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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Team,

I have
Code:
ar -> x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-ar
as -> x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-as
gcc-4.8.2 -> /usr/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/gcc-bin/4.8.2/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-gcc
ld -> x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-ld


x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-ar -> /usr/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/bin/ar
x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-as -> /usr/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/bin/as
x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-ld -> /usr/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/bin/ld


/usr/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/bin/ar -> /usr/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/binutils-bin/2.24/ar
/usr/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/bin/as -> /usr/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/binutils-bin/2.24/as
/usr/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/bin/ld -> /usr/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/binutils-bin/2.24/ld
thats the full chain of symlinks now.

As you see from my scrappy notes to self, it didn't start out that way. I assume that gcc-config wrote the chain of links.

-- Edit --

The HOWTO has been updated with comments from this thread.
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steveL
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2014 7:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NeddySeagoon wrote:
I'm also being encouraged to contribute to http://weaver.gentooexperimental.org/trac/gentoo-static/
Thats something else for me to learn.

Yes, you are, quite strongly :P I've put up a minimal front page, but if you could at least login, I can give you admin (and disavow all responsibility..;) ATM it's on me, and I don't feel comfortable with that, as I don't even run static-dev. Here's an intro but in use, I tend to just have the WikiFormatting page open in a browser tab.

You'll notice when you click the login url, that it redirects to https: so all communication as a user is done "securely" (including your uid and password, ofc.) The permissions may be a bit tight (i just copied the setup from another trac); as a rule we don't allow authenticated users to edit the wiki, to avoid spam (there's people who earn a living setting up accounts on websites, and spamming them with content if they're allowed.) So instead we have two other classes of user: bugger and developer.

A "bugger" is a trusted user, an informal bug-wrangler (as if you maintain anything, their job is to be a complete bugger to you, on behalf of the users, ;) and has more permissions on tickets, as well as reports, and of course are able to edit the wiki. "Developers" are report and wiki-admins (not site admins) etc.

The idea is that the wiki should reflect accurate content, so being able to edit it requires some input, such that we know we can trust whomever it is not to mess anything up on purpose. Mistakes always happen, but we need good-faith to even hope to sort them out, and we can't do that just on the basis of having an email acct somewhere on the web (which would leave us open to spam.) If you prefer, we can add "verified user", to allow editing without bug-wrangling ability.

"Bugger" is irreverent sure, but it helps to keep humour ime, especially when you're feeling a user is being a bugger to you: hopefully it'll help you remember that that's what they're supposed to do (and maybe you should think about recruiting them to help, instead of cursing their persistence about an unreproduceable bug for a use-case you can't even imagine. Preferably without sounding catty.) QA is not supposed to feel comfortable when you're messing up, only when you're taking care to do everything right, and that never lasts since no-one is perfect. So to my mind, might as well poke fun at it, to alleviate the stress.
Quote:
A warning to users. I'm a staffer, not a dev, so I'm learning to hack ebuilds as I go.
Maybe thats something else to do ... apply for my +w

++ And don't worry: we'll help :-)

Thinking on it, this might be a nice application of upatch ie: patching into a local overlay. So you could maintain a set of patches to ebuilds locally (auto-generated from the overlay to initialise, or when you add packages), written into your local overlay, and then push the result to gentoo-static. When a new version comes in, it can try the patch automatically, ie run after sync across the tree, and tell you which ones worked so you can review them, manifest, install and test; and which ones didn't. It's quite a small set of orthogonal ebuilds, so would make a good testcase.

KDE is a much bigger prospect, and also requires quite a lot of involved testing, which is why I've hung back on trying to implement upatch: I'd have to do both things at once, and kde-lean would be a fairly involved project on its own, requiring coordination and collaboration with others. If I had another user, especially one I get on with so well, and whom I defer to (which is rare, as you should know, by now;) it would be a lot more motivating, as the prospect is so much easier without worrying about kde-lean at the same time.

No worries if not, I'm sure I'll get round to it at some point (after I finish update --toolchain with perl, update my machine and the initscript patches, refresh the installer so I can reinstall my laptop, sort out a decent kernel mactab, and some patches to openrc, and my quizzes, and oh, didn't I have a real life somewhere about here..? ;) If anyone else can see a use for upatch, and will actually spend a bit of time on using it and feeding-back bugs, let me know, as I'd like to do it before I have to deal with an especially-grumpy C coder for several weeks; for the life of me, it doesn't seem very hard. (Bonus points for making an attempt at it yourself.)

You'll still have to learn to edit changelogs for us buggers to look at, though, Neddy ;-)
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creaker
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2014 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Code Listing 4.1: Setting make.profile
Code:
cd /mnt/gentoo/etc
ln -s ../usr/portage/profiles/default/linux/amd64/13.0/desktop make.profile


I think that make.profile sits at wrong place (should be /mnt/gentoo/etc/portage, not /mnt/gentoo/etc) and points to nowhere (target directory /mnt/gentoo/usr/portage/profiles/default/linux/amd64/13.0/desktop doesn't exists yet).
It should be somthing like
Code:
mkdir /mnt/gentoo/etc/portage
mkdir /mnt/gentoo/usr/portage/profiles/default/linux/amd64/13.0/desktop
cp -R /usr/portage/profiles/default/linux/amd64/13.0/desktop /mnt/gentoo/usr/portage/profiles/default/linux/amd64/13.0/desktop
cd /mnt/gentoo/etc/portage
ln -s ../../usr/portage/profiles/default/linux/amd64/13.0/desktop make.profile


The same for other links (ar, as, ld, nm, bash, make, awk) - they points to host system related executable paths, and they will point to nowhere when you will be chrooted since nothing will be mounted under /mnt/gentoo in chroot envitonment.
May be it worth to mention that these links should be created after chrooting (or, at least, with relative paths - ../../)

Am I correct or here is a misconception?
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

creaker,

Once you are in the chroot, the symlinks point to things inside the the chroot.

The absolute path /usr/portage/profiles/default/linux/amd64/13.0/desktop points to the host filesystem while you are outside the chroot and to the budding install once you are inside the chroot.
Its OK to create symlinks that point nowhere as long as you fill in the nowhere before you use them.

I'll look at the make.profile symlink. I's pretty sure it used to be in /etc at the same time that make.conf was there.
Maybe it got moved and I didn't notice.
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creaker
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, thanks for explanation, Neddy.

As for make.profile:
Code:
cr@localhost ~ $ ls -l /etc/portage/
total 32
drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 Feb 27 07:10 bin
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1491 Mar  9 19:19 make.conf
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root  630 Feb 27 07:02 make.conf.catalyst
lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root   59 Mar  9 19:25 make.profile -> ../../usr/portage/profiles/default/linux/amd64/13.0/desktop
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root  114 Oct 28 00:13 package.accept_keywords
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root  155 Dec  1 14:14 package.mask
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1177 Jan  3 21:20 package.use
drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 Feb 27 07:10 postsync.d
drwxr-xr-x 3 root root 4096 Feb 27 08:48 savedconfig

as far as I remember make.profile was moved to /etc/portage few months ago.
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Chiitoo
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

With regards to the symbolic links, yeah, I would have thought that direct links would have made more sense... Thanks for the comments on that.

I guess the final reasoning to the bounciness is still a bit veiled under some sort of mist, but it's probably not too thick to wade through.

creaker wrote:
as far as I remember make.profile was moved to /etc/portage few months ago.

Perhaps a bit more than few months ago.

Code:
$ eselect news list
News items:
[...]
  [15]     2012-09-09  (2012-09-09-make.conf-and-make.profile-move - removed?)
[...]

So yeah, it looks like it was moved at the same time as make.conf, although both locations still work. The new, under /etc/portage/, will be preferred if both exist.

I wonder how/why I have a news item from 2009, concerning generation 1 java set-up being deprecated, but then something like this was removed. Oh well. Not too important right now.


Some observations/comments I have forgotten to mention previously in this thread:

The laptop I've been testing on, didn't actually need a xorg.conf. I guess the auto-detecting of things in X has come quite the way, even if no udev is around. It does use the driver 'mouse' for the touch-pad, however, which I wouldn't mind if it didn't enable sending mouse clicks by tapping it... which just wont do, so I have a section to make it use synaptics instead.


The next thing wanting libudev seems to be media-libs/mesa. More precisely, DRI3 coming with 10.1.0. Hrm.

That seems somewhat odd after spotting this at mesa/dri-lists, which seems somewhat interesting at least to me, be it usable or not...


I should maybe be able to do more testing/fooling about now that I finally got distcc set up. \ö/

(Curiously, well, not too curiously, while setting distcc up, I noticed another INSTALL_MASK to be... installed. That is, /etc/systemd/... which it installs a file under... Sigh.)
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steveL
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chiitoo wrote:
The next thing wanting libudev seems to be media-libs/mesa. More precisely, DRI3 coming with 10.1.0.

Yay bug 1 is born ;-) I entered it using your nick 'Chiitoo', so if you login with that it'll know you, and we can sort out editing it etc, as needed.

Neddy mentioned it the other night, so i knew the error message. I'm not running static-dev, so won't be much use in future.

So to all: if you want it to work, and to keep working, get involved with feeding back to neddy so he can fix things quickly and get a buzz out of closing bugs (it's fun!;)
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Chiitoo
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh my.

'Tis an honour, regardless of what will come of it all. :)


Registration seemed to work, so I'm there, hopefully to be of use in some way(s).
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steveL
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Heh thanks Chiitoo. You should have wiki modify ability: try playing in the sandbox if you want, and add info you feel is useful to front page. Wiki create and delete are at Neddy's discretion, more than my job's worth to hand that out ;-)

@Neddy: man I'm really sorry, the git url I gave you is wrong for public (it's ssh):
Code:
git clone git://weaver.gentooexperimental.org/gentoo-static
..is the public one.
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Chiitoo
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Will do.

It's my first time on trac, but I've been editing some MediaWiki-powered pages since 2008 or so, and as such, the WikiFormat is not completely alien to me.

Probably. :D
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Anon-E-moose
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2014 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, question. What mounts devtmpfs? Udev or the kernel?

If I go with a static /dev do I have to remove the DEVTMPFS flag?

Edit to add: If I go with a static /dev do I have to create a modeline for my monitor (viewsonic 1080p monitor)
or will it be automatically set to the proper mode?
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Chiitoo
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2014 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anon-E-moose wrote:
Ok, question. What mounts devtmpfs? Udev or the kernel?

If I go with a static /dev do I have to remove the DEVTMPFS flag?

I believe you don't have to remove it. It actually helped me a bit in figuring out what I was missing when my i915 driver wasn't used, and terminal emulators would not work.

However, you'll probably not want it. I had my suspicions and thoughts about it, but I'll quote what was confirmed to me elsewhere, as it's probably way better than my ramblings:

NeddySeagoon wrote:
CONFIG_DEVTMPFS=y has the kernel populate /dev for you but with no udev, the permissions in /dev are left as the kernel created them.
You may not want that.

As CONFIG_DEVTMPFS=y gets you a dynamic /dev, its mounted over the top of your static /dev, which is therefore no longer used.

So yes, I would (and have) remove(d) it.

Anon-E-moose wrote:
Edit to add: If I go with a static /dev do I have to create a modeline for my monitor (viewsonic 1080p monitor)
or will it be automatically set to the proper mode?

I've yet to test on anything but a nearly 10-year old laptop, but I'd imagine something like that should be pretty well automagically detected too. As mentioned previously, I didn't need xorg.conf at all, which had me wondering if I did something wrong. That is excluding the use of the configuration file for the synaptics driver.


Haven't done much here for a while, other than figuring out minors and majors for audio device-nodes, so I've yet to do anything with the trac/wikki(s).

Sorry about that!
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anon-E-moose,

The kernel creates and mounts /dev if you have DEVTMPFS on.
When you set that on there will be a new option to mount it at boot. Choose that too.

Without udev, the contents of /dev will be left as created by the kernel.
Thats mode, owner and group. You may not like that.

A modeline for your monitor should not be required. Xorg gets your displays capabilities down the video cable and sets up the display driver to match.
udev is not involved.

Chiitoo,

Thanks for the mesa patch. I had fixed the build system to not test for libudev but not done the rest of the work.
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