mackal
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 29, 2014 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So RIP kernel seeds I guess?
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aramis_qc
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 29, 2014 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No !

Anthony Pelaez from funtoo.org bought Kernel Seeds from pappy. It's a matter of time before updates be back.
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 29, 2014 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As a matter of fact, the site is sold. It is in flux, and I am awaiting contact from Daniel Robbins to transfer the domain name. Once that's done, then it will be up to the new owners of the site where it goes from here.

As for using seeds presently, they are still useable. The site is still up and running, even now.

Cheers,
Pappy
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rudregues
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2014 1:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pappy, your work really helped me several times last year, thanks! Let's see if the new owner of the site will update it.
Was searching today for 3.12.13 and found just up to 3.12.01.
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2014 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for the praise. As for what the new owner of the site is or isn't doing, I am no longer a part of it, so I am now on the outside looking in. If you wish to move forward using a seed, simply download the seed closest to your current kernel version, and run make oldconfig. That will set the seed to the latest kernel version. From there, you can use any of the other make scripts to do the final configuring, like always.

Cheers,
Pappy
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rudregues
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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seems like Funtoo devs are preparing material for seeds http://www.funtoo.org/index.php?title=Kernel_Seeds
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khayyam
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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pappy_mcfae ...

A somewhat belated *thank you* for the work you put into kernel seeds ... had somehow missed the above announcement until now.

I look forward to seeing what happens with the move, and hope that whoever is now at the wheel find time to further advance "Kernel Seed Settings" (absolutely my favourite part of kernel-seeds).

best regards ... khay
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't begin to express how happy I am that my project not only found favor, but found enough favor that it's been adapted. I, too, hope that the new page will succeed where I couldn't; in being able to keep up with the changes in the kernel settings and how they were used in Gentoo. Once I really began working on that side of things, I realized that I might have bitten a bit more off than I could chew.

Still, that page helped me a lot. That it will go on is perhaps the proudest accomplishment of my reality. Now, to conquer show biz (hehehe).

Cheers,
Pappy
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Orionos
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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2014 10:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, apart from the month+ old wiki page it looks pretty much abandoned to me. It was down for quite a while (Funtoo as well, provider trouble). But it hasn't seen an update since the November 28 one. Oldconfig still works for the current Gentoo 3.12.13, but as soon as they adopt 3.14, you suddenly have to answer three pages filled with questions. It's too bad, really. As a primarily Windows administrator I really don't know what most of those options do...
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 8:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's not a lot I can do about what is or isn't happening to the new site. It's no longer mine.

I can say that using make oldconfig to move up kernel family-wise usually requires only hitting enter, as most options default to no or off. If your .config works properly for your system, you don't need to add anything. Hitting enter will get you right through. If you do encounter a "Y", hit the question mark and <enter>. That will give you an idea of what the thing is you're using. As a general rule, if it is recommended for use, use it. If it has bad effects, stop using it.

For the most part, once your hardware is set, it is set. New kernel families always add new devices. Unless you've been specifically waiting for a certain driver for a certain machine, you aren't going to need any new hardware devices. While sometimes, new processes show up in the kernel that are necessary, it's not a common thing for those changes to even be in the realm of what you, as a user, can actually change.

Don't forget that anything you don't know about the kernel can be answered by googling the symbol in question. Sometimes, you only get standard help. Sometimes, you get an entire dissertation on the setting in question, including best practice settings. Also, consult any programs you might use that will require certain things of the kernel. Most packages that require certain kernel settings will make you aware of that at emerge time. Some packages will fail to build. Others will build, but will do so in a whiny fashion. In either case, set the kernel as needed, and those issues tend to go away.

While not everyone can know the entirety of the minutia associated with the modern computer, there are certain things that are as unchanging as you can get. Knowing the beast in a hardware sense is a good idea if you're planning to work with computer administration. Knowing only software is limiting.

Cheers,
Pappy
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Orionos
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PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I started out nicely, by Googling the options to read what they did (most stuff I didn't have a clue what it meant). But like I said, after number 35-40 you get annoyed and just hold enter until the prompt re-appears. Enough scrolling to fill a few pages.
I always figured you turned off stuff that was on by default to make the whole 'seed' thing more efficient. So the more I leave at default, the more removed I become from your 'ideal', so to speak.

So I should have the serenity to accept the N's that need no change, question and change the Y's that need it (like new drivers), and the wisdom to know the difference then?
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TomWij
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PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It can be a steep learning curve starting out with maintaining a kernel config; but you've got to start somewhere, once you're past that it can become easier over time.

What I did is start from upstream's defconfig, given I prefer working out my own kernel config over taking a preset; then, I went on to go once through the entire menuconfig (but I come from a Windows enthusiastic background; so, this includes some research online) and set it up for a lifetime to come. With kernel upgrades, I'm not too bothered running oldconfig; I just use my previous kernel config and let it take on the defaults for new matters. One thing to note is that new drivers often are modules; so, they only load on demand and don't change performance or reliability as they don't load. There are however a few other things that might change; for these, I once in a while just do a diff between an old and new config to see what has changed.

Let us take for example a diff between 3.14 and 3.15; that diff for me is only 620 lines, with only 74 removals and 131 additions (some removals and additions combine to changes) which roughly gives me something like an overestimated 100 kernel config variables to go through. Let's see ... "CONFIG_GENERIC_EARLY_IOREMAP=y" (menuconfig tells me my arch forces this enabled, so I can skip), "# CONFIG_EFI_MIXED is not set" (I don't use EFI, so I can skip), ... and so on; a lot of these, along the lines of EFI, you'll be able to tell what you want them to be by just seeing the kernel config variable. Some need a quick search or a bit more investigation, but in general it shouldn't be too much work to go through them every X months; especially since this investigation can be helped by looking into resources that tell you what's new and changed which also explain it to some extent.

For example you have http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTY2MjU already for 3.15 which gives a quick look for a yet-to-be-released kernel, but http://kernelnewbies.org/Linux_3.14 for instance goes into a more full detail through most of the new features and changes; I guess they'll create a Linux 3.15 entry, around the time that the new release happens.

An option you've skipped over is in general not going to drop your performance or reliability; so, trying to work on every option might not give you more benefit for the cost that you put into it. And in the case that you did skip over one or another option that did drop it, you've got a good reason to investigate further; my system works excellent for me, even when I didn't check my kernel config the last major releases. But who knows it might break soon; so, this reminds me of checking the new options sooner or later.

Given such a kernel config, I wouldn't consider a kernel seed (as my own specific work for my specific ssytem would become useless); they make more sense to me if you can start from them, like when you're new to Gentoo and someone tells you "you should look into the kernel seeds" or when your kernel and the defconfig is totally broken and a kernel seed appears to work. If the continuation of the kernel seeds succeed, it is nice to have that as that definitely helps out for a start; but in the lack thereof, it's not too hard to maintain the kernel config on your own. And if it is to some, we could work together to make the process of maintaining the kernel config across kernel upgrades easier; I'm pretty sure that besides the commands to run, there is still somewhat an undocumented area to explore and document.

It is an area that Pappy is particularly good at.
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pappy_mcfae
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PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes. Through a strange confluence of my reality, my knowledge of electronics and computers, as well as my love for getting people hooked on Linux, I became the defacto kernel configuration guru. Perhaps it was those thousand or more .configs I've generated in my time of running the site. Maybe it was making bug reports or hacking my kernel source to eliminate a built in one second delay that does nothing.

Since I have kept every .config I've ever generated, mine and those of others, I am left with a limitless supply of kernel configuration files, old and new, that are proved to have resulted in functional computers. When my old, reliable laptop died recently, I had a .config for this substitute system already stashed away and waiting. One funtoo install later, and that kernel's direct descendant (v-3.15_rc5) is making it possible for me to see and reply to this message.

While I have stopped working the site, I do still know how to set up kernels for those who desire me to do so. The past few weeks have been devoted to bringing the process a bit more in line with what's out there, and moving data around in my personal cloud system so that I have every bit of data I need from that old laptop ready to be accessed. Now that that's done, I am quite willing to do kernel configuration.

Since I am doing it as a individual, I request a five dollar donation for these services. While I will always do them for free, I don't think it's out of the realm of acceptable that the information I have garnered is worth something. For the user, I don't think that paying five dollars to diminish irritation is out of the realm of acceptable, either. If you are a business owner, and want to use my expertise, I ask for a minimum twenty dollar donation. You'll feel better, because you're paying a man for his time and effort on your behalf. I'll feel better, because as a struggling independent contractor, I need all the gigs I can get. Considering how much Microsoft is ripping people off for it's bug-ridden offerings, even businesses who splurge are still getting a better deal than anything left in the MS stable of "operating systems".

Post your requests here, or use the Gentoo private message system.

Cheers,
Pappy
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